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Fallout!! Herc Gives The Last HEROES Till Jan. 22 4.5 Stars!!

I am – Hercules!! HEROES 1.11 FAQ What’s it called? “Fallout.” Who’s responsible? Teleplay is credited to Joe Pokaski (“Crossing Jordan”). What does TV Guide say? “The heroes struggle to come to terms with the Texas tragedy; more is learned about the nuclear bombing predicted in Isaac's painting; Matt and Audrey (Clea DuVall) pursue a new lead in their hunt for Sylar; Niki makes a difficult decision, which will allow her to keep her family safe. Sandra Bennett: Ashley Crow. Zach: Thomas Dekker. The Haitian: Jimmy Jean-Louis. Ando: James Kyson Lee.” How do the heroes come to terms with the Texas tragedy? Nathan comes to Odessa, where Peter is being held on suspicion on killing Jackie the cheerleader. Matt and Audrey come to Odessa too, to investigate all the weirdness surrounding Jackie’s murder. Jack Bennet admits to Claire he knew about her superpower all along. Thanks to Eden, who is apparently pursuing her own agenda, Isaac comes to Texas and finally connects with a distraught Hiro and Ando. Why are Matt and Audrey still pursuing Sylar? Wasn’t he captured two episodes ago? He was, by Jack, Eden and the Haitian. But apparently the trio don’t work for anybody who’s talking to the FBI. Work for? Jack Bennet’s not the man in charge? He’s reporting to … somebody. He participates in a phone call early on telling him he is not permitted to destroy the captive Sylar. Who places the call to Jack? We don’t see or hear who’s on the other line. Are Eden McCain’s weirding-witch powers keeping Sylar from escaping? Apparently he is held in a room that somehow deprives him of his powers. We’re not told how it works, but I suspect that will change next month. Was Jessica smart to use a bullet to stop a man with Kitty Pryde powers? Jessica’s plenty smart. What’s doing with Mohinder? Not much. I think he’s only in two quick dialogue scenes. The first depicts him returning to his Brooklyn apartment and finding a note that ends, “Now get back to work. Love, Eden.” (Though it should be pointed out that Mohinder is not the man Eden kisses this week.) Does the ghost of Mohinder’s pop favor the younger Suresh with a few bars of “Major Tom”? The late Chandra Suresh remains wholly absent this week. What’s great? This being the last new episode before hiatus, we’re provided several fascinating new cliffhangers to stew over for the next several weeks. Invisotext engage. Eden makes a shocking decision almost certain to forever alter her role in the series. Isaac literally paints a memorably dire picture of Hiro’s future. Claire begins a chat with one of the last individuals you’d expect her to be chatting with. And Peter suddenly finds himself united at last with the entire legion of justice: Mohinder, Matt, DL, Micah, Niki, Claire, Nathan, Isaac, Simone, Ando and a very sad-looking Hiro. (I note that Jack, Eden and the Haitian are nowhere in sight.) What’s less-great? The Niki-Jessica-DL-Micah business has seemingly grown so detached from the rest of the story, one grows restless whenever we’re returned to it. How does it end, spoiler-boy? “Peter. Peter! Peter!! PETER!!!!” Herc’s rating for “Heroes” 1.11? ****1/2 9 p.m. Monday. NBC.





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Readers Talkback
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  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:06 a.m. CST

    bah

    by Mr. N

    humbug

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:04 a.m. CST

    Ah man I can't wait

    by Bean_

    I love heroes, along with everyone else at school. We had a drinking game going for the last few episodes: every mention of the word cheerleader, saving and world got a drink :D

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:06 a.m. CST

    which ones SPOLIER

    by s0nicdeathmonkey

    peter? i suck at names?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:20 a.m. CST

    SIXTH mufuckas!

    by Cruel_Kingdom

    just sayin

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:20 a.m. CST

    Peter is thrown into the future?

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    The cryptic spoiler in the invisotext makes me wonder how they can possibly unite all these characters quickly within one episode. So maybe Peter absorbs Hiro's power and finds himself in the future.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:20 a.m. CST

    Imagine that

    by Cruel_Kingdom

    A show about superheroes gets a 4.5 on this site, lol.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:59 a.m. CST

    Wasn't "Fallout"...

    by KnightShift

    ...the last episode of "The Prisoner"? If Hiro rips off Sylar's face and finds a gorilla underneath, I'm outta here.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 2:40 a.m. CST

    oh yes!

    by BadMrWonka

    tomorrow, bowling league championships (my team's undefeated, thank you very much), then TIVO's Heroes and Studio60...best day ever. oh wait, scrubs and the office are on thursdays now...it's close! bowling wins by a nose! (man this is a boring post)

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:26 a.m. CST

    That's it! BBC's "F Word" is now officially better...

    by Uncle Stan

    ...better than Heroes. ...and it's a cooking show.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:31 a.m. CST

    seems like this episode

    by roccotheripper

    could either be good or lame. i think it's just gonna be a set up cliffhanger episode in which we don't really see anything cool until the last 5 minutes.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:42 a.m. CST

    WHEN WILL THEY GIVE LANA LANG MORE SCREENTIME???

    by Shermdawg

    Clea DuVall is horrible.<br><br>Y'know why Matt doesn't read her thoughts all that much? It's because he can't take the bitch whining "I WAS MISCAST! I WAS MISCAST!!!"<br><br>And my guess on the invisotext spoiler, is the gathering is really a funeral, a funeral for Peter himself. But it'll be a time travel thing<br><br>Either that or "Haitian" is gonna get the boot. I mean, they didnt even give the guy a name did they?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 6:04 a.m. CST

    Your homework assignment over the winter break is

    by chrth

    To read "To Say Nothing of the Dog" by Connie Willis.<p> Here's the Amazon.com link: <p> http://tinyurl.com/yfe6rp <p> The paperback is about 500 pages long, but it's a quick, fun read that you should easily be able to complete by reading during the hour Heroes normally airs on until it (or 24) returns.<p> Now, why am I recommending this book? For those who missed the end of the last Heroes talkback, I believe that the theory of time that the show is using is similar to what's presented in this book.<p> (Even ignoring that, it's a great book)<p> There are also some serious implications if I'm right, and it's impossible to really discuss them unless you've read the book. And yes, I will be checking to see who has read it when Heroes returns (I will be re-reading it with a notebook open and a pen ready).<p> So what are you waiting for? Buy it! Add it to your Wish List! To quote Brent Sienna, "Fly Nerds, Fly!"

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 6:07 a.m. CST

    Regarding this episode ...

    by chrth

    I'm looking forward to Peter and Nathan boxing while having flashbacks to previous moments ... ending in an exhausted hug as the good times start to overwhelm the bad times.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 6:58 a.m. CST

    Who HRG is talking to

    by chrth

    My guess is ... Linderman.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 6:59 a.m. CST

    HRG's first name?

    by SenseiJJ

    Did you guys make up the name Jack Bennet? I don't remember hearing it on the show yet...

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:31 a.m. CST

    Hiro... I *am* your father...

    by ATARI

    LOL!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:33 a.m. CST

    The question about Linderman is ...

    by chrth

    Is he going to be a Kingpin-style character, or just a red herring? I guess if Eccleston is playing him, it'll be the former. Also, will he have "super" powers?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:34 a.m. CST

    "how VERY interesting it would be if she kissed Claire"

    by chrth

    ...I'll be in my bunk

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:40 a.m. CST

    Save the Cheerleader...

    by Prof. Brainiac

    While true that Peter saved A cheerleader, the real question is whether he saved the RIGHT cheerleader....

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:45 a.m. CST

    Time for a new name for the Metahumans.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    When will the "Heroes" get a name that reflects their Metahuman nature? When will Suresh program be explained? Will we finally see Sylar as the Telekinetic he truly is? And just how do you build a Mutant Faraday cage?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:47 a.m. CST

    Who'd you least expect Claire to talk to?

    by mbeemer

    Maybe her cheerleader friend who just got her skull opened?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:48 a.m. CST

    "And just how do you build a Mutant Faraday cage?"

    by mbeemer

    These powers have to have some kind of energy source. I think the Marvel site promo-ing the first "X-Men" movie explained it as a "power tap" that drew energy from another dimension. The "Faraday cage" blocks or jams the power tap (I guess).

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:51 a.m. CST

    chrth Re: Time Travel

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Dr.Who seems to cover Time Travel pretty well. And Heinleins All you Zombies.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:50 a.m. CST

    "Who'd you least expect Claire to talk to?"

    by chrth

    The last person you'd expect her to talk to is someone who didn't have a reason to speak with her--that we know of. If you eliminate the Pulp Faction/Legion of Neutral, Peter (Nathan as well?), Hiro, Ando, and Isaac (Simone as well?) ... that leaves Nikki, DL, Micah, Mindreader, Annoying FBI Chick, and Radiation Dude (Up and Let's Go!).<p> How about this: Annoying FBI Chick is Claire's Real Mother!<p> Nah, I'm going to go with Micah.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:52 a.m. CST

    EvilWizardGlick: There's different theories, though

    by chrth

    Compare Twelve Monkeys to Star Trek, for example. My point is that what I've seen in Heroes so far most reminds me of To Say Nothing of the Dog. It's not perfect, mind you (in the latter, Hiro never would've been able to talk to himself on the phone), but the ideas of self-correction and meta-forces in the book seem to correlate with things we saw in last week's ep.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:55 a.m. CST

    Mutant Faraday Cage

    by chrth

    Well, we know their powers are from within their brains ... so it must be something that suppresses brain functions. Maybe they have all the TVs set to Studio 60? <p> (Just kidding)

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:58 a.m. CST

    Eccleston

    by ZO

    is playing a guy named Claude. a wise and intense mentor to the heroes

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:06 a.m. CST

    ZO...

    by Abin Sur

    That makes better sense - Eccleston didn't strike me as a Las Vegas mobster type anyway.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:22 a.m. CST

    But did Hiro save the waitress and...

    by biggles2_22

    ...their child?!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:34 a.m. CST

    Eden is the..

    by Russman

    Bene Gesserit Girl. I'm trying not to read the ivisotext but I know I'll crack once I get into the office.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:40 a.m. CST

    The Niki/Jessica/DL/Micah storyline should be airlocked

    by SpyGuy

    As in, jettisoned out of. The show is called "HEROES," after all, not "VILLAINS."

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:40 a.m. CST

    "Villains"

    by chrth

    They're not Villains. Micah is innocent, DL is on the run from the law for a crime he didn't commit. Sure, Jessica committed it, but Nikki didn't. So it's really 2.5 Heroes, .5 Villains.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:42 a.m. CST

    Cliffhanger, Homicide style...

    by OhioBobcat

    I'd bet that since the sped up time scale of the "death" was due to contract difficulty, they'd want to leave the door... or in this case coffin... wide open for a plausible (ha!) return. So does anyone remember the season finale of Homicide when Andre Braugher had his stroke? The final shot was a fantasy (I don't know what it was exactly, I didn't watch regularly) of Andre in his coffin, shouting for someone to help him. I picture this episode ending similar, with the gathering being some sort of funeral/memorial when we the viewers will be shocked to all hell to hear the desceased - Clair? Nathan? - in voice over begging Peter for help. Then again, I never get these guesses right.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:43 a.m. CST

    How Shocking - 4.5 Stars

    by Itchy

    I mean, it's getting to be a very good program, but 4.5 stars ? IS that out of 4 or 5 Max - I can't recall ? Regardless, obviously the show knew what they were doing tossing out a throwaway line about the Alamo Drafthouse to get some free press. The aintitcool motto ought to be "For Sale". Just hold a press junket and fly Harry or Herc out there for a 30 minute fluff session with the stars and you're guaranteed a article a week blowing you for the life of the show !

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:46 a.m. CST

    chrth: Micah's not innocent

    by SpyGuy

    Little bastard used a broken pay phone without paying for it. Time to give that sumbitch the chair, ah reckon...

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:44 a.m. CST

    Itchy hasn't been paying attention

    by chrth

    Coax didn't have a weekly TB for Heroes until after Future Hiro showed up and the interest by the regular TBers ramped up to the extent that we were spamming other threads.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:12 a.m. CST

    Chrth - I'm just f-ing around

    by Itchy

    Frankly, this is just the kind of show AICN should be blowing. Superheroes ? Hot Chicks ? Time Travel and Serial Killers ? I'm there. The only weakness in this series is dialogue, and frankly, I think that's improving. Part of the problem of translating a superhero mythos to a weekly network show is that comic books are, by and large, written in an infantile and unreal way. It works in print ... but not so much in live action. I think as the actors have gotten more comfortable (and the audience more comfortable with the characters) the show is starting to round into a really slick, really interesting show. And kudos to AICN for pimping it. I'd much rather watch Heroes and BSG all night long than Law and Order: Supply Clerks.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:35 a.m. CST

    chrth Self correcting time lines.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    If we use the many Worlds theory then Hiro creates a new and different timeline every trip back. each timeline is seperate and distinct from his original timeline. Which makes Hiro more of a dimension traveller than a time traveller. Waitress was dying before Hiro met her. That was seperate and only revealed when Hiro travelled back. If Hiro returns to Ando in the original timeline waitress died by Sylar. If he returns to timeline two then waitress dies from the tumor. Hiro seems pretty weak on the timeline/alternate dimesion stuff. He is a comic buff and somewhat geeky, he should understand. Later on he gets it, or so it seems. But Hiro should have no problem talking to or even meeting himself. If we assume time as circular meeting himself has no causal effect. The very fact of the meeting itself is proof it should have happened. Even if Hiro revealed all he knew it would still have been proof it was "destined" to happen. That applies to your theory as well. The big and actual problem is does Hiro create seperate timelines that exist as whole universes. Those universes can either wink out when he leaves, making him almost godlike. Or they can maintain an internal self-determination and exist in their own right with their own actions and reactions. There is no need for them ever to 'rejoin" or correct the original timeline.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:39 a.m. CST

    EvilWizardGlick: But I'm not using Many Worlds theory

    by chrth

    And I don't think Heroes is either.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:39 a.m. CST

    Glad a character is being bumped off...

    by biggles2_22

    I really hope it's true as it will afford the writers the opportunity to tighten up the writing. The show is great with the only problems being the somewhat clunky dialogue (especially between Nathan & Peter) and a few plot holes each episode. If your going to create a show for geeks (myself included) then tight writing is a MUST. Geeks scrutinize everything, as these posts will attest. The writers also need to spin-off Ando for his own show. !Awesome!tm (credit to chrth)

