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A Spy Tip About The Silver Surfer?!
Hey, everyone. ”Moriarty” here.
Okay, here’s your grain of salt. Take that first. And now, check out this tidbit we just got in about the new FANTASTIC FOUR sequel. Personally, I’m very curious about how they’re going to handle The Silver Surfer in this film. It’s a pretty wild character, one of the most fantastic of the Marvel icons that anyone’s attempted to bring to the live-action screen so far. I’m going to do a little more poking into this to see if there’s more we can learn about the approach...
Hello Moriarty,
"Man in Suit" note here.......
I have a confirmation from a colleague from Spectral Motion FX that the Silver Surfer, played by Doug Jones, is NOT going to be a computer generated or motion capture based character like Davy Jones from Pirates 2. The character is being created using a body-suit that is sprayed in a chrome-ish, silver paint scheme.It also appears that the face of the surfer is a fixed, contemplative expression in the head piece appliance with limited mouth movement that will be articulated by Jones' performance in the suit. Additionally, there have been numerous challenges related to placing him within a green screen environment.
Is it me or does it seem odd that an effect that was perfected in 1990/91 with Terminator 2's "T-1000" is being passed over in favor of using a sophisticated Power Rangers suit? Why this is not Motion capture or a 3D based character work is beyond me. Economics? Performance? After John Knoll's landmark mo-cap work on Pirates, should there be any other contemporary effect choice/tool for this 2 year window of FX production? Very odd choice, seems risky in the land of fickle fan boy culture. We'll see how it plays.
Due to NDA's and the tip, Please keep my name anonymous,
Call me: MOLE MAN
"Man in Suit" note here.......
I have a confirmation from a colleague from Spectral Motion FX that the Silver Surfer, played by Doug Jones, is NOT going to be a computer generated or motion capture based character like Davy Jones from Pirates 2. The character is being created using a body-suit that is sprayed in a chrome-ish, silver paint scheme.It also appears that the face of the surfer is a fixed, contemplative expression in the head piece appliance with limited mouth movement that will be articulated by Jones' performance in the suit. Additionally, there have been numerous challenges related to placing him within a green screen environment.
Is it me or does it seem odd that an effect that was perfected in 1990/91 with Terminator 2's "T-1000" is being passed over in favor of using a sophisticated Power Rangers suit? Why this is not Motion capture or a 3D based character work is beyond me. Economics? Performance? After John Knoll's landmark mo-cap work on Pirates, should there be any other contemporary effect choice/tool for this 2 year window of FX production? Very odd choice, seems risky in the land of fickle fan boy culture. We'll see how it plays.
Due to NDA's and the tip, Please keep my name anonymous,
Call me: MOLE MAN
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Thanos bitches!
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I should have said take your salt with a grain of First! but I cant always be on fire... sigh
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Damn...they should go the t1000 route! But I like this also!
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gonna have to sit a long time for makeup every day. FIRST thing in the morning, too... ;o)
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hell yeah, again I'm first!!
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I'm first you set of clown shoes. To be frank, I hope they pull this off because I like to see 'practical' effects as appose to computer generated.
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please dont mess this up.........
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This movie will be as terrible as the first one... don't nobody get their hopes up
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FIRST!!!! OH YEAH!!! The choice to go with T-1000 would be perfect, but I will resist from judging until I see actual screens of the Silver Surfer in motion. This movie will have a budget of millions of dollars. How bad could the effects be?
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CG would be better
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How can anyone complain about the filmmakers using a real actor to portray a character in a film? Madness. As far as I'm concerned, so far so good.
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I kind of like the idea of the Silver Surfer being more than CGI. Not a disgrace. I am actually getting interested in seeing this movie. The first one was terrible.
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they used a costume and then touched it up with CGI?
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The accuracy of the 'tip' aside, can you guys really conceive of a silver surfer physical costume that would look less cheesy and fake than even mediocre mo-cap CGI? Granted, CGI can be overused, and is still a few years off being able to consistently fool the eye, but jesus, I can only see this ending badly.
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Or Doom at the end of the first F4 movie. They will have the actor in a suit on set to interact with the other actors and then improve his looks with CGI.
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No matter what they do the essence of the character will be spot on
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it's an old way of thinking. And apparantly one that really has a hold of the fantastic four franchise.
Cause GOOD GOD. That THING costume looks like styrofoam painted with house paint. Looks like ASS on screen just as everyone suspected after the leaked images. -
Coulda fooled me. Looked like crap, like a chintzy 1980s suit and nothing more. I was embarrassed for Michael Chiklis, whose performance saved the character but could not do the same for the movie. At this point I still can't believe that an extraterrestrial like Surfer could enter the silly world created in FF1, where a 24 year old Alba passes for some kinda astro-scientist instead of a stripper.