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:45 a.m. CST

    Daybreak and Hiro

    by EvilWizardGlick

    A couple of more thoughts on Hiro and his timetravelling. Hiro could fall into the whole Daybreak/Groundhog Day problem where he thinks if he places the pieces of the action puzzle properly he can resolve certain situations. It is possible that something so traumatic would make him running in that self perpetuating loop. Given that he has finite resources while attempting to solve an infinite problem he would always fail. It would be like the Simpsons episode based on Bradbury's A Sound of Thunder, where Hiro could only wind up accepting the most favorable scenario to his personal preferences. I found this as well http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_travel The possibility of paradoxes The Novikov self-consistency principle and recent calculations by Kip S. Thorne[citation needed] indicate that simple masses passing through time travel wormholes could never engender paradoxes—there are no initial conditions that lead to paradox once time travel is introduced. If his results can be generalised, they would suggest, curiously, that none of the supposed paradoxes formulated in time travel stories can actually be formulated at a precise physical level: that is, that any situation you can set up in a time travel story turns out to permit many consistent solutions. The circumstances might, however, turn out to be almost unbelievably strange.[citation needed] Parallel universes might provide a way out of paradoxes. Everett's many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics suggests that all possible quantum events can occur in mutually exclusive histories.[20] These alternate, or parallel, histories would form a branching tree symbolizing all possible outcomes of any interaction. If all possibilities exist, any paradoxes could be explained by having the paradoxical events happening in a different universe. This concept is most often used in science-fiction, but some physicists such as David Deutsch have suggested that if time travel is possible and the many-worlds interpretation is correct, then a time traveler should indeed end up in a different history than the one he started from. [1] Daniel Greenberger and Karl Svozil proposed that quantum theory gives a model for time travel without paradoxes. [21] In quantum theory observation causes possible states to 'collapse' into one measured state; hence, the past observed from the present is deterministic (it has only one possible state), but the present observed from the past has many possible states until our actions cause it to collapse into one state. Our actions will then be seen to have been inevitable. The science fiction writer Larry Niven made his own suggestion about paradox avoidance in his essay The Theory and Practice of Time Travel. He argued that as long as time travel exists, history will change, and will only become static when a timeline is reached in which no time travel exists and thus no further changes can be made (unless it is on a course that is repetitive or will never become static, but there is no evidence of this). Assuming there is only a single dimension of time, the timeline we perceive must be the one that exists after all changes (if any) are made, and thus we will never perceive the invention of time travel, since it will have already destabilised itself out of the timeline by the 'time' we would have reached it.[citation needed] However, few if any physicists or philosophers have taken seriously the possibility of "changing" the past except in the case of multiple universes, and in fact many have argued that this idea is logically incoherent (see this discussion between two philosophers, for example), so this idea is not usually seen outside of science fiction. Types of time travel Time travel themes in science fiction and the media can generally be grouped into two main types and a third, less common type (based on effect—methods are extremely varied and numerous), each of which is further subdivided. These type classifications do not address the issue of time travel itself, i.e. how to travel through time, but instead call to attention differing rules of the time line. 1. The time line is consistent and can never be changed. 1.1 One does not have full control of the time travel. One example of this is The Morphail Effect. This concept of time can be referred to as circular causation. For exampes of circular causation, see Robert A. Heinlein's story By His Bootstraps. 1.2 The Novikov self-consistency principle applies (named after Dr. Igor Dmitrievich Novikov, Professor of Astrophysics at Copenhagen University). The principle states that if you travel in time, you cannot act in such a way so as to create a paradox. 1.3 Any event that appears to have changed a time line has instead created a new one. It has been suggested that travel to the past would create an entire new parallel universe where the traveler would be free from paradoxes since he/she is not from that universe[citation needed] 1.3.1 Such an event can be the life line existence of a human (or other intelligence) such that manipulation of history ends up with there being more than one of the same individual, sometimes called time clones. 1.3.2 The new time line may be a copy of the old one with changes caused by the time traveler. For example there is the Accumulative Audience Paradox where multitudes of time traveler tourists wish to attend some event in the life of Jesus or some other historical figure, where history tells us there were no such multitudes. Each tourist arrives in a reality that is a copy of the original with the added people, and no way for the tourist to travel back to the original time line. 2. The time line is flexible and is subject to change. 2.1 The time line is extremely change resistant and requires great effort to change it. Small changes will only alter the immediate future and events will conspire to maintain constant events in the far future; only large changes will alter events in the distant future. 2.2 The time line is easily changed (example: Doctor Who, where the time line is fluid and changes often naturally). 3. The time line is consistent, but only insofar as its consistency can be verified. 3.1 The Novikov self-consistency principle applies, but if and only if it is verified to apply. Attempts to travel into the past to change events are possible, but provided that: -They do not interfere with the occurrence of such an attempt in the present (as would be the case in the Grandfather Paradox), and -The change is never ultimately verified to occur by the traveller (e.g. there is no possibility of returning to the present to witness the change). There are also numerous science fiction stories allegedly about time travel that are not internally consistent, where the traveler makes all kinds of changes to some historical time, but we do not get to see any consequences of this in our present day.[citation needed] [edit] Immutable timelines Time travel in a type 1 universe does not allow any paradoxes, although in 1.3, events can appear to be paradoxical. In 1.1, time travel is constrained to prevent paradox. If one attempts to make a paradox, one undergoes involuntary or uncontrolled time travel. Michael Moorcock uses a form of this principle and calls it The Morphail Effect. In the time-travel stories of Connie Willis, time travelers encounter "slippage" which prevents them from either reaching the intended time or translates them a sufficient distance from their destination at the intended time, as to prevent any paradox from occurring. Example: A man who travels into the past and attempts to kill Hitler finds himself in Montana in 1945. In 1.2, the Novikov self-consistency principle asserts that the existence of a method of time travel constrains events to remain self-consistent (i.e. no paradoxes). This will cause any attempt to violate such consistency to fail, even if extremely improbable events are required. Example: You have a device that can send a single bit of information back to itself at a precise moment in time. You receive a bit at 10:00:00 p.m., then no bits for thirty seconds after that. If you send a bit back to 10:00:00 p.m., everything works fine. However, if you try to send a bit to 10:00:15 p.m. (a time at which no bit was received), your transmitter will mysteriously fail. Or your dog will distract you for fifteen seconds. Or your transmitter will appear to work, but as it turns out your receiver failed at exactly 10:00:15 p.m., etc. Two examples of this kind of universe is found in Timemaster, a novel by Dr. Robert Forward, and the 1980 Jeannot Szwarc film Somewhere In Time (based on Richard Matheson's novel Bid Time Return). An example which could conceivably fall into either 1.1 or 1.2 can be seen in book and film versions of Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban. Harry went back in time with Hermione to change history. As they do so it becomes apparent that they are simply performing actions that were previously seen in the story, although neither the characters nor the reader were aware of the causes of those actions at the time. This is another example of the predestination paradox. It is arguable, however, that the mechanics of time travel actually prevented any paradoxes, firstly, by preventing them from realizing a priori that time travel was occurring and secondly, by enabling them to recall the precise action to take at the precise time and keep history consistent. In 1.3, any event that appears to have caused a paradox has instead created a new time line. The old time line remains unchanged, with the time traveller or information sent simply having vanished, never to return. A difficulty with this explanation, however, is that conservation of mass-energy would be violated for the origin timeline and the destination timeline. A possible solution to this is to have the mechanics of time travel require that mass-energy be exchanged in precise balance between past and future at the moment of travel, or to simply expand the scope of the conservation law to encompass all timelines. Some examples of this kind of time travel can be found in David Gerrold's book The Man Who Folded Himself, The Time Ships by Stephen Baxter and the (1994) film Star Trek: Generations. [edit] Mutable timelines Time travel in a Type 2 universe is much more complex. The biggest problem is how to explain changes in the past. One method of explanation is that once the past changes, so too do the memories of all observers. This would mean that no observer would ever observe the changing of the past (because they will not remember changing the past). This would make it hard to tell whether you are in a Type 1 universe or a Type 2 universe. You could, however, infer such information by knowing if a) communication with the past were possible or b) it appeared that the time line had never been changed as a result of an action someone remembers taking, although evidence exists that other people are changing their time lines fairly often. An example of this kind of universe is presented in Thrice Upon a Time, a novel by James P. Hogan. In film, the Back to the Future trilogy also seems to feature a single mutable timeline. Larry Niven suggests that in a type 2.1 universe, the most efficient way for the universe to "correct" a change is for time travel to never be discovered, and that in a type 2.2 universe, the very large (or infinite) number of time travelers from the endless future will cause the timeline to change wildly until it reaches a history in which time travel is never discovered. However, many other "stable" situations may also exist in which time travel occurs but no paradoxes are created; if the changeable-timeline universe finds itself in such a state no further changes will occur, and to the inhabitants of the universe it will appear identical to the type 1.2 scenario.[citation needed] This is sometimes referred to as the "Time Dilution Effect." [edit] Gradual and instantaneous In literature, there are two methods of time travel: 1. The most commonly used method of time travel in science fiction is the instantaneous movement from one point in time to another, like using the controls on a CD player to skip to a previous or next song, though in most cases, there is a machine of some sort, and some energy expended in order to make this happen (Like the DeLorean in Back to the Future or the phonebooth and the circuits of time in Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure). In some cases, there is not even the beginning of a scientific explanation for this kind of time travel; it's popular probably because it is more spectacular and makes time travel easier. 2. In The Time Machine, H.G. Wells explains that we are moving through time with a constant speed. Time travel then is, in Wells' words, "stopping or accelerating one's drift along the time-dimension, or even turning about and traveling the other way." To expand on the audio playback analogy used above, this would be like rewinding or fast forwarding an analogue audio cassette and playing the tape at a chosen point. This method of gradual time travel fits best in quantum physics, but is not as popular in modern science fiction. Perhaps the oldest example of this method of time travel is in Lewis Carroll's Through the Looking-Glass (1871): the White Queen is living backwards, hence her memory is working both ways. Her kind of time travel is uncontrolled: she moves through time with a constant speed of -1 and she cannot change it. This would make Lewis Carroll the inventor of time travel. T.H. White, in the first part of his Arthurian novel The Once and Future King, The Sword in the Stone (1938) used the same idea: the wizard Merlyn lives back in time, because he was born "at the wrong end of time" and has to live backwards from in front. "Some people call it having second sight".[citation needed] [edit] Time travel, or space-time travel? An objection that is sometimes raised against the concept of "time travel ships" in science fiction is that they often assume that the time traveler will remain in the same spatial position in the Earth's frame of reference, as opposed to some other frame. The idea that a traveller can go into a machine that sends him or her to 1865 and step out into the exact same spot on Earth might be said to ignore the issue that Earth is moving through space around the Sun, which is moving in the galaxy, and so on. However, this argument is somewhat confused according to special relativity, since relativity rejects the notion of absolute time and space, meaning that the speed of the Earth and Sun would themselves depend on your frame of reference, so that there is no single point in space today that is objectively the "same place" that the Earth was at some point in the past. It would always be possible to find at least one frame where the Earth's position today is the same as the Earth's position at the past or future date that is the time traveler's destination, and this frame cannot be considered any more or less valid than any other according to relativity. Also, since there is no basis in physics for the notion of a time traveler disappearing from one location in spacetime and reappearing in another (all the time travel schemes proposed in physics involve the traveler's world line remaining continuous and unbroken, as with time travel via a trip through a wormhole), there cannot be any basis in physics for saying a fictional time traveler "should" reappear at any particular location in space. Still, the idea that the Earth moves away from the time traveler when he takes a trip through time has been used in a few science fiction stories, such as the 2000 AD comic Strontium Dog, in which Johnny Alpha uses "Time Bombs" to propel an enemy several seconds into the future, during which time the movement of the Earth causes the unfortunate victim to re-materialize in space. Other science fiction stories try to anticipate this objection and offer a rationale for the fact that the traveler remains on Earth, such as the 1957 Robert Heinlein novel The Door into Summer where Heinlein essentially handwaved the issue with a single sentence: "You stay on the world line you were on." In his 1980 novel The Number of the Beast a "continua device" allows the protagonists to dial in the six (not four!) co-ordinates of space and time and it instantly moves them there—without explaining how such a device might work. The television series Seven Days also dealt with this problem; when the chrononaut would be 'rewinding', he would also be propelling himself backwards around the earth's orbit, with the intention of landing in the same place (in space) that he originated.[citation needed]

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:50 a.m. CST

    EvilWizardGlick: Did you see the Willis mention there?

    by chrth

    That's what I'm looking at. I need to go to the original article to read it because the formatting on Talkback is so screwed up some times.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:53 a.m. CST

    Hiro time and SPACE traveller

    by EvilWizardGlick

    For Hiro to tyravel back in time he must also travel back through space. The universe is in continual motion. For Hiro to travel back six months in time he needs to ruturn to the position Earth was in six months ago. I suspect when he stops time that when it restarts there is some type of lurch similar to revving your engine and suddenly throwing the car into gear. That suggests there may be a physical toll on Hiro and those near him that is cumulative over time.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:53 a.m. CST

    Immutable Laws

    by toadkillerdog

    The past can not be changed. I do not mind time travelling storylines as long as they conform to the immutable laws of nature. The past can not be changed. To do so, means that the past does not exist and that what was 'past' is now 'present' or 'future'. I have no issue with creating multiple timelines into infinity either - but what makes 'our' timeline immune? Who is to say that we are the parent timeline? If time/space is seen as circular, then there is no true determinant. It is exciting to explore such conundrums - even though it makes my head hurt.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:56 a.m. CST

    Ok, ready the Wiki article

    by chrth

    Here's what I think Heroes is doing:<p> 1.1 One does not have full control of the time travel. One example of this is The Morphail Effect. This concept of time can be referred to as circular causation. For exampes of circular causation, see Robert A. Heinlein's story By His Bootstraps. <p> Also: In 1.1, time travel is constrained to prevent paradox. If one attempts to make a paradox, one undergoes involuntary or uncontrolled time travel. Michael Moorcock uses a form of this principle and calls it The Morphail Effect. In the time-travel stories of Connie Willis, time travelers encounter "slippage" which prevents them from either reaching the intended time or translates them a sufficient distance from their destination at the intended time, as to prevent any paradox from occurring.<P> Example: A man who travels into the past and attempts to kill Hitler finds himself in Montana in 1945. <p> This is what the book says, and I believe that's what the show is doing. When you thinking about Hiro being sent to Japan and having to take the bus to the Cafe, this interpretation seems to apply.<p> I need to check out that Heinlein reference.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:57 a.m. CST

    EvilWizardGlick

    by biggles2_22

    One theory that you, and conventional quantum physics, seem to overlook is the "Millenium" theory (1989). In the "Millenium" theory, while a host of physical beings, including Cheryl Ladd, Susannah Hoffman, and Kris Kristofferson, enter a wormhole (or interdimensional portal), only Kris Kristofferson will emerge on the other side, with career intact. And I didn't cut and paste this post from Wikipedia.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:58 a.m. CST

    However, while this information describes paradoxes ...

    by chrth

    There's another aspect besides the slippage in the book: meta self-correction. Possible paradoxes may require the use of other time travellers in order to correct.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:21 a.m. CST

    Space and Time

    by Abin Sur

    Anyone here interested in the possibilities presented by time travel and the resulting paradoxes should read Michio Kaku, starting with "Hyperspace." A great discussion on time, space, relativity, the many-worlds theory, and much more - it's intelligent reading, but it's not anything like a textbook. He's got several others as well if you like that one - I also recommend "Visions" and "Parallel Worlds." His stuff will DEFINITELY broaden your horizons.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:43 a.m. CST

    Millenial theory bah.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Your theory is faulted by Ed Burns and his journey in a sound of thunder. But may be supported by Ashton Kusher and the butterfly effect. Of course we will never know for certain since project Tick Tock is still operational and searching for their lost scientists.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:48 a.m. CST

    Sound of Thunder

    by Abin Sur

    EWGlick, I had to laugh at that reference, because that crap-fest was on HBO the other day, and I tivoed it thinking "it can't be as bad as I've heard." Oh my god, that was awful - even the hi-def picture didn't redeem it (actually it made the effects look even worse).

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:47 a.m. CST

    And this real world time traveller news.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Everyone missed this. http://entertainment.tv.yahoo.com/entnews/wwn/20030319/104808600007.html 'TIME-TRAVELER' BUSTED FOR INSIDER TRADING Wednesday March 19, 2003 By CHAD KULTGEN NEW YORK -- Federal investigators have arrested an enigmatic Wall Street wiz on insider-trading charges -- and incredibly, he claims to be a time-traveler from the year 2256! Sources at the Security and Exchange Commission confirm that 44-year-old Andrew Carlssin offered the bizarre explanation for his uncanny success in the stock market after being led off in handcuffs on January 28. "We don't believe this guy's story -- he's either a lunatic or a pathological liar," says an SEC insider. "But the fact is, with an initial investment of only $800, in two weeks' time he had a portfolio valued at over $350 million. Every trade he made capitalized on unexpected business developments, which simply can't be pure luck. "The only way he could pull it off is with illegal inside information. He's going to sit in a jail cell on Rikers Island until he agrees to give up his sources." The past year of nose-diving stock prices has left most investors crying in their beer. So when Carlssin made a flurry of 126 high-risk trades and came out the winner every time, it raised the eyebrows of Wall Street watchdogs. "If a company's stock rose due to a merger or technological breakthrough that was supposed to be secret, Mr. Carlssin somehow knew about it in advance," says the SEC source close to the hush-hush, ongoing investigation. When investigators hauled Carlssin in for questioning, they got more than they bargained for: A mind-boggling four-hour confession. Carlssin declared that he had traveled back in time from over 200 years in the future, when it is common knowledge that our era experienced one of the worst stock plunges in history. Yet anyone armed with knowledge of the handful of stocks destined to go through the roof could make a fortune. "It was just too tempting to resist," Carlssin allegedly said in his videotaped confession. "I had planned to make it look natural, you know, lose a little here and there so it doesn't look too perfect. But I just got caught in the moment." In a bid for leniency, Carlssin has reportedly offered to divulge "historical facts" such as the whereabouts of Osama Bin Laden and a cure for AIDS. All he wants is to be allowed to return to the future in his "time craft." However, he refuses to reveal the location of the machine or discuss how it works, supposedly out of fear the technology could "fall into the wrong hands." Officials are quite confident the "time-traveler's" claims are bogus. Yet the SEC source admits, "No one can find any record of any Andrew Carlssin existing anywhere before December 2002."

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:50 a.m. CST

    Abin Sur

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Agreed. sadly I will never have that time spent watching it returned to me. I should for damages both physical, ageing, and psychological, pain I still feel for the ruination of a great short story. It was nice to see the chick from HEX playing something other than a lesbian ghost. Sorry her break had to be this dreck.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:54 a.m. CST

    It's Millenium on Millenial! double bah

    by biggles2_22

    see the movie and behold the devastation that is Kris Kristofferson!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:55 a.m. CST

    It's "Millenium" NOT "Millenial"! double bah

    by biggles2_22

    dammit! I think m'I typing dyslexic yadot.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:57 a.m. CST

    Masi Oka is going on Studio 60 ...

    by Hercules

    TV Guide's Ausiello says he's guest-hosting: <br><br>http://community.tvguide.com/thread.jspa?threadID=700013750

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:57 a.m. CST

    Chinese invent time travel first, USA falling behind

    by greekopa

    acually american company found it first, never went threw with it, chinese bought it and mass produced it, theres acually 121.6 billion chinese all in diffrent times say it on cnn.com

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:57 a.m. CST

    The only thing I would scrap...

    by Freefinger

    ... the whole Niki-Jessica thing.. It's really gettign on my nerves.. Doesn't do much for me to know she's just psycho... No real powers in that.. You're local asylum have plenty of these, most of them think they are Napoleon, Jesus or Elvis, but still... same kinda thing... The rest of the story is pretty good, can't wait to see the whole Peter thing and how does his powers really work out for him, leetching off of others is pretty cool to me... Can't wait for tonight!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:59 a.m. CST

    t's "Millenium" NOT "Millenial"! double bah PSHAW

    by EvilWizardGlick

    The only TRUE holder of the Millenium is the Frank Black show. All others, even those that may pre-date, are mere posers attempting a free ride on the Groups coattails. Thus Millenial.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:04 a.m. CST

    More on time traveller.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Time traveller article with pic. http://www.yougottareadthis.com/img/time-travel.jpg

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:08 a.m. CST

    EvilWizardGlick

    by Abin Sur

    Jemima Rooper is the girl, and she's a cutie - if you want to see a movie where she's not typecast as a lesbian, check out "The Black Dalhia," where she stars as a...oh wait, a lesbian. My bad.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:09 a.m. CST

    Hey EvilWizardGlick

    by Freefinger

    See link : http://www.snopes.com/humor/iftrue/insider.htm. But it must've been funny to see the faces of the Yahoo News crew when they actually reprinted the story that was first printed off a tabloid.. What next Yahoo? "Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie fly to space and return with adopted Alfa-Centory child, they named him "P'Loink'Dou'Girk" after the child first father - Madonna, jealous, flies off to space and returns with a lawsuit brought by new adopted baby's father he claims "She entered my DkerGertu and she went into the Freeguty and took my child away throwing pieces of your green papers to me, I'm mad really mad, I'm suying the pants off of her! - What... I don't need to sue to get the pants off?? Damint!"... Guy Ritchie commented "Oh god... here we go again!"

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:13 a.m. CST

    EvilWizardGlick

    by biggles2_22

    Hoax news stories aside, there are chunks of guys like Frank Black in Kris Kristofferson stool.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:45 a.m. CST

    Prof.Ikamono: Good catch!

    by chrth

    Although I will point out that in last week's talkback I was unable to post around the show. Hmmm...

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:46 a.m. CST

    Meeting oneself in time

    by chrth

    Time Traveler's Wife has a scene that's ummmmm ... interesting.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, noon CST

    Claire talks to Lana

    by Shermdawg

    I mean, since Miss Lang has had next to no screentime, she'd be the last person you'd expect to talk to Claire.<br><br>This show needs less DuVall and more Haiduk!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 12:54 p.m. CST

    Abin Sur

    by ATARI

    Nice to see that someone else reads Kaku. I read Visions and Hyperspace. I will need to pick up a copy of Parallel Worlds sometime this week.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:05 p.m. CST

    ATARI

    by Abin Sur

    That one came out last year, and it's in the vein of his previous efforts - but what wonderfully mind-blowing material it is. It's one of the few books I can enjoy while using cannabis. ;)

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:12 p.m. CST

    Peter is a clone!!!

    by Hooterman

    He is a young version Keanu Reeves. "Whoa, I can steal your powers!"

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:28 p.m. CST

    OK, time travelling peoples

    by BadMrWonka

    I've read a lot of time travel books, I'm fascinated with it, but more the science of it, than the science fiction (although they certainly overlap at times). I haven't read the book chrth reccomended but I certainly will. but here's a task from me. if any of you can bend space and time, predict my bowling scores tonight! I'm averaging about 175-180 for the season, although last season I was around 205. we're on new lanes, and they suck. I will play 2 games, back to back, for the league championship with my team. how am I gonna bowl?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 1:58 p.m. CST

    Wonka's Score

    by Abin Sur

    He's gonna win by two touchdowns.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 2:14 p.m. CST

    The Past Can Be changed!

    by Russman

    If a person can actually travel through time what is there to say that they can't affect events in the past. Right now this is all fiction so regardless of whatever laws we can theorize and draw up - it still hasn't been done so we don't know. Anyway, that's why I don't like the fact that Hiro wasn't able to save Charlie. Any "laws" that Hiro has to observe are strictly there to avoid using him as a deus ex machina (sp) device.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 2:21 p.m. CST

    Russman: Not necessarily (and BadMrWonka)

    by chrth

    One of the time travel theories does state that the system will prevent paradoxes from occuring. So the rules are intrinsic to this system (but trust me, I'll be keeping a close eye on the show to see if the rules are really contrivances to drive plot).<p> BadMrWonka: Bowling is one of the most chaotic systems in the universe. While I wouldn't go so far as to say it's beholden to the laws of quantum mechanics, I will state that predicting a score, even if one has foreknowledge of it, will invariably change it.<p> Therefore, by predicting a 194-211 series for you, it's very likely it won't happen.<p> If it does, well, it just confirms the fact that I'm a time-traveler with l33t sk1llz.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 2:28 p.m. CST

    biggles2_22 Re: Frank Black

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Lance Henriksen is a pioneer of Sci-fi film. Everything from Terminator to Alien has his trademark features. he has worked with people across the spectrum, from Mickey Rourke to Edward Furlong. And he still does Sci-fi. Right now he is probably the King of Sci-fi. Kristoferson just can not compare with Lance's groundbreaking pioneering work. I will admit Kris probably sings better. And Henriksen has played far more bad assed characters.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 2:31 p.m. CST

    Prof.Ikamono Now you know

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Now you have the foundation to understand why you can answer posts before they happen. No more shrugging and claiming "I dunno".

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 2:41 p.m. CST

    This is why Nikki and Jessica do not suck...

    by LordEnigma

    Jessica had the ability as a child to transfer her essence. This not only makes her one of the oldest heroes. It also means that she could leave Nikki. If she wanted too. Outside of Sylar, she may be one the strongest heroes.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 2:46 p.m. CST

    LordEnigma: Yeah, that's what I'm thinking, sorta

    by chrth

    The question is: we know the "Hero Power" is a brain function ... was it Jessica's power to leave her body, or is it Nikki's power to steal a personality? If it's the former, Jessica can move on ... but if it's the latter, Nikki may be able to add multiple personalities to her brain. The question is, could she add powers as well? If she took Isaac's personality, would she have his power when Isaac was "in charge"? <p> And will anyone ever say, "Nikki, I want to speak with Sybil now"?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 2:57 p.m. CST

    As for PixieChick

    by chrth

    I think her agenda changes because she thought the Pulp Faction/Legion of Neutral was on the side of angels (or at least had been told that by HRG). But after being forced to coerce Isaac and seeing that the PF/LoN is going to keep Sylar, she's going to change her mind. I don't think she's going to be evil, I just think she'll oppose HRG and assist Mohinder.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 3:01 p.m. CST

    It just hit me "Who places the call to Jack?"

    by chrth

    HRG is talking to PRESIDENT LOGAN!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 3:09 p.m. CST

    EvilWizardGlick

    by biggles2_22

    Sorry dude, Lance is a character actor, at best. But seriously dude, you're the one who veered off of the time travel argument into your failed X-Files spin-off. Millenium? That's a friggin time travel movie from the 80's you simp-chimp. A movie so bad that it was funny but a damn time travel movie none the less! You, and your, damn Millenium Tv show, have nothing to do with what was being posted. That show took the worst of the X-Files (conspiracy and the end of the world) and encapsulated it into a series. How depressing and what a great reason to watch, as you apparently did. I'm surprised your still with us (thank god for Prozac). Watch Millenium (the movie) and you'll feel much better about the future.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 3:24 p.m. CST

    Urgent message

    by Cl_Kilgore

    I just received a fax from my future self. This discussion on time travel needs to end. It leads to the real discovery of time travel and then the end of the universe when misused. If the writers even did half the time travel research as you guys, it shouldn't get too silly. I'm addicted to this show!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 3:27 p.m. CST

    Cl_Kilgore: If it led to the end of the universe ...

    by chrth

    How did your future self have time to get a fax off?<p> As for me, well, I already have a codeword/name so I can verify my future self when he appears. Although I wonder if he's here already.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 3:43 p.m. CST

    but chrth....

    by Russman

    remember... these are all theories. So no one knows for sure (of course). in 1902 the masses didn't belive a man could fly - a year later one did. And now we all do. Once again the time travel stuff is fun to think about. Not trying to start a pissing contest... I just don't like the direction the staff took with Hiro trying to save Charlie... if she was destined to die, like "Final Destination", have her get hit by a car or catch a stray bullet.... - eh... sounds corny. Anyway, I just don't like what they did with his story.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 3:41 p.m. CST

    chrth

    by biggles2_22

    Hi Chrth, It's "biggles"...I'm you from the future with an important message:...STOP WHACKING OFF! I'm blind, seriously dude.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 3:47 p.m. CST

    I don't think Jessica is "in" Nikki...

    by Shepard Bauer

    Jessica is dead, from the reaction to her father when "Jess" confronts him, she said that she was always 'there' for Nikki when her dad was bad, abusive whatever. When Jessica died, Nikki freaked out and became a split personality. All of a sudden Jessica "appeared". She was strong enough to stand up to her dad back in the day and she died bc of that, so she was "strong' for Nikki. Nikki is super strong and smart, and willing to cross the lines to get what needs to get done, well, done. But only if she adopts the "Jessica" personality. She needed to be strong like Jessica to do what had to be done with Nathan, etc. I just think she's got strength and a major fault, kinda like how Eee-sak (as Hiro says it) thinks he has to be high to use his power...

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 3:48 p.m. CST

    Russman: Oh, I know it's all theories

    by chrth

    But when a fictional entity (book, movie, etc.) uses time travel, it needs to choose a theory and stick with it to maintain internal consistency, otherwise we can AND WILL nitpick it to death.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 4:19 p.m. CST

    I thought Hiro couldn't save Charlie...

    by Fawst

    because she had a brain tumor or whatever it was? Not because he couldn't stop her from being killed by Sylar. In other words, he COULD save her from Sylar, but not from her tumor. I dunno. Nevermind.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 4:52 p.m. CST

    redundancy

    by imageburn13

    As this thread has fallen into a rap about time travel, I have to pose this question: what theories could be applied to the scenario of meeting oneself? Isnt that essentially what the oro boros represents? Im just trying to wrap my brain around some of this, but if I go back two years, and walk up to myself and have coffee with myself, wont that just keep happening infinetely? or could this concept of multiple histories come into play? to allow myself to get out of the circle?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:06 p.m. CST

    biggles2_22, on the rag?

    by EvilWizardGlick

    On the rag? Mom unplug the ps2 until you get a job? Or just pissed because Frank has done more genre pioneering films? Heed the wisdom of Lou Reed"But you know people get all emotional And sometimes, man, they just dont act rational They think theyre just on tv"

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:10 p.m. CST

    imageburn13, yes you could have coffee with yourself.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    There is no reason future you could not have coffee with yourself. There is no evidence this would disrupt a timeline. If it happens then it is "meant" to happen. The Richard Bach,The Bridge Across Forever: A True Love Story, discusses attempts he made to send messages to a past self.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:13 p.m. CST

    The League of Super Acquaintances Codenames!

    by thevision

    Some are mine, others too clever to ignore: Peter: Mimic (X-Men name but who cares, it fits!) Nathan: Aeroman Nikki/Jessica: Nemesis (the Greek Goddess of Divine Retribution) Mohinder: Professor S DL: Faze Micah: Kid Terrific (in honor of JSA's Mr. Terrific who also controls machines...I think) Matt Parkman: ESPoliceman Issac: The Impressionist Claire: Miracle Girl (Zack referred to her as "miraclegro") Hiro Nakamura: Shifter (in the future will be known as Time Ronin) Non Members: Eden: Pixiechick the Persuader Ted Sturges: Isotope the Radioactive Man Charlie: Googlegirl The Haitian: Mindwipe

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:27 p.m. CST

    understanding time

    by ikkyu

    ...travel depends on understanding time itself. we have a strong tendency to view time as an independent and linear "track" along which we move, meeting events at fixed "points" along it - like an absolute axis of a graph. but time isn't like that; like everything, it's relative and dependent on other phenomena, such as the viewer.<p>the Buddhist Madhyamika-Prasangika philosophical school had an interesting way of explaining this dependence, or relativity, thus: it makes little sense to speak of time as a fixed entity that is independent of all other phenomena, saying, for example, that an object exists in "the" past or "the" future. rather, it is more accurate to see time as relative to each and every phenomenon; so one should speak of objects having *their own* past, present and future.<p>take a functioning chair: the past of this chair has not yet happened - it's a thing that will exist only once the chair has ceased (e.g. once it has been broken into pieces). once this has happened, the chair will be a past object - its past will then exist. whilst the chair is a present object, however, its past is a future object . likewise, the future of the chair ceased as soon as the chair became a present object. its future became a past object once the chair has become a present object. so you can say that the past of an object exists in its future and the future of an object existed in its past.<p>this does actually make sense, but you probably need to be fairly clear-headed to get it, so put down the blunt...

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:37 p.m. CST

    one consequence of this understanding

    by ikkyu

    ...is that most of our thinking is completely nonsensical. we stay angry with people we think harmed us in the past, for example, when in fact those people have completely and irrevocably ceased. the person of yesterday doesn't exist today - today there's a new person. not understanding this, we hang on to so much crap... why? everything changes!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:39 p.m. CST

    er, sorry -

    by ikkyu

    back on topic: Claire Bear on Pixie Chick action! Woo-Hoo!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 5:46 p.m. CST

    mocky

    by ikkyu

    lol! but the folk in the prisons *now* are in the continuum of the folk who did some bad stuff - they created the cause in the past to be punished now, and they now, most likely, have tendencies to act in ways detrimental to society, so prison may be the best place for 'em right now, after all...<p>you plant a seed yesterday - it ceases - and gives rise to a shoot today.<p>or something. now i've got a headache - pass the blunt...

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 6:08 p.m. CST

    and back to time travel

    by ikkyu

    it's impossible to experience an effect before the cause has ceased - a sprout can't exist at the same time as the seed from which it arose. this makes the whole idea of going back in time (to a previous moment in one's own continuum) very problematic. how can you have an effect - a sprout - *before* the cause - the seed?<p>is this what keeps the writers of Heroes awake at night? i doubt it... :-)

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:06 p.m. CST

    Psynapse: Yep ... and imageburn13

    by chrth

    It depends on whether objects are considered independent of absolute time and their time dimension is age, not calendar. For example, let's say I, at age 40, come back to 2006 (when I'm 32). Now ChrTh(40) and ChrTh(32) are both existing in 2006. If ChrTh(40) kills ChrTh(32), then that doesn't mean ChrTh(40) has created a paradox, because ChrTh(40) is still ensconced in 2006. When ChrTh(40) reaches 2014, he'll simply be ChrTh(48) at that point.<p> Now, this theory of absolute-time independence requires an understanding that future time is unwritten and that time-travelling backwards erases everything on the way back. Not all theories subscribe to that belief however.<p> One important note though: the grandfather paradox does not exist in this scenario, for the same reason ChrTh(40) wouldn't cease to exist.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:47 p.m. CST

    5 minutes!

    by chrth

    They gave Penn Jillette a gameshow to host? Huh ... I'm shocked, but at the same time, I can't believe no one thought of it before.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:51 p.m. CST

    Just once I'd like to hear

    by chrth

    We'll give you $75,000...and your choice of model for two nights.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 7:59 p.m. CST

    THAT was unexpected

    by chrth

    <nt>

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:19 p.m. CST

    Regarding names....

    by Yossarian

    I still like Cheerverine. Sure it's stupid, and it reminds me of a short-lived soda from the 80's, but hey, whatever, props to whoever coined "Cheerverine". Personally, I like DMO (Dunder Mifflen - Odessa) for HRG's group, but League of Neutrality and Pulp Faction is growing on me.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:21 p.m. CST

    PS.

    by Yossarian

    Can someone explain the whole Googlegirl thing to me? I must have been asleep during the resolution of that little plot thread.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:28 p.m. CST

    HRG power?

    by chrth

    Did it seem odd how Peter reacted when HRG was in the room? The coughing, I mean?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:31 p.m. CST

    How do you stop an exploding man?

    by chrth

    That's a VERY good question.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:33 p.m. CST

    the only thing that girl was good for

    by adzigjo

    was getting fucked in varsity blues on the washing machine...i hate her story and her lame husband and gay looking son

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:32 p.m. CST

    BTW, I TOTALLY called what was happening w/ PixieChick

    by chrth

    It pays to be from the future sometimes.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:35 p.m. CST

    HRG can't be leech AND WOW

    by chrth

    Nathan took off flying while near him.<p> WOW, HRG used the Haitian on his SON!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:37 p.m. CST

    "Oh God did he just read my mind" LOL

    by chrth

    Ok, that's too funny.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:39 p.m. CST

    i cant stand the blond chick who works with the cop

    by adzigjo

    gross

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:40 p.m. CST

    Wow, they wiped Zach too!

    by chrth

    But won't Zach wonder why people think he helped get Claire named Homecoming Queen?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:43 p.m. CST

    Just noticed a mistake in Herc's post

    by chrth

    Isaac was already in Texas ... wasn't he?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:47 p.m. CST

    Ok, that I did NOT see coming. WOW ... or THAT

    by chrth

    Dinosaur?!? Nice Simpsons quote.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:49 p.m. CST

    Or, um, THAT SWEET JESUS ... or THIS

    by chrth

    Ok, I give up. THIS SHOW IS FUCKING AWESOME

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:51 p.m. CST

    Eden

    by jurgenhadley

    what a stupid biznitch. How did I know it would be her...

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:52 p.m. CST

    I second that, Chrth.

    by CatVutt

    This just kicked my ass. I've been on the fence, but WTF?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:53 p.m. CST

    Sweet merciful crap

    by chrth

    That was so good, I'm rewinding and rewatching the entire last segment.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:55 p.m. CST

    WTF just happened

    by clockpolitiks

    So....sylar could have escaped the whole time? Peter is the bomb? Where is the other guy that he absorbed the powers from?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:56 p.m. CST

    hmm this is where that guy comes in

    by majortom25

    I guess this is where that guy who comes in and helps peter control his powers.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 8:58 p.m. CST

    I STILL LOVE THIS SHOW

    by knowledge1027

    THAT IS ALL

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9 p.m. CST

    are you on the list?

    by Flux_brown

    is the new save the cheerleader...save the world. that was mind blowing, and check last weeks thread folks, i knew pixie chick was kicking the bucket! fuckin awesome....