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CGI is great but if they can do it with REAL stuff then do it. I would have to see it to understand it fully but this is intriguing. You know what isn't intriguing.....Tim Story directing another FF movie.
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As with everything, CGI is only as good as the person wielding it. It's funny to think that special effects actually looked worse once CGI became really popular (Spiderman, for instance, looked terrible). With better effects, and directors who are hopefully more adept, this sort of de-evolution will hopefully be at an end. As for the Silver Surfer, I'd go for CGI, but whatever they do it's really like they're just rearraingin the chairs on the Titanic. God, this movie is gonna blow.
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Sep 14, 2006 7:49:46 AM CDT
So, he'll look like skier in one of those body condoms?
by big bad clone
Will they at least CGI out the seams?
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Look at how poorly the Thing and Doctor Doom were depicted in the first film. Do you honestly expect Story & Co. to bring us a cool-looking Silver Surfer that doesn't look like an alien from the original 1960s Star Trek series?
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Sounds like a foam suit sprayed with Ford silver car paint.
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be any better? o_O
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This is plain dumb. The one character in cinema history they absolutely should use CGI for and they go this cheap ass route. This does not bode well. It means they're still making this with the same budget restrictions as the first crap fest.
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Http://www.theblackdiamondeffect.com/Galactus.mov
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..with that cast and that director
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this is obviously fake. in huge movies like this they do makeup/cgi tests BEFORE they start filming so they don't run into too many problems- because who wants to LOSE money, also- on tim story's blog apparantley weta is working on the silver surfer.
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I heard they are going to do the human torch by dunking the actor in petrol. That's gasolene for you people in the colonies.
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Isn't this exactly how they did Colossus on X3? He looked OK in the end, but then we never saw him up close.
Still a Static Silver Surfer mask = Nipples on the Batsuit = Flames on Optimus -
It's clearly either some sort of stand in, something to use as a base for the CG/mo-cap character (not unlike the Styrophome Yoda or Scooby-doo used on set), or, as has been suggested, something that will be augmented by CG later on. I refuse to believe that even Tim Story would be happy with what sounds like a guy in a leotard and a expressionless mask. Oh, and for the record, for all its faults (and there were many), I still kinda enjoyed the first FF film - Johnny and Ben were pretty much nailed, character-wise.
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being transformed into orange styrofoam. Artistic license, I suppose.
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...to colonize you!
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Also every other idiot in TB claiming FIRST! is starting to piss me off. It's called a delay people...
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Oh, damn.
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I'm not creative.
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Sep 14, 2006 9:23:37 AM CDT
hell, why not get Mackenzie Crook? He's skinny enough
by stovetopstuffin'
I mean, I love Doug Jones. His Abe Sapien, and even the Gentleman in the Buffy Episode, are fine examples of his work. But the boy is tall and skinny. I'm not a big Silver Surfer fan or anything, by far, but isn't he somewhat classical hero proportions?
By the way, I love Mackenzie Crook too. But if you watch the extra footage from the office season 2, when you see him in those bicycle shorts.....toothpicks for legs. -
...does this mean they'll be setting Chris Evans on fire to play the Torch?
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I mean, did you SEE FF1?! Ifthe first one was that bad, how can the second one be even tolerable w/ most of the same team?
IMHO this just feels like "David Hasslehoff IS Nick Fury!" all over again...
Bah. -
Yep, that's right - I'm gonna keep on saying it.
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Darth Fucking Vader is an admitted rip-off, of Doom. You CAN'T fuck it up. Story did..
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i don't know what's funnier, the fact that "mole man" actually thinks a.)anyone would do a silver surfer in such a lame fashion or b.) that any retard on earth would believe it. or is it the fact that he picked the right crowd to tell feed this steaming pile to. cuz you bunch of nerds and momma's boys would whine about anything. if this were true i would complain also. but it's not. and i love how you are all writting off the film just like you did the last one. the first FF movie wasn't great but it was pretty enjoyable. you would have known that if you could have been the least bit open minded and take off your geek-colored glasses and see that your little nit-picking did ruin the movie for anyone but yourself. why don't you go ahead and write this movie off as well and when it comes out the rest of the world will enjoy it for what it is and you will be up in arms about what it is not. sorry you can't have everything your way except in your little AICN bubble.
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...his elaborate, decorative burial headdress that serves no function prevents him from doing so.
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and besides if they want to add a shine and glare to the Surfer they can do that with cg in post. CG artists are not good enough to capture the nuances of the human body which is all the surfer is.
Even mocap has it's limitations but we'll see when the first pics of this suit surface.