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:02 p.m. CST

    Damn! Cliffhanger.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Nice nod to A sound of Thunder. And Hiro facing off against the Dino reminded me of a Cadillacs and Dinosaurs cover. Was that another homage? Add the rpg " I've got to find that sword" line and it makes for interesting times. Once again, despite his having other powers, we see Sylar using only his TK.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:02 p.m. CST

    Holy Fuck!

    by Billyeveryteen

    I love this Godamn show!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:03 p.m. CST

    I'm not sure it's Peter in the end scene

    by chrth

    When he lands, they focus on his watch. I think he's seeing things from Sylar's perspective, sort of.<p> BTW, in case anyone is wondering, Claire says "I'm sorry" to Peter in the scene. (Side effect from being hearing-impaired: I can read TV lips sometimes)

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:03 p.m. CST

    HOLY FUCK! HIRO FIGHTS A T-REX!!! NICEEEE

    by wolvenom

    That is by far the coolest geeked out shit i've seen on this show. Props to the writers for having the guts to even mention the possibility of hiro going up against a freakin T-REX!!! I HOPE THEY SHOW THAT... oh man dont save that for the soon to become a major motion picture adaption of heroes. LETS SEE IT NOW!!! Lastly... im a bit confused why Sylar was able to escape that entire time from that jail cell but hopefully they'll explain that... maybe the cheerleader's dad made him a deal or something cause he knew that chick was going to backstab him.. which means she was probably working closely with the haitian but he doesn't know about the haitian's betrayal yet.... my guess about the end too where it shows petrelli as the exploding man is that he take's the radioactive man's powers via his rogue powers and sylar with his new ability to hynoptize and tell people what to do will get petrelli to blow himself up. BUT WHO CARES ABOUT ALL THAT STUFF ANYwAY!! WE ALL KNOW WHAT WE WANT TO SEE AND THAT'S T-REX VS. HIRO!!! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO T-REX!!!!!!!! T-rex t-rex t-rex t-rex t-rex!!!!!!!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:06 p.m. CST

    Cadillacs and Dinosaurs

    by EvilWizardGlick

    Yep artwork looked that way. http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=cadillacs%20and%20dinosaurs%20covers&btnG=Google+Search&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi Small pic but pretty close to Isaacs http://www.newkadia.com/Covers/S/C/Cadillacs%20and%20Dinosaurs/cadillacsanddinosaurs1.jpg

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:06 p.m. CST

    EvilWizardGlick: I saw Sylar using another power

    by chrth

    I think he was using WikiWoman's on both HRG (mentioning the daughter) and R.I.PixieChick.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:08 p.m. CST

    Ok, that last segment was even cooler than FutureHiro

    by chrth

    I think I need to watch it a third time.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:10 p.m. CST

    That was...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...okay. Yes. That was just fine.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:13 p.m. CST

    ok so maybe he didn't steal her powers but........

    by wolvenom

    im guessing that someone is controlling petrelli in the future to make himself blow himself up after he stolen radioactive man's powers

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:21 p.m. CST

    I don't know for sure about that...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...could well be that Peter absorbs them and just doesn't know how to...wait.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:21 p.m. CST

    WOW

    by Shermdawg

    Right when I was beginning to like Pixie Chick, BANG! :(<br><br>Right when I think one of Isaac's halfassed paintings could never leave my jaw dropped, POW!<br>(Although, I think the promise of a T-rex is a bad move, tv cgi = bad.)<br><br>And right when I think they couldn't top the future Hiro cliffhanger, KA-FUCKING-BOOM!!!<br>Obviously Pete's gonna come into contact with the radioactive dude, or he absorbs so many powers he overloads. Who knows?<br><br>All I do know is Marvel must be pissed at how good, and how big this thing is getting.<br><br>Tom you better sign off on a X-men series, spinoff, reboot, offshoot of some type soon. Or Heroes may surpass Fox's efforts. And considering what X-men coulda been, that's a damn shame.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:23 p.m. CST

    In Peter's dream...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    New York is empty in that open car door way that suggests a rapid evacuation. And Claire says she's sorry. And the looks he's getting are worried and remorseful, but not so much accusatory. What if they're blowing up New York on purpose? What if there's something there so dangerous that blowing up the city is the only way they can stop it? And what if Peter's sacrificing himself to...save the world.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:23 p.m. CST

    Exploding Peter Doll

    by tile_mcgillus

    Well that was interesting. At least we know if Peter does feel the need to blow up NY then Nathan will finally get the chance to do something right and fly that manbomb high into the sky. Although ALL of Isaac's prediction have come true so either A. they cant stop them and are fated B. there is more to the explosion then meets the eye or C. they can change the the future and have just sucked so far.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:22 p.m. CST

    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!! OMG NO.

    by Shermdawg

    I was typing that last post and supposedly Torrie Wilson's boob popped out not once, BUT TWICE on RAW.<br><br>*sigh* DAMMIT!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:31 p.m. CST

    Sorry guys

    by chrth

    I tried to see the 1/22 ep, but every time I tried to get close, I ended up in an aerobics class. On the plus side, I'm now in the best shape of my life!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:29 p.m. CST

    Ok. I'll be a man about it.

    by Almost_Human

    I have seen most of Heroes because if I am home at that time, there just isn't anything I want to watch on until Studio 60. I have said in the past that Heroes sucks. And I largely stand by that, however, tonight's episode was very good. If they have more like that, they might sway me back.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:32 p.m. CST

    cookylamoo: yeah, I don't think it's a literal vision

    by chrth

    And the fact they show a Sylar watch on his wrist when he hits the deck at the beginning is an important clue. <p> Claire's "I'm Sorry" is quite heartbreaking.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:31 p.m. CST

    Don't jerk me around Heroes!

    by Ironmuskrat

    At some point in the future I better see Hiro fighting a fucking T-Rex with a samurai sword. Dammit!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:34 p.m. CST

    Am I the first person to suggest...

    by caerlas

    That Jessica and Niki have separate powers??? Jessica can obviously wreak havoc with her super strength. But what about Niki? I think Niki has powers much like "Legion" from the X-men series. She might be a powerful telepath who pulled Jessica's mind into her own along with her power. Just like Legion's different personalities manifest different powers, I think Niki does too. In fact a terrorist whose mind got sucked by Legion often takes over in the comic.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:34 p.m. CST

    Yossarian...

    by Valebant

    Cheerverine... you thinking Cheerwine? It's still around. Not super popular. I mean, their website is giving out tickets to Hootie and the Blowfish. So, whatever you make of that.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:36 p.m. CST

    T-Rex

    by Alientoast

    Don't forget that NBC is part of Universal. All they gotta do is dust off that old T-Rex animatronic from Jurassic Park and voila!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:36 p.m. CST

    WTF, THERE'S THE MYSTERIOUS INVISIBLE POSTER AGAIN!

    by Shermdawg

    How do you do what you do so well?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:41 p.m. CST

    Hiro doesn't need a sword ...

    by Itchy

    he needs an assault rifle ... WITH A CHAINSAW ON THE END (God Bless Gears of War). In any event, I need to digest that episode because, truly, I don't know what the F is going on. I only know that I like it. Oh - and they need to do something about Nikki and Peter, because if they don't get acting coaches soon, I'm going to barf.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:42 p.m. CST

    studio 60 is not funny

    by adzigjo

    that guy doesnt look like chris hanson....

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:43 p.m. CST

    Wasn't there another show that had a complete out-of-

    by chrth

    left-field cliffhanger like the dinosaur? One that made us all say "What the Fuck was That?!?" ... Why can't I remember now? I'm not thinking about Lost, definitely not 24 ... any ideas gang?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:46 p.m. CST

    On the Haitian

    by chrth

    R.I.PixieChick thought he was mute ("If he could say something"), and HRG didn't give off any body language to indicate he disagreed with her. So that begs the question: is he working for someone else, or is he doing this on his own? And if it's the latter, is it because he's paying close attention and figuring out Claire's importance on his own, or is he being fed information from somewhere?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:47 p.m. CST

    24/Heroes crossover?

    by chrth

    Jack Bauer has to go against the one man he can't stop ... Sylar!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:48 p.m. CST

    Haitian...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    Just a guess, but my guess is that he's hiding in the belly of the beast, doesn't like the doings of the organization to which HRG belongs, and hopes to circumvent or perhaps eliminate it. Just a guess, though.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:47 p.m. CST

    What do you mean 24 is toast?

    by Shermdawg

    Wasn't the ratings kinda meh for it anyways?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:51 p.m. CST

    Hey, and Itchy...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...lay off Nikki and Peter. Both Ali and Milo are doing just fine. (Yes, I have reached the point of being made easily defensive about this show).

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:53 p.m. CST

    Shermdawg/24....

    by Red Ned Lynch

    I think it had its best ratings so far last season. Could be wrong, though, and too lazy to look it up.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:53 p.m. CST

    WOW, That hour went by fast

    by skydemon

    Not sexy pixie chick!! Noooooooooooooooooo!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:53 p.m. CST

    Herc, Harry, tech guy....

    by Shermdawg

    If one of you could reveal the secret as to how a post could travel back in time, I'd appreciate it.<br><brFor instance, my last post was sent AFTER the "Haitian..." comment, yet it shows up two posts ahead of it. How is that possible?<br><br>Do I have some sort of gift? Some sort of power? AM I A HERO??? :O

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:56 p.m. CST

    Also, I'd ike to know why...

    by Shermdawg

    the last two paragraphs of that post were mysteriusly cut off. They were in the box when I posted.<br><br>Are you guys fucking with me??? Invisible posters, time traveling posts, and now instant censorship!<br><br>Strange things are afoot in this here talkback!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:57 p.m. CST

    HMMMMMM....

    by knowledge1027

    If Sylar is the one blowing up nyc why is everyone in the scene looking all sad/and why is clarie bear saying i'am sorry to him?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:58 p.m. CST

    Many good moments..

    by Ironmuskrat

    That was a pretty busy episode with some good moments. Claire spouting some real tears confessing to her dad. That weird scene with Matt and Peter giving each other psychic feedback. T-Rex vs. Hiro. Pixie chick taking one for the team, whatever team that might be. Scary black guy.. oops sorry.. scary Haitian guy actually saying something and showing he just not a stooge for HRG guy. The last 10 minutes. The bad? Well I agree that the whole Nikki/Jessica storyline seems completely detached from the rest of the story. I like Hiro, but please, enough with making that stupid face all the time. Nathan's behavior seems a little over the top, he is in danger of becoming a cartoonish asshole. All that being said, great cliffhanger show, I will be waiting for Jan 22 myself.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 9:59 p.m. CST

    Prior Walter, no, no, NO!

    by Shermdawg

    Didn't you watch it last week? He gained that dude's telekinetic powers.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:01 p.m. CST

    Prior Walter...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    I'm not saying you couldn't be right, but I don't think so. When Sylar made Carnivale Cop point her gun at herself she was clearly fighting to keep from pulling the trigger. And tonight Eden seemed to very quickly turn the gun on herself and fire. If Sylar's power was working on the gun, at least in the case of Carnivale Cop Clea, he could have pulled the trigger and she should be dead. Plus, killing Pixie Eden so quickly works against his own interests, as her power would be a great one for him to have. I've got to think she killed herself.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:03 p.m. CST

    Knowlege1027...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...I'm telling you, I think Peter's dream was a symbolic prophetic dream in which he sacrifices himself to blow up an evacuated New York and whatever horrible world threatening evil is there, using Nuke Guy's powers. I really think I sort of believe this.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:04 p.m. CST

    The Haitian needs a Hero name

    by chrth

    How about Mindsquisher?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:06 p.m. CST

    RNL: Nah I think he's seeing Sylar do it

    by chrth

    But I do think the vision has a warning about Peter controlling his power.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:05 p.m. CST

    Red Ned lych

    by knowledge1027

    I hope your right, because that would truly make Peter a kick ass hero/character

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:10 p.m. CST

    I don't know, Chrth...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...it wouldn't have occurred to me if Claire hadn't stopped to say what she did and if there wasn't this whole preordained martyr riff they were playing with Peter. And all those empty cars with the doors still open. Oh, by the way, Haitian Whiteout, The Cone of Haitian Silence or Haitian Zero.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:09 p.m. CST

    Prof.Ikamono

    by Shermdawg

    Another mystery, I guess I've got Micah powers also. ;)<br><br>Naw, it's just the "br" html code.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:11 p.m. CST

    Chrth...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...and I would have added Zuvembie to that list, but that's too nerdish even for me.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:12 p.m. CST

    RNL: "Haitian Zero"? Make it so!

    by chrth

    Love it.<p> While I think it's interesting what Claire says, I can't get over the watch. Just like when Mohinder's Pop dies, the camera seems to like the watch a little too much, if you know what I mean.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:13 p.m. CST

    Mindsquisher has my vote.

    by Shermdawg

    Just remember, I was the guy to coin "Cheerverine". Well, at least in these here talkbacks.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:15 p.m. CST

    Chrth...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...but then again, maybe Sylar is why Peter has to do what he does. And yeah, I know I tend to get overly ambitous in my hopes for how far this show will go.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:14 p.m. CST

    You've just been mindsquished.

    by Shermdawg

    I LIKE IT! Good.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:16 p.m. CST

    Peter's dream

    by Ironmuskrat

    It hard to tell what the meaning of peter's dream is. In the past he has appeared to enter other peoples dreams, Simone's father and possible Nathan. So I would have to say he has some sort of psychic link with Sylar at this point. That would mean either his dream was from Sylar's point of view or it was Peter and he does lose control at some point. I am guessing he meets up with Sylar at some point in the future where Sylar is much more powerful and cannot deal with the amount of power he mimics from him. Just a guess.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:17 p.m. CST

    Prof.Ikamono...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    Papa Doc's boys have a name too hard to spell. I tossed aside Baron Samedi for much the same reason.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:17 p.m. CST

    RNL: Universal Theory!

    by Arguendo

    RNL, I like your theory, but how's this to add to it. Jessica does have the power to enter people's bodies. Sylar steal's radioactive man's power and rampages. Peter steals Jessica's powers enters into Sylar's body and detonates Sylar to save the world? Pretty nifty eh?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:20 p.m. CST

    Eden sacrificed herself

    by Molly_Millionz

    I'm quite curious why Sylar had powers when Eden was ther but either had them supressed when she wasn't there or had been hiding them. Maybe he was luring her out. But I am quite positive that she killed herself, because he was talking about how she couldn't kill him but that he would enjoy taking her powers and using them to manipulate others, then immediately after that line, you see her wrist turn directions with the gun and BAM. Sylar would want her brain so she would want to destroy it before he could do that. Great ep and some really good reveals. Looking forward to 2007 when it returns.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:20 p.m. CST

    Can we put one thing to rest?

    by Fish Tank

    Pixie Chick definitely killed herself to avoid being absorbed/analyzed by Sylar. He even said "No!" before she did. [Sigh] Stop posting otherwise.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:19 p.m. CST

    Yeah, it's just a dream, not a vision of future events.

    by Shermdawg

    Well, not a 100% accurate vision of future events. Why would Claire and Matt be in their uniforms? Why would Nathan be all gussied up?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:21 p.m. CST

    Ironmuskrat...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...the similar idea that Peter absorbs Nuke Guy's powers and can't handle them was my first thought, too. But that doesn't jibe with the empty city or the reactions of the others. And dreaming from Sylar's pov makes no sense with Claire's words, clearly spoken to the pov.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:21 p.m. CST

    btw, the last post jumped two spots.

    by Shermdawg

    I'm awesome.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:21 p.m. CST

    Changing the Future...

    by Arguendo

    Oddly, while there has been much debate about whether or not Hiro can change the past by travelling into it, there seems to be a lack of discussion on whether anyone can change the future after Isaac has painted it. I'm not wholly certain (I don't remember the painting w/dead cheerleader too well), whether any of his paintings provde false.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:27 p.m. CST

    Arguendo...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...my interpretation only, but it seems like everything in Isaac's paintings has come to pass. I can't think of any that were changed. But in that time honored tradition of prophecies, they haven't always meant what their most obvious interpretation might lead one to believe.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:30 p.m. CST

    Hey, Arguendo...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...I missed that earlier post. If the guys making this show had those kind of superhero comics chops...nah, even I'm not that starry eyed. Yet.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:33 p.m. CST

    And thank you, Arguendo...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...for making me realize that this show has managed to reduce me to my twelve year old self. That was a few decades ago. Feels surprisingly good.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:33 p.m. CST

    Arguendo

    by Ironmuskrat

    Good point about Isaac. I don't think any of Isaac painting have been false so far, however not all have been in the order that we had been lead to believe, Hiro and Ando's arrival at the school after everything happened didn't jive with the sequence of pictures built by Peter and Issac. Actually another question might be was Issac painting the future or the past when did the Hiro vs. T-Rex picture, or was he painting that Hiro was go back to pass in the future?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:32 p.m. CST

    Dinosaurs + Samurai Swords + Nuclear Men =

    by zillabeast

    I have no fucking idea. But I absolutely LOVE IT!!!!!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:35 p.m. CST

    I used to hate Peter...

    by Billyeveryteen

    Yet, I got choked up when he started to 'spolde. Oh, and T-rex FTW!

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:36 p.m. CST

    Y'know, if you think about it...

    by Shermdawg

    The Hiro and th redread's arc doesn't make a lick of sense. Hiro said he jumped forward and back and there was still no way to save her, meaning if she hadn't been killed by Sylar, she'd been killed by teh tumor.<br><br>And I'm guessing Hiro, for some god forsaken reason, let the Sylar path happen, due to his comment to "Mr.Iss-ock". Why? Why woud he choose to let the woman he cared about die in that way?<br><br>And could it be possible that he caused her tumor? She overloaded her brain with info and "BOOM!", kinda like Pete.<br><br>And consider the halth problems of Claire (who was cured), Pete's coughing, and the redheads tumor, could it be linked to the "cure"? And are all of the Heroes in danger of devloping some sort of fatal illnesses due to their possible contact with the drug, which most likely caused mutation in the fist place.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:39 p.m. CST

    by...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...so many more letters used in your posts than your name, and yet they're equally empty. You have a sad power.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:38 p.m. CST

    ...chrth - How do you stop an exploding man?

    by Freefinger

    After thinking 'bout your question I taught to myself that if you wanted to stop him you would need to kill him. Well. . maybe THAT would set the whole KABOOM thing and kill everyone in the process. I then thaught 'bout sealing him in a really big Ziplock bag, heck they say it will keep anything inside, inside, and anything outside, outside... But then again, it's made of plastic so it would melt before it could contain anything... So, how 'bout we change is mind, you know, like making him think of something else so he would not think about what his about to happen... Ok.. Shop a body part, leg, arm, finger anything, this would really make him switch from whatever he's thinking to "WHAT THE FUCK!!! YOU CHOPPED IT RIGHT OFF!!!" but, then again, that might also be a trigger to let the Nuclear Explosion out... So after many debate and thinking I saw only one option that would not release anything, would not kill him, yet would make him think of something else... I know what works for me. If I'm thinking of something and this happens to me, I'm pretty fu**ing sure I'm going to stop whatever I'm doing and be 100% concetrated on the task at hand... A real good kick in the balls, now that's how you stop a man from going Nuclear on your city.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:42 p.m. CST

    Shermdawg...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...we see Hiro get bounced at the point when he's about to kiss WikiWaitress, and we see him unable to squint his way back. I don't think he had the choice. Not that I'm sure dying in the blink of an eye isn't superior to the possible loss of functions, memory, mood control, etc. that can come with a brain tumor anyway, though if the option had existed it would have probably been good to keep Sylar from getting her power.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:41 p.m. CST

    Anyone have a screencap of Hiro vs. Dinosaur yet?

    by zillabeast

    Maybe?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:43 p.m. CST

    Chrth (old bowling post)

    by Arguendo

    "Therefore, by predicting a 194-211 series for you, it's very likely it won't happen." You've actually just "predicted" all possible outcomes -- a 194-211 series and that it won't happen. I think the only possible outcome remaining is that he both does and doesn't make a 194-211 series, which isn't implausible with our parallel timeline discussions...

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:43 p.m. CST

    Sylar takes nuclear powers, can't control them, kaboom?

    by AdrianVeidt

    I think this is an interesting idea, but I feel that Sylar would be smart enough not to absorb such uncontrollable powers. But he does have a power complex and he might try to absorb radioactive man's powers and just lose control. It's possibly true (mentioned earlier) that Peter is seeing things from Sylar's perspective... god, january 22nd is too far away. if i start dating someone by then, they will take a backseat to my geekdom and this show.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:44 p.m. CST

    Thank you, RNL...

    by Arguendo

    ... for your initial thought provoking post.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:53 p.m. CST

    Exploding Man = Godzilla vs. Destroyah

    by zillabeast

    Freeze the sonofabitch. Wait. That didn't work out after all.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:56 p.m. CST

    Guess we shouldn't even...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    ...be so chicken-county as to assume Peter and Nathan's dad is dead. I mean he was involved with organized crime, was under investigation, and in the grandest comic book tradition...we haven't seen the body.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 10:56 p.m. CST

    Shuresh's VO

    by Arguendo

    Hey, is this the first episode w/out a VO by Shuresh, or did I miss it? I really didn't _miss_ it, so much as didn't hear it...

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:02 p.m. CST

    WikiWaitress and Sylar

    by Molly_Millionz

    I wonder if WikiWaitress's brain tumour will have any effect on Sylar. We know he takes people's brains, I don't know if he like eats them or has them all in jars connected together or some crazy thing like that but maybe the tumour will start affecting his abilities and/or control. I mean, the writers specifically gave WikiWaitress a brain tumour instead of another type of cancer, and Sylar takes brains, I think the writers are going somewhere with that. Also, I wonder if they manage to kill Sylar but since Peter can't control any of the powers he absorbs accidentally all of Sylar's and after they have their victory over him, they have to contend with Peter who is now going to accidentally blow up. I like the idea of Nathan flying him into space and then Peter sending him back down after he's at a safe distance to tell Nathan to save the world now that he's gone. Maybe this will help Nathan from falling into the dark side of politics.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:06 p.m. CST

    Arguendo...

    by Red Ned Lynch

    Neither the wife or I remember there being one. Certainly there wasn't one at the end. Oddly, I don't feel cheated.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:11 p.m. CST

    Hiro better be going to prehistoric age...

    by torpor_haze

    or a lot of people are going to be pissed off if he's on a ride at Universal Studios. Oh but wait, why is Isaac drawing the past anyway?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:13 p.m. CST

    peter's dream

    by MoseSchrute

    Peter is getting a little delirious. Maybe from laying there next to sylar after he fell off the ceiling peter established some weird psychic connection or he absorbed a multitude of powers that Sylar Evil-Deaded and Peter doesn't understand them. So Peter is having strange visions, like seeing Sylar in his cell and he has this vision of the future that maybe is him sacrificing himself, or maybe in his delirium he thinks he's having a vision of himself, but it's someone else, sylar/nuke guy. Either way, he needs to somehow get his scar, could he survive the blast and have a massive burn mark?

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:15 p.m. CST

    isaac and past

    by MoseSchrute

    Since Hiro is traveling to the past, in the future, it's kind of the past and the future at the same time. I think.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:22 p.m. CST

    yeah that's probably it...

    by torpor_haze

    but it would be cooler if Hiro went millions of years into future and men are possibly extinct bringing another age of dinosaurs.

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:37 p.m. CST

    Linderman IS the Petrelli brother's Father !!!

    by DoogieHowitzer

    Boogie

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:39 p.m. CST

    Prof.Ikamono, check out the 9th Wonders site

    by zillabeast

    The gallery features a little Uluru stamp. It's actually where I got the whole notion from, haha. http://9thwonders.com/gallery/index.php

  • Dec. 4, 2006, 11:55 p.m. CST

    Good ep. Lacks gravity of BSG,but still good show...

    by HappyHamster

    OK, I'll avoid slobbering all over BSG in a Heroes talkback. Anyway, tonight's show was very, very good. I just wish all the eps could keep this intensity. <p> I also sense a Lost-like dropoff in Season 2, but I'll try to stay positive for now. :)

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:16 a.m. CST

    Nikki/Jessica

    by Briannicus

    Nikki doesn't necessarily have any powers, what I think happened is that once Jessica was killed she entered Nikki's mind and continued to exist as her "protector" So we're not dealing with multiple personalities here, we are dealing with 2 individuals sharing one body. No need to piss and moan about the whole Micha/Nikki/D.L. thing, I'm sure it's going to join up with the gretaer part of the story eventually.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:17 a.m. CST

    Haitian Negation

    by SPlissken

    heh. Though Mindsquisher is kinda funny too.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:41 a.m. CST

    I like Ali Larter.......

    by Jimmy Jazz

    I like the CONCEPT behind Niki/Jessica and I think Larter is doing a good job with this/these role(s), but I just don't care about this storyline. Not only because (as Herc pointed out) it is so seemingly detached from the rest of the goings on, but also because I HATE CUTESY TV KIDS!!!!!! Take out DL and Boxey or whatever the fuck his name is and have Jessica go on a bloody trail of vengence. Aside from that I have to say that this show kicks ass. I might just have to tape 24 with my obsolete VHS videotapes and watch Heroes.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:41 a.m. CST

    I like Ali Larter.......

    by Jimmy Jazz

    I like the CONCEPT behind Niki/Jessica and I think Larter is doing a good job with this/these role(s), but I just don't care about this storyline. Not only because (as Herc pointed out) it is so seemingly detached from the rest of the goings on, but also because I HATE CUTESY TV KIDS!!!!!! Take out DL and Boxey or whatever the fuck his name is and have Jessica go on a bloody trail of vengence. Aside from that I have to say that this show kicks ass. I might just have to tape 24 with my obsolete VHS videotapes and watch Heroes.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 1:02 a.m. CST

    Best.Show.Ever.

    by DarthMusashi2112

    Fuck yes, life is good!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 1:56 a.m. CST

    simplest explanations/guesses

    by The.Founder.

    Peter's powers. Anyone remember Synch from GenX a few years back? only difference is he keeps all that power. it's backing up in him, that's why to big Explosion is coming. the cough is a side effect of Clairebear's healing power trying to find a way to release the energy, that's why she is apologizing to him. His vision's are coming from Isaac's powers. He take s a power and cranks it to the fullest extent. That's why he could float perfectly on the Hospital roof, heal instantly after being dead, and continue to do so even with CLaire not being nearby, Mind link and nearly blow out PSycop's mind. He cranks the power's he gets up to the highest level. Something will cause him to interact with RadiationMan. maybe tracking him down before Sylar can? Kinda how everyone is all gathered in the same place. He finds him first and they realize he's gonna pop. that's what it looked like to me anyway. as for HRG's boss. and the Haitian. Easy guess. Hiro. Future Hiro . Manipulating everything to reset time, since he can't act directly to do anything without overloading his power or slingshotting himself right back to the present. He's playing a game of chess and lining up all the pieces for the best outcome. Peter blows up N.Y. killing Sylar, and establishes a need for Public response to the changes Humanity will be facing. All the while Whatever marked certain individuals, will be watching everything. maybe .....Just a guess.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:11 a.m. CST

    A Talkback I Like!

    by KCMOSHer

    I'm actually digging this talkback. This show is just incredible, it's cool to see so many completely different yet completely plausible outcomes. Hiro's the mastermind behind it all, no Peter's to blame for it all, etc. All I know is GAH I CAN NOT WAIT SEVEN WEEKS YOU BASTARDS! As for notes of the talkbacks I've read so far, based on my own deductions: Charlie didn't have a tumor, she had an aneurysm and a blood clot. She was a ticking time bomb, but it was not a tumah. That's physical, has nothing to do with powers. Peter's vision tonight is inexplicable. His power very clearl is related to the proximity to the person with the power and possibly the length of time since he came in physical contact with them. He didn't keep flying on his own, remember? Those aren't Isaac's visions. Also, that vision was not 100% accurate. Look at the way everyone is dressed. Do you really think Matt is going to be in his LAPD uniform in NYC? Think Claire will be running around in her cheerleader outfit while saving New York? It's allegorical, which is unlike Isaac's visions...and also unlike any super we've seen so far. Does his vision involve his apparent illness, or is there another unidentified super who has visions of the future nearby? No idea. I also don't know why he's sick, unless Claire's powers didn't 'stick' and his injuries started to return or something. The only thing I know for sure after this episode: I can not WAIT to see Hiro Vs. the T-Rex. That painting made me downright turgid, baby.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:15 a.m. CST

    wow, and bowling

    by BadMrWonka

    first off, tailhook, that's a plausible sequence of events to lead up to that. but why is everyone giving up/apologizing to Peter before he explodes? running briskly from a nuclear explosion doesn't exactly save you, ya know? do something!! unless he has to do a little mini-explosion, for some reason, like to kill himself/Sylar. who knows? anyway, on to pressing matters: bowling scores. I bowled a 184, then a 201, on the way to a victory for my team and the championship. high score both games! the weird thing is, both scores were exactly 10 pins less than chrth's predictions. could it be, that I was actually destined to get the scores he posted, but by posting them, he dropped be down 10 pins a game? but I never read his post til just a few minutes ago. fate? weird. as for this episode, I will have to digest a little, before I weigh in too much (as I see chrth is doing as well) but I do have this to offer. Sylar was imprisoned when HRG was there (and presumably when he wasn't there, since he's sitting there meditating when HRG gives him food), but had the power to escape when Pixie Chick came in. so what was the difference? if HRG is immune to powers, like he was when Pixie first tried to use her voice on him, that explains why Sylar was supressed as they spoke, but why couldn't he just bust out when HRG was gone? and if the room itself had some power to stop him, why didn't it work when Pixie was there? and why didn't it stop her from using her powers? and why didn't her powers work on Sylar? (that's a minor one, with many answers) well, the only explanation I've come up with is this: the only thing different in the last circumstance when Pixie bit it, was that the Haitian was nowhere around. does that mean he can stop powers? and if so, why didn't he stop Nathan from flying? I am so confused. but I love it!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:16 a.m. CST

    wait, tailhook you might have it

    by BadMrWonka

    if they say sorry and bye jsut before nathan slies him to the sky, that would make sense. still, why run? he's going into the stratosphere! anyway, if that actually ends up happening, I'm mailing you a beer. but it will contain salmonella because you gave away the ending so early for me!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:25 a.m. CST

    Aw crap...

    by The Selecter

    they killed PixieChick. You knew she would do something stupid when they zoomed in on HRG keying in the combo to Sylar's cell. I was hoping Niki would take one for the team instead and get popped by that cop she approached. I certainly hope that her plot line eventually becomes relevant, 'cuz it currently wastes time that should be devoted to the more interesting characters. I wonder who HRG's boss is, since he was taking orders from someone else about handling Sylar. Mondays in 2007 are gonna be good.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:31 a.m. CST

    kcmosher

    by BadMrWonka

    what if everything you said happened as you said it, but with the nathan flying peter into the sky thing, instead of blowing up NYC. as I said before, most of these heroes are at least smart enough that they would know running away from a nuclear blast would do nothing. I like the idea of future Hiro running things, but I think the logistics are too weird. I mean, he can pop into a subway car and chat with someone, but can't do anything more direct than that? fine, do it every 10 minutes for every character. and how the hell would he call HRG's cell phone? again, cool idea, but I think it's too out there. everything else you said makes perfect sense though, especially about Peter. I'll have to think of any more examples of him reusing powers (albeit in a lesser/different form) after absorbing them.<br><br> why do I feel like such a nerd in these talkbacks? and why do I like it so much? I'm becoming a nerd! also, I was watching Heroes with a friend, and I mentioned "Ando's power is being awesome" and he laughed hard. kudos for whoever made that up (chrth?), I got a laugh out of it. and I gave AICN no credit! holla!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:35 a.m. CST

    Hiro doesn't go into prehistoric times...

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    My guess: He winds up somehow at one of those cheesy roadside attractions, a so-called "dinosaur park" which has giant dinosaur statues. It is in this location that Hiro engages in a fight with somebody (Sylar?). So we may see this scene play out sometime this season, as the characters gather up in NYC. ... Also, I don't think I've read anybody here mentioning this, but it appears that the Haitian did not mind-wipe Claire. He wants her to remember everything, because he has a bigger plan in mind, and is secretly plotting against HRG.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:45 a.m. CST

    Two points regarding Peter's vision...

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    1) Issac is there alive and well. When Hiro went into the future, he took himself out of the timeline. He disappeared, and therefore he and Ando never went on their roadtrip, and thus never met Issac. By simply returning to the past (to the point when he originally left), his very presence and actions are already continuing to rewrite future history. 2) It was Peter, not Peter seeing things from another person's point of view (Sylar or Nuke Guy). We know because Simone tries to run to Peter, but Issac stops her. Claire says "I'm sorry" to him, and appears to recognize him. And finally, Nathan appears to look at Peter sadly just before the inevitable happens.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 4:02 a.m. CST

    The latest Heroes comic on NBC.com

    by Prof. Pop-Cult

    WHOA. Spoiler alert. Check it out, guys: It tells you EXACTLY what happened to Eden and Sylar afterwards. Did Eden commit suicide? Is Eden alive? Did Sylar escape? These questions are answered in the comic!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 5:14 a.m. CST

    a really great episode

    by dragon-lord

    This show is only getting better.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 6:02 a.m. CST

    Hiro and Gojira

    by Southpaw_Samurai

    Since someone mentioned the T-Rex/Man-in-Suit/Gojira relation, I'm surprised no one brought up Masi Oka's bit part in Austin Powers 3 where all the Japanese are running around screaming 'Godzilla!' and Masi steps into frame and says, "Actually, it may LOOK like Godzilla, but due to international copyright issues, it's obviously not." I only just recently watched the movie and while on the whole it was mediocre, knowing Masi as Hiro made the movie worth it just for that five second scene.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:39 a.m. CST

    Told Ya So

    by Roboteer

    Not a huge feat of deduction, but I alone posted right here, right after last week's episode that Dad really understimated Sylar. That Sylar HAD to escape in the half season finale, and that whoever was guarding him at the time would be the dead Hero. In a flip of a coin, I guessed the Haitian over Eden and was unlucky on that. But with some real accuity (surprised myself), I predicted that Sylar would NOT be able to absorb the dying Hero's power. {Has too many already for writers to deal with. And I like it that it is driving him insane.)......... Not sure what's going on with Peter P. Why is he sick with the dreaded 'Hollywood cough', even with Claire present? Is he mimicing someone with lung cancer? How is that a power? Why is he having prescient dreams with the young Indian dream weaver still on the sub-continent? Did Moe bring him back with him? Or are Peter's recurring spirit visions an adjunct to his powers? Obviously, his future explosive personality must mean RadMan is nearbye. That's not as inexpliquable as the rest. (Be careful, don't construct this conceivable world, and then casually violate it.) When they first revealed RadMan's existence, it became clear enough for even me to mention that NYC's demise might be accidental. That's looking on-target. Is the Niki thread over for now? That family has so many personal problems there seemed no way to involve them saving the world. They weren't terrible, just odd man out thematically (as I also pointed out a week ago), but can be brought back some other arc. Nice chemistry between Hiro/Ando of course, Claire/Peter developing, Matt/Audrey very cute together (ditch wife), Eden/Isaac uh, er nevermind. Shame we lost Claire's gay sidekick for now. Just when ya start liking the Dad (Mr. Bennett) and feel ya can trust him, he does something needlessly cruel. Did he have to scoop Claire's friend from grade school? What good is scooping Claire? This show is the best out there especially with GALACTICA starting to drift. (Get past the limitations of the original series, will ya? Find Earth already! Or better, maybe they find you.) One caution, I know the HEROES budget is cast/relationship heavy, but we wanna see pipe wielding mutants get medievel on one another. Right? Bring in some movie SPFX/stunt people for the main event. Toe-to-toe superpowered combat with the Russkies, er Sylar that is, not lame falling from a building or mind control. Spend the money, save the franchise. And yes, Hiro battling a T-rex with a sword is ultra-cool, if fatal. You're not Superman you know.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:53 a.m. CST

    My humble theory on exploding Peter

    by Prisonrules

    Two things struck me as I watched that final scene....first, Claire was running toward Peter...and then says I'm sorry and turns to run away. And second, Peter looks genuinely terrified that he's exploding. So, my theory falls in line with an earlier post. Peter absorbs Nuke dude's powers in order to destroy Sylar...the explosion is a deliberate attempt to take out Sylar...thus the evacuated city. Claire runs towards him hoping that her power will be absorbed into Peter so that he...and she will survive the explosion. Just a random theory that seems to make sense to me. And wouldn't that be ballsy of this show to blow up NYC!!! That would trump anything 24 has done in the past!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:56 a.m. CST

    Did anyone even WATCH the show?

    by Dreth

    C'mon, it wasn't hard to follow. 1)Sylar's powers were surpressed for a bit, but he clearly stated that his main power was to "figure out how thigns work." i.e.- he adapted and was able to use his powers 2)That shot of him yanking hsi hand back and pullign Eden through plateglass was AWESOME. That beign said, she CLEARLY blew her own brains out to prevent him from gaining her power 3)Peter got the "cough" because there was more than one hero in his vincinty. It's like overloading 4)The dream sequence in the end was a warning, but I don't think it was from Peter's power. I think someone sent it to him. Thus he will find Doctor Who and the Doctor will help him "tune in" the powers in his vicinity. He will then effectively be able to counter Sylar 5)on the same note, he will become more rogue -like and I think he will gain the ability to absorb and remove another's powers. Ala Radioactive Man

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:56 a.m. CST

    Frakking awesome episode

    by turketron

    That's the only way to describe it. They outdid themselves this time. There were so many cool moments in this episode: The "feedback" between PsychiCop and Peter, The Hatian speaking to Claire and having intentions that are not the same as HornRimmedGlasses, Hiro vs. T-Rex (gave me flashbacks to A Sound of Thunder, which was adapted as a TERRIBLE movie), Peter's vision which we may be misinterpreting... he might go all flashy-nuclear, but maybe Hiro does something or maybe he doesn't actually explode (leaving him with a really bad SCAR), and MOTHERFUCKING SYLAR BEING THE BADASS THAT HE IS. That guy is beyond cool... too bad Eden had to die, but I'd rather lose her than anyone else at this point. For some reason, Sylar with the facial hair and imprisonment behind glass reminds me of how Jack has looked on Lost lately. I also liked the "If-then" musings of Hiro and Ando about "save the cheerleader, save the world". I'm going to be pulling my hair out about whether to watch 24 or Heroes live come January. I'll probably do 24, download Heroes, and watch it Tuesday night at 9. Nothing on at that time anyway.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:59 a.m. CST

    Not a T-Rex

    by Diagnostic

    T-Rex's have only two digits on their upper appendages, not three. I suspect it is an allosoar. BTW Isaac's paintings always have a twist. It is possible that Isaac painted Sci-Fi's reimagining of Puff the Magic dragon.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 8:03 a.m. CST

    and as for the "if/then" statement

    by Prisonrules

    Save the Cheerleader, save the world...it's an if/then statement. But not in the sense that we've all been interpreting it. Claire has nothing to do with being able to save the world...but by saving her...it brought the heroes together...and started them down the road that will lead to them, one-day, being superheroes. And once they started down that road...they will have many opportunities to save the world.....But now the question remains....is my name on friggin list!!!!! B4R6A

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 8:38 a.m. CST

    Good morning! Two things (and BadMrWonka)

    by chrth

    1) I believe that R.I.PixieChick turned off the power suppression function of the room in order to use her power on Sylar, and that's what helped Sylar 'escape' (not sure, haven't read the comic yet). Although one wonders why she didn't say to him first "Swallow your tongue"<p> 2) EVERYONE has forgotten what HRG told Sylar: his body/mind is falling apart because he's reworked his DNA too many times taking powers. That's why Sylar needs Claire's power, to stave off the deterioration, NOT to use himself as a bomb and survive (as we've predicted in the past). Therefore, it seems to me that since Sylar hasn't gotten to Claire, once he gets Radiation Dude (who, as we have seen, has little control of his powers), that'll be the final straw and Sylar will just Ka-Blammo!<p> This has implications, namely: Saving the cheerleader had nothing to do with saving New York! Saving the cheerleader was done to save the world from a Sylar who wasn't degenerating and thus who would grow "infinitely" strong. The Heroes have saved the world, but at the same time: they've doomed New York!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 8:40 a.m. CST

    Whoops, forgot to add (BadMrWonka)

    by chrth

    Congratulations on the bowling victory! Now you'll always wonder if I deliberately made the predicted scores ten pins higher ...

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 8:51 a.m. CST

    Awesome epi

    by rhaps0dy

    Great stuff, what a cliffhanger and one of the best episodes of the season!! I just hope that peters dream was more symbolic than actual as his one of my fav characters for sure and has actually really grown on me! Mainly for his chemistry with claire and other actors but also the way he has embraced his powers! Out of interest when did peter first start getting ill?? Was it when he first met the police dude who if i'm not mistaken was showing identical symptoms to peter!!?

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 8:59 a.m. CST

    Regarding Peter's cough...

    by dp4m

    ... what if Sylar absorbs the entire brain with his mutant cannibalism which means he got WikiWoman's cancer riding inside of him now, which Peter then conveniently absorbed (magnified by the poster above who supposed that Peter magnifies the powers he absorbs). Eventually the cancer will disappear from his system (like the other powers fade) but it certainly would explain the mysterious cough for the time being...

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 9:07 a.m. CST

    Vote for Mindsquisher and the paintings...

    by leesheri

    they saved the cheerleader.... her top was not popped like in the painting. Maybe, Hiro can't change things in the past... but Peter can... because of something to do with his power that we don't know about yet.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 9:12 a.m. CST

    chrth good morning and I agree with

    by leesheri

    your last comment. <br> a side note... you guys picking on the cop, lay off, he is one of the hot guys on the show! What woman wouldn't want to be with a guy that can read her mind and give her exactly what she wants?? No awkward talking in bed...

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 9:55 a.m. CST

    If Sylar uses DNA

    by veritasses

    to figure out "how things work" to take on their powers, how does Pixie Chick shooting herself stop Sylar from sampling her DNA? There's still room for imporvement for this show (some creative directing and cinematography would be nice and of course the writing, though this last ep wasn't that bad) but it feeds all the geek needs nicely with some great geek moments.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 9:55 a.m. CST

    chrth

    by biggles2_22

    Hi chrth, Future self again. Just another request to stop the whacking off during Heroes. Eyesight is still blurry.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 9:57 a.m. CST

    if or then

    by Shakes

    anyone else pick up on hiro and ando arguing whether it's "if you save the cheerleader, you save the world", or "save the cheerleader, then save the world" A funny nod to the TB's

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10 a.m. CST

    Spoiler fir Hiro and the dinosaur

    by Lovecraftfan

    My friend as an extra at the Natural History Museum. In the scene Hiro steals a sword from the display case. There is also a dinosaur statue there.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10:13 a.m. CST

    Spoiler for Sylar

    by rtms

    According to the comic on the Heroes website, Sylar is captured right after wards, which doesn't make sense with the end of the ep.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10:13 a.m. CST

    Sorry Professor...

    by biggles2_22

    As chrth's future self, I'm not allowed to be near monkeys (by court order) as I tend to spank them. Ergo, my blindness. Follow my timeline here, bud.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10:17 a.m. CST

    biggles2_22 apparently wasn't paying attention

    by chrth

    When I said my future self has a codeword. He hasn't found it, and isn't going to. DENIED.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10:22 a.m. CST

    biggles2_22, if you are my future self

    by chrth

    Just email me the codeword to my email address, since you should know both.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10:28 a.m. CST

    Sorry, Prof.Ikamono, my bad. Was testing something

    by chrth

    <nt>

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10:35 a.m. CST

    "Leave the guilt" (comic book) -- timeline issues

    by chrth

    If Mindsquisher/Haitian Zero is there to stop Sylar after R.I.PixieChick has killed herself, does that mean HRG has already gone home and seen that Claire has been "dealt with" before going over there? So we won't see that scene when the show picks up in the future?

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10:42 a.m. CST

    Dammit, Hiro goes back millions of years...

    by Billyeveryteen

    Quit harshing my buzz with this "museum" shit!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10:54 a.m. CST

    chrth, I'd like to help me past self...

    by biggles2_22

    ...apparently I've changed my own password at some point AFTER this posting (that's the future to you). So, if you don't mind keeping everything consistant for posterity sake (also, I (you) don't want to create a paradox in the timeline) please change your password to B-O-S-C-O after the new year, that would be great. Also, "past self", fear not, they've cured my mild retardation but that won't be for a couple of years. Until then, keep the helmet on!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:01 a.m. CST

    leesheri: About Isaac's Dead Cheerleader Painting

    by GuitarAtomik

    Remember, Sylar DID pop the top off a cheerleader. It just turned out not to be Claire's. So Isaac's paintings have technically all come true.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:11 a.m. CST

    Dream observations

    by BizarroJerry

    Just wanted to point out a couple of things with Peter's dream. He sees Nikki and family, but has not actually met any of them. He doesn't even know they exist. And has he actually seen Hiro? He only met Ando, right?

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:21 a.m. CST

    biggles2_22=loser

    by chrth

    Get off the TB if you're not going to take the show seriously. This isn't a Lost talkback.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:23 a.m. CST

    BizarroJerry: Yeah, I was trying to figure that out too

    by chrth

    He sees PsyCop in a uniform in the vision, but hasn't before. He might have seen Hiro and Ando correctly because of Isaac's painting. And yeah, where does Nikki, DL, and Micah come into it? So while I'm sure the vision is figurative, not literal, it's interesting that it's providing new info.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:27 a.m. CST

    Nikki = The Hulk

    by Novaman5000

    As soon as she learns to control her rage and super strength, she will be badass.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:30 a.m. CST

    Guitar-

    by Novaman5000

    Jackie's head wasn't technically popped off, just cut, as if someone stopped him from finishing it... So says Psycop.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:34 a.m. CST

    The painting of the dead cheerleader shows a lot of

    by chrth

    blood, and the way it's painted it's hard to say whether the top of the head has been cut off in it. I'll see if I can find the tinyurl I posted with a closeup of the cheerleader.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:36 a.m. CST

    wow, no one bitching

    by lofe101

    this must of been a good episode. cant wait till january now.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:38 a.m. CST

    my take on the vision

    by Novaman5000

    Obviously this vision has something to do with the sudden cold that peter has come down with. What, I'm not sure. I have been thinking for a while now that the radioactive man was going to be the explosion in NY (due to his comment about not being sure what would happen if he was shot), and now it seems that I was at least partially right. It seems Peter is going to get this guy's power somehow in NY, obviously after coming in contact with him, and perhaps he won't be able to control it? It seems somewhat like Peter is sacrificing himself, so maybe the explosion is on purpose. As for WHY it's happening... Perhaps peter came in contact with someone in the PD that had this vision power and unwittingly took it from them? Someone we haven't seen yet?

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:38 a.m. CST

    Ok, found the pic: http://tinyurl.com/vxhvy

    by chrth

    To be honest, it looks like the head is intact underneath the blood, but that could be an effect of the way it was painted.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:42 a.m. CST

    If all of Issac's paintings are coming true...

    by Novaman5000

    It looks like there's going to be no way to stop that explosion. Still, NY looked pretty deserted... Maybe the heroes will be able to evacuate it in time? Or maybe they can change the cause of the explosion to be sylar. Will he survive the season? I wonder if this show is going to introduce a new villain every year? I'd prefer it be a huge arc as opposed to self contained seasons, aka lost, BSG, but that's just me.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:42 a.m. CST

    Peter's cough and Claire

    by chrth

    Even when he was around Claire, it didn't heal. I wonder if she has another vulnerability besides the typical branch-in-your-brain? Maybe her body can't heal illnesses such as pneuomonia, only withstand physical ailments such as cuts and breaks?

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:44 a.m. CST

    Or, maybe Peter was just seeing it through

    by Novaman5000

    someone elses eyes... Though the reactions of the characters made it seem like they were looking/speaking to him.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:46 a.m. CST

    One thing i don't get with claire...

    by Novaman5000

    How come she can die and come back to life, yet we're supposed to believe sylar could kill her by cutting her head open? Isn't she pretty much immortal? Maybe sylar is special and once he takes your power, you lose it, hence they permanently dead thing.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:48 a.m. CST

    Problem with Peter's Vision and Hiro's Vision

    by chrth

    In Peter's vision, the city appears evacuated outside of the Heroes (heck, kinda reminded me of that one scene in Vanilla Sky). And Isaac is there.<p> But in Hiro's vision, the police act as if everything is normal, and Isaac is dead. While it's possible Isaac's life has been saved since then, for some reason I don't think so. However, that begs the question:<p> Why would Sylar explode if he can see/paint the future? Originally (a few weeks ago) I opined that Sylar would detonate-and-heal to take out several heroes in NYC (including Nathan Petrelli) after seeing the future due to Isaac's power. If, however, Sylar does detonate due to the DNA degradation, than that makes less sense. And if taking Radiation Dude (Up and Let's Go!) is the final trigger, wouldn't Sylar have foreseen that after taking Isaac?<p> It's a mystery. Guess we'll have to wait until 2007.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:49 a.m. CST

    Novaman5000, he would kill her by removing her brain

    by chrth

    She didn't heal until after the branch was removed from her brain. Therefore, her brain is removed, no healing, RIP.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:56 a.m. CST

    Well, Peter is kinda girlie with that haircut. And

    by chrth

    he is a nurse...

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:58 a.m. CST

    Random Interjection: Hiro's Sword

    by Vaebn

    Ya know, I always hate it when people adopt stylish weapons in shows that are infinitely less powerful than simple guns. But then I realized... when Hiro freezes time, bullets fired from his gun wouldn't move. But he'd still be able to swing his sword. So this may actually be the first time EVER that a sword has been justified over the use of a gun! Then I started imagining how cool it would be from the other heroes' perspectives when Hiro fights someone with his sword... he squints, then BAM, they're cut to ribbons. Kinda like the thousand-cranes in the coffee shop, but bloodier :D

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:29 p.m. CST

    true chrth

    by Novaman5000

    Also, i didn't see "exploding man" so much as "human torch" in that painting. Also, perhaps this is showing us that they CAN change the future. Hiro's vision was if he had done nothing and 5 months later simply gone to issac's house. Now, they've taken steps to prevent that. Because Hiro went to work, came to america, contacted Issac, Issac is saved, the city might be evacuated. Still, that bomb (whoever it may be) is still going off. They aren't finished yet. I don't think these visions contradict eachother, though.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:33 p.m. CST

    la voz

    by count_olaf

    has anyone addressed why eden's voice didn't/doesn't work on sylar? His powers were working, why weren't hers? oh, and Uluru was mentioned by DL whilst comic booking with his son by the pool.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:38 p.m. CST

    HIRO IN AUSTIN POWERS VIDEO

    by JBouganim

    HEY GUYS JUST THOUGHT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE VIDEO ONE OF THE OTHER MEMBERS MENTIONED....ITS HYSTERICAL..THANK GOD FOR YOUTUBE http://youtube.com/watch?v=wL8pwDj4IGM costarring bad guy from tokyo drift

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:38 p.m. CST

    HIRO IN AUSTIN POWERS VIDEO

    by JBouganim

    HEY GUYS JUST THOUGHT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE VIDEO ONE OF THE OTHER MEMBERS MENTIONED....ITS HYSTERICAL..THANK GOD FOR YOUTUBE http://youtube.com/watch?v=wL8pwDj4IGM costarring bad guy from tokyo drift

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:38 p.m. CST

    Vaebn...

    by torpor_haze

    yep, that would be cool. But then we wake up and realize the show is on NBC not HBO.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:47 p.m. CST

    cookymaloo: You're forgetting other things she's done

    by chrth

    Like frame DL for murder she committed. And killing the poker players.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 12:57 p.m. CST

    chrth=Francis

    by biggles2_22

    "Lighten up, Francis." Future prediction Nathan will be forced to sacrifice himself by flying the nuke-man or his brother far enough away from the city so that no life is lost (other than themselves).

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 1:03 p.m. CST

    Prof.Ikamono, the link works

    by chrth

    TB inserts a space into a long phrase (to prevent TB stretching), so the regulars know just to delete the space when copy pasting.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 1:26 p.m. CST

    nathan sacrificing himself by flying someone up...

    by Novaman5000

    Hiro could stop time, nathan could fly the guy up an get away with plenty of time. WITH THEIR POWERS COMBINED THEY COULD BE UNSTOPPABLE!!!!1!1!!!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 1:34 p.m. CST

    What Happened to Peter according to Tim Kring

    by FearlessJay

    http://www.tv.com/story/7385.html?tag=headlines;title;3 I thought this was interesting. Peter obsorbs too much and go pop. Creates big badda boom. Of course, notice that he calls this a "theory."

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 1:40 p.m. CST

    Combining Powers

    by dp4m

    In theory -- despite Kring's theory above -- couldn't *Peter* just absorb Nathan's, Hiro's and Claire's powers and latch on to Sylar, stop time, fly Sylar high into the air, fly back, start time and heal the radioactive damage dealt to him with Claire's powers while Sylar "harmlessly" explodes somewhere out of range of NYC?

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 1:46 p.m. CST

    Prof.Ikamono Spotted "breasts" a while ago.

    by EvilWizardGlick

    I noticed the "breast" thing when the painting first appeared in JB's office. Made some ties to Wildcards also.Anyone else catch the Cadillacs and Dinosaurs dino Hiro faces off against? I posted a link to the tiny cover pic which was very close to Issacs pic. Notice Isaac does not have his head removed. He is in the street with everyone else.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 1:48 p.m. CST

    Peter and the Haitian

    by EvilWizardGlick

    If Peter and Matt created something of a feedback, does that mean if Peter and the Haitian ever meet they will cancel each others powers?

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 2:14 p.m. CST

    Haitian

    by PwnedByStallone

    He's the leech. He kept pixie from using her mind powers. He kept Matt from reading minds. And he kept Sylar at bay. This makes one wonder why Sylar didn't escape earlier, however. Another question is did Eden shoot herself or did Sylar make her shoot herself? It seemed unclear to me even though if he shot her we assuem he can't absorb her powers. Although we don't really know that either. And as far as the picture of Hiro and the T-Rex, I was not surprised. Don't you guys visit the heroes website? They have a bunch of other weird paitings, including that one, as downloadable wallpaper. Check it out. soem of the others are weird too. Like the one of a cheerleader, presumably Claire, engulfed in flame as if SHE is the Human Torch. I culd be a reference to her opening when she saved the people in the fire but it looks like she's controlling it. Very odd indeed.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 2:39 p.m. CST

    I knew as soon as everyone started calling it a T-rex

    by wolvenom

    some little fag would come on here and bitch about how its not a t-rex. ITS A DAMN T-REX!!! AND EVEN IF ITS NOT TECHNICALLY A T-REX WTF CARES!! NO ONE GIVES A SHIT ABOUT HIRO vs. ALLOSAUR... THEY GIVE A SHIT ABOUT HIRO VS. TREX..... looks like one, smells like one, talks like one... it is one. And no im not an asshole i just hate idiots who spout useless information that no one cares about. If i want to call it a t-rex ill call it a fuckin t-rex

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 2:39 p.m. CST

    Peters dream

    by leesheri

    so, was that really his experience or was he doing that weird thing he does like witnessing his brothers car accident? AK read the comic on nbc.com it explains that. also, if anyone has missed an episode they have all of them available to watch on nbc.com

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 2:51 p.m. CST

    Hiro has the ability to absorb powers too!

    by Ben Addiction

    Hell, he's only been in the US for a few days (or weeks, if you count his six months before stint) and his English is radically improved. Hell, he can even correctly use articles like "An" before a vowel sound and it usually takes years of studying for Jpanese students to pull that off. So did he absorb the waitress's super-learning powers?

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 2:49 p.m. CST

    wolvenom: this is why you shouldn't skip a dose

    by chrth

    Calllllllm dowwwwwwwwwn.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 2:53 p.m. CST

    Yes Psynapse

    by Novaman5000

    But, like I said, it's pretty much like she's the hulk. Her alternate personality is out of control and extremely powerful. Her "curse" will become a "gift" only when she learns to control it.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 2:57 p.m. CST

    My theory(ies) on Sylar:

    by mbeemer

    1. He doesn't "eat brains", he examines them to see how they generate their powers.<br><br> 2. He doesn't "absorb powers", he alters himself on a small scale to replicate them.<br><br> 3. He doesn't alter his DNA, he alters his brain's neural network.<br><br> 4. He's starting to mentally break down because he's kludged his brain so often it can't perform it's normal functions properly.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:03 p.m. CST

    And Masi Oka needs to call in every favor at ILM

    by Ben Addiction

    ...if they seriously think they're gonna pull off a good T-Rex fight on a tv budget.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:03 p.m. CST

    Ben I was thinking the exact same thing

    by Novaman5000

    I'd rather them not show that fight than show it and have it look like some 10 year old messing around in flash made it.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:04 p.m. CST

    I loved how Hiro's first response when seeing the

    by Novaman5000

    picture was: "oh no, I hope I don't step on something and mess up the future." He totally wasn't worried about fighting a t-rex.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:13 p.m. CST

    haha ok

    by Novaman5000

    Yeah i don't think Niki is possessed. That's not much of a power!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:14 p.m. CST

    Prof.Ikamono good point

    by rhaps0dy

    I think you make a great point regarding the fact that peter isn't exactly able to see the future but more peoples dreams! Has anyone ever watched the anime X or read the mangas x/1999! I personally consider one of the best super hero stories around. Anyways, in that there are dreamseers who can see what may of happened already, or what may happen, although, they frequently point out that what futures they do see is only one of many possible futures! So perhaps peter may blow up or perhaps someone else will or perhaps it'll be stopped somehow, either way all the heroes will dies bar claire if it is a literal dream!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:17 p.m. CST

    Nikki's power

    by chrth

    I still think she can absorb personalities--that's her power. If the personality she absorbs has powers, she would have that power when that personality was dominant.<p> She's Man-E-Faces.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:31 p.m. CST

    that was another geek reference from Hiro

    by samsquanch

    referring to an old Ray Bradbury story, I forget what it's called.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:40 p.m. CST

    ahh ok

    by rhaps0dy

    Ah ok i'm with ya, this is true!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 3:57 p.m. CST

    Dream sequences

    by jthere

    The dreams Peter has seem about the same as the ones Mohinder experienced. I think Peter is mentally "visiting" the same kid in India and that he's sorting through the questions he may have. I think there may be some intentional misdirection here on the part of the writers, making us think the dreams are organic to Peter's condition and hoping we'll forget the Indian kid.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 4:47 p.m. CST

    Hiro fighting the T-Rex...

    by superhero

    Hiro's at the Museum of Natural History in NYC...that is all...

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 5:11 p.m. CST

    Screencap of Hiro and the Dinosaur

    by zillabeast

    http://www.heroes-pictures.com/albums/captures/1x11/554.jpg Dig it.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 5:47 p.m. CST

    Didn't like that they erased Zach's memory there

    by Drath

    because I was convinced Zach has another super power he's been hiding for some reason, but even if he didn't I felt like that character was going someplace. Such a huge mind whipe kinda felt like they were putting the character on the shelf for a while. He's Claire's Ando, so that sucked shit. As complaints go it's a minor one. I didn't like that Eden is dead already though. Shit, Eden and Google girl die but boring characters like Isaac, Mohinder, and Nikki (yes she bores me to death, she has a mental disorder not a super power!), live on? I read there was a contract problem resulting in Eden's early death, but still, that really SUCKS! I love the TRex painting, but dare I hope that we'll see much of that fight? I mean the producers said there won't be big big FX episodes, and this show is begging for an Incredibles vs Omnidroid style climax to the season. A dinosaur fight seems too big to hope for. As for Peter, I'm convinced he keeps all the powers he copies, and that he's going to awaken to all of them at once--his exposure to Sylar who also has many abilities has jump started his latest spat of visions and whatnot, and I would not be surprised if he does in fact blow up after meeting that Atomic Boy or whatever we're calling the bomb guy. However, I think he'll fly away from NY and will blow up in the sky, causing everyone to think he's dead in the season finale but ultimately he'll turn up again in season 2 somewhere in latin America or Africa or something with amnesia after he fell back to earth. I also dub him Rocky Rogue, because Re-Peter is a lame handle.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 6:08 p.m. CST

    Erased Zach's memory so they could...

    by Russman

    fire the actor. Keep that budget down! just kidding. Good show last night although still mostly a bridge. I can't wait to find out what Peter's dream represents... i'm thinking he's part empathic and going through what Radiation Man will be going through. But how bad ass would that have been if they showed him turn into the fireball that Issac painted.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 6:30 p.m. CST

    Hiro's Sword

    by Alientoast

    Hiro is a geek, so he will probably go back in time and "borrow" Miyamoto Musashi's favorite sword ;p That or he will get the legendary Masamune sword which is displayed in New York of all places ;) Given the fact he is a RPG fan, that could be a likely choice as well.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 6:33 p.m. CST

    Prior Walter - Eden killed herself

    by Russman

    Watch it again, you see Syler's face change to "oh no!!" as she moves the barrel to her head. Also on NBC.com the latest comic has Mr. Bennet telling her dad that she's dead and when the father insults her, Bennet slams him against the wall and tells him that she scraficed herself to save a lot of people. Also Syler was recaptured.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 6:59 p.m. CST

    Speaking of Jessica

    by chrth

    The hottest chick in Christmas Special history is on ABC soon!

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:01 p.m. CST

    And speaking of Nikki

    by chrth

    (is it two Ks or one?)<p> I now think Nikki needs to learn to use her l33t fighting sk1llz without reverting to the Jessica personality in order to do so. That's HER hero's quest.<p> Although I do think she'd be cooler as Man-E-Faces.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:15 p.m. CST

    "You are obviously a Nonconformist and a Rebel!"

    by chrth

    This is a good one. And Jessica is SO HAWT

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:34 p.m. CST

    Nikki/Jess power important as

    by flanaganagain

    Nikki/Jess power has to be crucial for the story plot so I agree as mentioned above. Peter enters into the body of Skylar, who has taken on Nuclear Mans power, to slow the explosion down. I "think" Peter can only do one power at a time so he may die. I doubt it. His brother will fly him up in the air. He will let go of what is in reality Skylar and Peter will go back into his body on the ground. All live to fight a new bad guy another day. Or until their contracts are up, they ask for too much money or Hollywood come calling.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:36 p.m. CST

    By the way.... LOST is moving

    by flanaganagain

    Lost is moving to 10pm Weds to avoid American Idol. I also think they want to avoid that sneaky move NBC made with Medium comming to Weds. at 9pm.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 7:48 p.m. CST

    One last thing....

    by flanaganagain

    The ads said one will be lost forver and another would die. Right? We know "voice" killed her self. Who was lost? Nikki? Could have sworn said "lost forever."

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 8:06 p.m. CST

    NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

    by ikkyu

    WAY too soon to whack Pixie Chick! she was a hottie. :-(

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 8:31 p.m. CST

    It wasnt Linderman calling HRG

    by funnyhat

    It was Chandra Suresh. Who else would want to inspect the pinacle of herolution, especially since his rejection of Gabrial(Sylar) is what prompted his behavior, rather thank just kill him and finish it.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 9:52 p.m. CST

    room blocking capabilities

    by dr_pepper

    Ok - here's what happened. Sylars powers were blocked by the room - he couldn't see why. As SOON as Eden used her powers he could "see" (just as he can see a broken watch or see how things work) how the room was blocking powers and was able to ascertain how to nullify said block. Eden definitely killed herself. My biggest hope for this show is that they wrap up the Sylar story arc this year and start with a new baddy next year. I don't want a Sylar series drawn out over 7 years. Each season would be one big comic episode where the baddy is wrapped up one way or the other at the end of the season. This would keep the story moving along and keep in interesting. Keep some core heroes, kill some off, have some leave etc, but keep it moving. Oh and the family has got to get back involved with the rest of the story line. Right now it's just damn boring.

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 9:54 p.m. CST

    "why is Isaac drawing the past anyway?"

    by smackfu

    Because it's Hiro's future? I doubt he'd be having a premonition about the dinosaur's fate of getting pwned by a small japanese man. "SHO-ryu-ken!!!!".

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 10:52 p.m. CST

    dinosaur scene is probably going to be...

    by torpor_haze

    the last scene of the season. we see the frame Isaac painted, fade to black..

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:04 p.m. CST

    also

    by BadMrWonka

    nikki's husband's power is weird. he can let things go through him (bullets, etc.) but he can also go through things (doors, people). aren't those different things, in a way? and why not just make himself maleable or whatever, enough to let the bullet just sort of glide out of him? and why was the door sort of shimmering and moving as he went through it. that implies it's not jsut him that's changing, but that he can manipulate other objects. isn't that a slipperly slope, logically speaking? forgive me, never read a comic book in my life. please to explain?

  • Dec. 5, 2006, 11:06 p.m. CST

    oh and

    by BadMrWonka

    when he put his hand into Nikki (insert joke here), why didn't it hurt her more than it did? isnt' his hand inside her? and if it's not, where is it? could he walk through a wall that was thicker than he is? if so, during the time he's actually IN the wall, where is he? does he exist? the door he reached through, not to mention Nikki, were both fine and unaltered after he took his hand back. oh moly my head hurts.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 1:02 a.m. CST

    Of course Eden killed herself

    by mraig

    Otherwise Sylar would have taken her powers. Wow, this is the first episode that I will say is unqualifiedly Good. It seems like they have finally figured out how to do comic book cool without being too painfully cheesy - we'll see how long they can keep it up (compare Smallville Seasons 2-3 to all the rest). I do continue to love the fact that Heroes considers Multiple Personality Disorder a "power".

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 1:15 a.m. CST

    About Niki, Micah, and DL...

    by JunoFallon

    I don't dislike the characters, but I do agree that they really don't seem to have a connection to anyone else. I can only assume that they have plans for use later in the series, but unless they play a major part in some way later I don't really see the point of keeping them around. I'd rather see more of Matt Parkman. He kind of gets shafted on screen time. Besides, I'm having a hard time figuring out just what exactly Niki's "power" is supposed to be. Just seems like a schitzo to me! That's not super, just crazy. hahah

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 1:41 a.m. CST

    Like, if Sylar took Niki's power...

    by mraig

    ...what would happen? Would there be a less inhibited, more badass Sylar inside him itching to get out? Or would it create a nice, quiet, reserved Sylar struggling for control. Shit, now that's going to be the season finale. I TOTALLY COPYRIGHT THAT. Also what if Peter absorbed her power.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 1:47 a.m. CST

    Niki's power is strength

    by funnyhat

    her alter-ego, jessica, has hulk-like strength. she can rip men into pieces with her bare hands and throw heavy objects long distances. do you people even WATCH the show?

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 4:53 a.m. CST

    A distant sound of thunder...

    by Zardoz

    Great episode! So many geek-tastic moments, I lost count! This is, quite simply, the best comic-book format TV show ever made. (so far) That sounds like a qualifier statement, but only because there hasn't really been a show like this before now. And whatever else it is, sci-fi, drama, it is definitely a show based on comic books, from the graphics to the style, material, mise-en-scene, what have you. Great cliffhanger and I can't wait until next year for more...(unless of course Heroes is going up against 24, in which case...) Oh, and Studio 60 was fantastic, too! (but maybe I'm biased because I'm from NOLA)

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 8:07 a.m. CST

    How many times do you think

    by roccotheripper

    the cheerleader had her memory erased?

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 8:33 a.m. CST

    Bad judgement on the memory wipes..

    by mbeemer

    Maybe you can get away with it within the family, but wiping Zach was stupid - it introduces too many discrepancies that raise questions, like when all his outcast friends wonder why he suddenly acts like he doesn't know Claire when he was heavily campaigning for her for weeks before. If you're going to be that ruthless, it would be 'cleaner' to arrange an 'accident' for him.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 8:43 a.m. CST

    Mindwipe

    by Abin Sur

    I could use one for the two hours I spent watching "A Sound of Thunder" on HBO last week.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 8:52 a.m. CST

    T-Rex

    by kuryakin

    It's pretty obvious we won't see Hiro fighting a dinosaur in the show. I reckon some shit will go down at the museum and Hiro picks up a sword from the ancient history section. Also from a second watching it seemed like Peter's eyes went all red like Gambit's just before he collapsed and also when he first woke up in his vision. Incidentally, I liked the way Mohinder got out the taxi with a smile on his face, then looked down at the radiation hands and bolted - I don't think you're outrunning that shit my friend

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 9:18 a.m. CST

    Hiro's Sword and the T-Rex

    by Lang The Cat

    It seems to me that it is very unlikely Hiro will face a live Dino with a sword. It is much more likely he will get his sword in a very reasonable place that has a T-Rex, i.e., a museum or the California desert.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 11 a.m. CST

    Niki/Jessica

    by porterdsgn

    Since when is being a schizophrenic bitch a superpower? If that's the case there are plenty of women at my work that qualify for superhero status!

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 11:09 a.m. CST

    Yack!

    by Ricky Henderson

    Did ya hear who the Mets are considering for 1st base coach in 2007? (Minor hint, he shares my AICN handle and likes to talk about himself in the 3rd person.)

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 11:28 a.m. CST

    I agree about Zach

    by CrichtonAstronut

    That was the one sour note in this episode, well that and Eden dying. But at least Eden got a hero's death. The whole Zach/Claire friendship just got erased. And he was so Wallace to her Veronica. He deserved to be a bigger part of the story for longer. And I thought his character was going somewhere too. That said. I can't wait to see what kind of deal the Hatian's gonna make with Claire. And I love Peter's Vision where they all gather together. That image where they're all backing away would make a great Comic book cover. Was he wearing Sylar's jacket in that scene. 'Cause that may mean Sylar is going to bow up and Peter is experiencing Sylar's future through Sylar's eyes.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 11:37 a.m. CST

    Also most Multiple-personalities don't have

    by CrichtonAstronut

    disappearing/reappearing tatoos. Except that one chick... No I think that was just blurry 'cause I drunk...well... Anyway, I think the Nikki/Jessica thing may be more complicated than a mental disorder. But they do need to bring that story in line with the other stories. And definitely more Matt Parkman, he's cool and I've missed Clea Duvall from Carnivale.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 1:28 p.m. CST

    if the radiation guy actually blew up ...

    by roccotheripper

    would his body actually explode or would he just emit an explosion. i think if he could survive an explosion then he must have some powers like johnny storm

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 1:40 p.m. CST

    Ricky Henderson coaching 1st

    by chrth

    They just better make sure Ricky is on the active roster as well so that Ricky can put Ricky in the game when Ricky needs to.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 2:31 p.m. CST

    dammit chrth

    by BadMrWonka

    answer my questions about Nikki's husbands powers above. I'm going nuts.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 3:32 p.m. CST

    DL's power (just for BadMrWonka)

    by chrth

    DL can make parts of his body "ghostlike". He can do it partially--so obviously he always keeps the soles of his feet "solid" so he doesn't fall through the ground.<p> Specific aspects of this:<p> Walking through walls: In theory, can't be done, because to do so would require him making himself fully ghost, and then he'd plummet through the Earth. However, this fact is often ignored in fiction.<p> Choking Jessica: Apparently, the ghosting still allows him to keep his body connected even if ghosting intervenes--so when he reaches into a door to unlock it, the wrist is ghost but the hand is physical after passing through. When he choked her, the part inside of her was kept ghosted.<p> Shimmering windows, door: No idea. Probably done for effect.<p> Removing the bullet: I wondered about this myself, but my guess would be as follows: he'd have to make sure that he didn't accidentally let anything else fall out (surrounding muscle tissue, for example). He may not have enough control for that. (Or he let the bullet out and we didn't see it).<p> How's that?

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 3:34 p.m. CST

    Addendum--going through walls

    by chrth

    DL may be able to leap through a wall if he jumps high enough. He'd have to time it to make sure he re-solidified his feet before he landed but after they've gone through the wall.<p> Conversly, he could flip through a wall by handstanding first (keep his palms solid) and then falling through the wall (making his feet solid before they land).

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 3:37 p.m. CST

    The cheerleader's ##

    by Kampy0jay

    Do you think people would pay me if i had Hayden's phone # .....like on ebay, is that legal? becasue i do ;-P

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 4:19 p.m. CST

    Mr. Bennet's Powers And Other Subjects

    by Barron34

    It seems to me that Claire's father DOES have a power: he neutralizes the powers of other superpowered people around him. This is why Eden and Sylar can't affect him, and why guys like the Haitian follow his orders.*****Sad to see Eden go. The showrunners seem to like killing off cute young women: first Charlie the waitress, now Eden. Oh, well. At least it shows that the writers have no fear when it comes to killing characters. I found the Eden character to be interesting, powers and all, and was sad to see her go. She went out tough, though, shooting herself before Sylar could brain-suck her.*****Here is another point: maybe old man Chandra DID have a super-power himself: the power to track down others with powers. This would explain how Sylar knows where to find other superpowered folks: after killing Chandra, he took his innate power of locating others with superpowers. Just a thought.******As far as those who are getting tired of the Jessica/Niki storyline: I think it is about to heat up. Since Nikki has confessed to murder, I think that she will finally be connected to the main storyline when Parkman?Telecop and Clea Duvall/FBI chick come to interrogate her. The writers really do need to figure out a way to bring her character more into the main storyline.*****Anyway, I love this show. Kring and Jeph Loeb do a great job, as well as the rest of the cast and crew. More power to them.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 4:27 p.m. CST

    beacuse I'm a HUGE dork- Dl's powers-

    by samsquanch

    They explained in the X-Men that when Kitty Pryde phases, gravity's hold on her becomes a little different. she's not weightless, but she can "walk" on air, hover, etc. It seems like when DL phased through the bullet intended for his head he should have fallen into the ground, but to "fall" implies that when he's phased he still weighs something. Maybe when he phases his body just remains in whatever position it was in before, neither floating nor falling, but just kind of stuck there until he decided to move.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 4:42 p.m. CST

    I thought it was the Haitian who neutralized

    by CrichtonAstronut

    other's powers. Not Mr. Bennet. Didn't Bennet even say something like that to Matt Parkman when they had him captured. And wasn't that why the Haitian was standing outside the interrogation room when Duvall's character was talking to Mr. Bennet and Claire and Matt was trying to read their minds. I think maybe its an extension of his power to erase memeories, he can keep supers minds from accessing their powers.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 4:48 p.m. CST

    Haitian Guy And Other Stuff

    by Barron34

    I don't know; maybe Haitian Guy does have the power to neutralize other people's powers, but that would seem to be a seperate power from erasing people's memories. I think Mr. Bennet can neutralize other people's powers. This is why Sylar could not telekinetically rip Bennet through the glass window of his prison cell like he did with Eden. It also explains how Bennet is able to boss around people with powers like Eden and Haitian guy: they can't effect them with their powers. Anyway, it seems to make sense to me. This would be a cool and subtle power, almost a "non-power". Likewise, old Professor Chandra may have had a subtle power to track others who themselves had powers, which would help explain how Sylar can find other powered-types so as to kill them and steal their powers via the old "brain-suck".

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 4:59 p.m. CST

    Nikki/Jesica

    by flanaganagain

    I tell ya, sure she has super strength but how will that play into the end? She can possess people! She's possesing her sister right now! Peter absorbs that power and takes over Nuclear Mans body. His brother flys him up and Peter takes over that power and the both fly away! If you consider that the show basically rips off other super heroes what is her power? The Hulk? Puh leeze! More like Deadman or The Spirit. That last dream sequence is a clue. Even though I like the cheerleaders "costume" I find it silly that she wears it to New York so that may be a dream not reality.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 5:03 p.m. CST

    No no no no! HRG and Mindsquisher/Haitian Zero

    by chrth

    HRG has no powers, I just rewatched the last segment when Sylar talks to him, and Sylar says "kidnapping men and women who are different". Sylar knows HRG has no powers. Besides, if HRG was leech, Nathan could not fly away.<p> Mindsquisher is able to manipulate the brain--removing memories, for example. What he can also do is erect shields around the brain(s) so that other powers -- such as Psycop's -- that involve the brain are stopped. He doesn't make the person powerless, otherwise they'd keep him around Sylar constantly.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 5:02 p.m. CST

    Who was lost forever? I know who died!

    by flanaganagain

    The teaser for last show said "one would be lost forever" and "one would die". Right? Anyone know what I'm talking about here? Please don't make me go back and rewind my sad collection of video tape cause I don't have TIVO! :(

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 5:04 p.m. CST

    Oh, btw.... Skyar almost escaped because Mindsquisher

    by flanaganagain

    Skylar almost escaped because Mindsquisher was talking with Claire at her house and not doing his job squishing Skylar at the paper company!

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 5:12 p.m. CST

    Masi Oka on Reno!!

    by torpor_haze

    ttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=je7eboTHmNo Funny shit.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 6:10 p.m. CST

    Flanaganagain

    by kuryakin

    But he was doing his job. He and Claire's father left together to mindwipe a bunch of people. He was sent by Claire's father to mindwipe Claire but took the opportunity to flex the old vocal chords and tell her that daddy was evil. That's why it doesn't make sense that either he or Mt Bennet were the ones suppressing Sylar's power - they both chose to leave. I think it's more likely there was some technology that they were relying on to suppress Sylar that turned out not to work.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 6:28 p.m. CST

    Evil? Maybe

    by Alientoast

    I dont think he's evil, I just think he's trying to protect Claire. He has gone to great lengths to keep Claire more or less "secret". I personally think he just wanted to wipe all the recent Sylar stuff so Claire could go back to her secret life again.

  • Dec. 6, 2006, 8:55 p.m. CST

    HRG's purpose is not limited to Claire

    by chrth

    Remember what he tells Isaac: Claire's parent(s) resisted the Pulp Faction/Legion of Neutral and perished, and he took her in. Granted, he could've been lying, but I don't think so. HRG has been in this business for a lonnnng time.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 12:47 a.m. CST

    chrth and biggles both share the award...

    by chromedome

    ... for funniest entries in this TB, IMHO: <p>chrth, for the "... so it must be something that suppresses brain functions. Maybe they have all the TVs set to Studio 60?" Beautiful!!<p>biggles for: "In the "Millenium" theory, while a host of physical beings, including Cheryl Ladd, Susannah Hoffman, and Kris Kristofferson, enter a wormhole (or interdimensional portal), only Kris Kristofferson will emerge on the other side, with career intact." (sort of a wormhole conservation of talent principle)<p>My gratitude to both of you for the laugh out loud moments.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 12:59 a.m. CST

    Nikki, SplodoPeter, and Nathan...

    by chromedome

    Nikki: while I appreciate the detailed description of a known psychological disorder to explain Nikki/Jessica (kudos to Psynapse for the info), I suspect that there has to be more to it in this show. The theme of the show is genetic mutations, after all, and Jessica (or PMSsica--cred to Shepherd Bauer for that handle) sports a tattoo. So Psynapse accurately describes a Real World condition and scenario, but in this Heroes 'verse, something else also has to be involved.<p>Peter's cough was puzzling, and suggests that either it was not due to a simple ailment that Claire Proximity would have cured, or if it was, then his ability to mimic is waning. Much comment about the later stage "dream" sequence has occurred already, so I will just add that when he had his train vision, it was Hiro from the future with a message--not an unalterable vision of the future. And, if he mimics the powers of others, maybe he was mimicing the SplodoPower of someone else--the team realized he was spontaneously mimicing before they could get him away from whoever the real Splodo was, and so had to turn and run away from him. <p>Finally, no one seems to have mentioned his early dream sequence, in which Nathan became Sylar. This combined with the 'tude Nathan always has, and the sinister look Nathan was sporting in the final dream sequence suggests to me that Nathan is EVIL INCARNATE, or at least a sneaky villain. He is a politician for god's sake, that was our FIRST clue right there! They spoon-fed us that one!<p>cheers

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 1:09 a.m. CST

    Peter's Splodo moment...

    by chromedome

    ...might not be literal at all. It could simply be a symbolic message: If he is mimicing others, and the only one who is moving toward him is Nathan, and Peter gets all Splodofied, then maybe it is just a symbolic message that Nathan is behind the coming Blast.<p>Maybe there is not a literal Splodo--but could he not be mimicing the Radioactive Dude, if a-mimicing he must be?

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 1:16 a.m. CST

    Pixies demise...

    by chromedome

    ...confuses and frightens me (I am a simple caveman talkbacker!--okay, most of you probably don't get that reference--more's the pity)<p>First, she has Voice, so she can command Sylar to do ANYTHING. Seems like she could have protected herself a little better. And seems like she need not have planned on giving him a gun. She could have given him poison, or sleeping pills to OD on , or a whole variety of things. So it seems a little sloppy to me--more like a We Need To Kill Somebody for DRAMA, SHOCK and AWE, and a way to let Sylar escape. Speaking of which...<p>...why could Sylar suddenly use his powers on Pixie, but not before or on others? Was he holding back--seems unlikely from the earlier scenes, where he would have ripped Claire's dad a host of new orifices if he could have. So why? Sloppy writing, or deliberate and careful stuff that will be revealed in due time? I hope it is the latter, but I am worried it is the former.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 1:21 a.m. CST

    I like that the Haitian Suppressor may...

    by chromedome

    ...be a good guy after all. He may know that Claire is crucial to saving the world, and knows that she needs to know who and what she really is. That would be cool! ProtectoDad may be risking the destruction of the world by trying to mind-wipe-protect his daughter. He doesn't, as it turns out, seem to be a bigger picture kind of guy, but a guy who is focused on protecting his daughter's life, and not concerned about leveraging her skills. So he is not a bad guy, but maybe misguided or narrow minded.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 1:38 a.m. CST

    Chrome, HRG might have a power...

    by Lenny Nero

    ...to block powers. As far as I know, Claire has never done her healing around her dad. As has been pointed out, HRG says to Sylar that he is the only person he knows who has more than one power; if that's true, then the Haitian's ability to erase memories is his one true power, he does not, in fact, have the power to also block powers. Then again, he does block Parkman's power at the bar, and HRG was nowhere to be found, so now my head will explode. That is all. (I know when HRG was in the room with Sylar, Sylar visibly could not use his powers. Why he could when Eden was there I do not know. Maybe they'll explain that her power of persuation may have "unlocked" some kind of block on his mind or whatever. Another head explodee, ugh...)

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 2:53 a.m. CST

    Masi Oka- the total breakout star of the 2006 TV season

    by Ben Addiction

    A geeky Japanese nerd type? Who coulda fucking predicted THAT one? Everyone loves this guy - me included. Still, how random...

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 2:53 a.m. CST

    The reason why Zach is off the show...

    by roccotheripper

    Thomas Dekker is set to play John Connor in Fox's drama pilot "The Sarah Connor Chronicles," from WBTV and C2, the company of Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines producers Mario Kassar and Andrew Vajna. Written by Josh Friedman, the project takes place after the events depicted in Terminator 2: Judgment Day and follows Sarah Connor (Lena Headey), a modern warrior and loving single mom to 15-year-old son John (Dekker). Dekker recurs on NBC's hit new drama "Heroes" as Zach, Claire's (Hayden Panettiere) friend and confidant.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 5:59 a.m. CST

    chromedome: why Sylar's powers suddenly worked

    by chrth

    R.I.PixieChick was trying to use her own power. If the room was a power suppressor, she would've needed to turn off the suppression.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 7 a.m. CST

    Mindsquisher/Haitian Zero's "one" power

    by chrth

    Mindsquisher can erect mental barriers. Thus he can protect both HRG and himself from mind-reading. In terms of memory-erasure, he's able to raise permanent(?) barriers that isolate the specific memories.<p> Now, the question is, why can he raise permanent memory barriers but mind-protection barriers require his presence for HRG? My guess is that memory barriers are passive while mind-protection barriers are active, and if Haitian Zero wasn't around, HRG wouldn't be able to withstand mental assaults.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 7:02 a.m. CST

    Another reason why Zach is off the show

    by chrth

    From all appearances, Claire is going to be on a roadtrip sometime in the near future. It would be a loose end dramatically to have a friend of hers not start asking questions/looking for her after she 'disappears'.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 10:39 a.m. CST

    "Another reason why Zach is off the show"...

    by mbeemer

    I thought you were going to say the actor asked for more money! :-)

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 10:38 a.m. CST

    Was Claire scooped or just partial?

    by leesheri

    I thought the Haitian guy said that he wasn't going to do it and he asked her if she could keep a secret. I watched it again and am still confused. Did he leave some thing in particular or did he not do it and expects her to keep her mouth shut and pretend that she was. Why did he speak to Claire and pretends not to speak at all. This character, Haitian seems really cool. Can't wait to see more of him. He nodded when Pixie Chick said that they should kill Sylar. So, he has to be a good guy. BTW I apologize if this was already discussed, didn't notice it in the hundreds of posts up there.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 1:04 p.m. CST

    ABOUT ZACH..

    by JBouganim

    HES PRETTY GAY...WHEN I FIRST STARTED WATCHING THIS SHOW IM LIKE WHERE DO I KNOW THIS KID. THEN I REMEMBERED..HONEY I SHRUNK THE KIDS TV SHOW. http://youtube.com/watch?v=81xNnavRbgk Thats a video of him rejecting a girl because of his gayness. I want him to stop bothering my Claire. We know he like men. Hook him up with Niki's son

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 1:06 p.m. CST

    FOR THE LINK..

    by JBouganim

    you have to close up the url... http://youtube.com/watch?v=81x NnavRbgk the other post has the x and N spaced

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 4:01 p.m. CST

    Guys, don't forget about the Indian kid who can enter.

    by Lost Skeleton

    dreams. He uses dreams to tell you what you need to know and he may have been helping Peter understand what he has to do and who he needs to do it with to stop the bomb in NYC. That is why he saw all those "Heroes". The Indian kid may be telling him that he needs to find these Heroes and bring them to NYC to help him save NYC. Just a thought

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 5:12 p.m. CST

    cookylamoo, are you mad?

    by chrth

    We still haven't met Magneto, Morph or Magik.<p> Speaking of Morph, I'm wondering if the dinosaur Hiro fights is actually a Morph-style villain that we meet much later this season or next.<p> I do like the fact that people keep asking Isaac to paint stuff that they hope will help them with what's next, but it doesn't.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 9:25 p.m. CST

    chrth...

    by torpor_haze

    you're right. Isaac is just a plot device, he's just trailer within a show.

  • Dec. 7, 2006, 10:57 p.m. CST

    They need a tracker...

    by SooperHearO

    I hope they come up with a hero that can track other heroes. Kind of like a super-bloodhound -- like Caliban of X-Men lore. Wouldn't be surprised to see him employed by Linderman.

  • Dec. 8, 2006, 12:59 p.m. CST

    Mr Bennet's power

    by warland

    I think it's obvious that cheerleader-dad has a power and what that power is: he has the power to suppress others' powers. That would explain 1.) why Eden couldn't use her voice power on him, 2.) why Claire didn't heal immediately after sticking her hand through the plate glass, 3.) why the Haitian (who appears to have a different agenda than his boss) doesn't just wipe cheerleader-dad's memories, 4.) why psi-cop couldn't read anyone's mind when cheerleader dad was in the next room... and most importantly why Sylar couldn't escape his cell while cheerleader-dad was present, but COULD when Eden came in. In between Sylar may have been biding his time becaue he covets obtaining cheerleader-dad's power.

  • Dec. 9, 2006, 5:05 a.m. CST

    LAST!!!

    by Shermdawg

    ...

  • Dec. 9, 2006, 11:38 a.m. CST

    Saving Peter

    by double click

    Wasn't the explosion that was seen at ground level. It makes sense if you wanted to save Peter from exploding to move him far enough from the person he was drawing the power from. So flying him away might stop him from exploding if it is really him. Still freezing time or teleporting him away would make even more sense.