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Tell you what man this story smells like shyte to me. I reckon the surfer rocks but only as Galactus' herald. If they don't have him linked to galactus then the only reason I'd see this is for Alba (reason enough really)..
As far as the costume is concerned there is NO CHANCE ON EARTH that they'd do him in a bodysuit with a static face, it'd look a load of bollocks. I reckon this is just someone having fun with rumor stirring to see what us loser fanboys have to say about it - calm down people it'll be ok!
Anyways, the first one was proper gash, it was really really stinking so I'm not too excited about it - I do like the sillyness of Galactus though, but if he's not there then the silver surfer just looks like something from a meatloaf album sleeve. -
If it was CGI you'd all be bitching. Now you're bitching cos it's not?
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Wow... I was just about to mention Galactus and you pull out the Clancy Brown. FUCKING AWESOME DUDE, you're a genious! Wait, is Galactus even gonna be in this one?
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Sep 14, 2006 10:22:08 AM CDT
Costellopalooza, I think you mean a Joe Satriani album
by cletus van damme
"Surfing With The Alien" 'nuff said.
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...mole's are known for digging and poor vision...and saying boo urns
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THANK YOU!!!............You don't know how long I was stewing over that one! I couldn't remember for the life of me what album i'd seen that on!! Well anyways, just to reiterate, no galactus/no surfer - the two are just too silly to go out alone, they need each other to back each other up when all the mean and moody hero's and villains start taking the piss out of them..
I really want Galactus in this film, but I bet they pussy out and make him normal size! -
Diabolical! Avi Arad needs to be fired!
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...but I can't honestly pretend I know how it'd look either way until I see the final product. Hopefully they know what they're doing.
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Would be a brilliant bit of casting. A) think of him with no hair in the first Matrix- he's a good enough physical specimen and he's got a handsome enough face that if it was rendered as a computer image it would fit the Alex Ross surfer's profile pretty well. B) He can't help always sounding like a stoner- exactly like Norrin Radd. C) If your questioning Keanu's credentials to play a surfer of any kind; I suggest you turn your TV on during a weekend afternoon and catch one of the inevitable showings of POINT BREAK.
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The Silver Surfer would like almost exactly identical to the T-1000. I'm more interested in how they'll pull off Galactus. Now THERE'S a character that will look ridiculous in any medium except comics.
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Use underoos with The Surfer? Like Byrne did? Sux! Go for the Buscema looks!
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I'm curious if you Brits refer to any of the other independent countries that you managed to blunder right out of your empire as "colonies"? You know, like India, Hong Kong, Jamaica, South Africa, Kenya or a third of the Middle East? Why is it you don't admit to still having Austrailia, Canada or New Zealand as part of your made-up "commonwealth" run by your powerless Queen who exists only to spend tax money and serve as head of your irellevant(sic) and unpopular church? Why is that exactly? Also; do you think any team can beat Chelsea this season? I sure hope so.
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WETA DIGITAL ARE HANDLING HIM-SPECTRAL MOTION ARE DOING A PRACTICAL SUIT FOR 'CERTAIN' SEQUENCES.
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I bet you're 100% on about Galactus' size when/if he appears in the movies. I bet they make him closer to a Beyonder type than actually Galactus.
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Sep 14, 2006 11:22:16 AM CDT
Hell with the Surfer, I want Aunt May as Golden Oldie!
by cletus van damme
That was the shittiest Marvel Team Up ever.
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Hahahah! Why not...every other retard on here gets to say it!!!
That being said, I just don't see a guy in a suit pulling off the Surfer...just like Chiklis in a suit didn't really create the Thing. Sure his characterization was dead on, but his costume lacked in many, many different areas. I'm hopeful the MoleMan doesn't know what he's talking about and we get something that actually works. -
The 1994 Fantastic Four film. Seriously its entirely in line with the awful costumes in that crap fest.
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did any of you actually SEE the first F4??? great caeser's ghost... if i could have any chunk of time from my life back, that would be the one. hands down.
so, why even waste time, writing about this? are you guys THAT bored? -
putting a chrome character on a green screen? you know what colour chrome reflects when put next to anything green? thats right, green. plus you'll never get the 100% relfection surface that makes the silver surver so damn cool using paint. it cannot be done without CHROMING HIM and that would kill the poor guy. the most annoying thing is, the effect that the silver surfer would require the skills of a novice texture artist. the hardest bit would be building the 360 HDRI maps for lighting and refelctions. basically, there wouldnt be a cheaper way of doing right. using a reflective suit on a green screen background would create much more work for any effects team than actually just building it in 3D. Rotoscoping is a bitch, they'll avoid it where they can, thats the whole point of greenscreen.
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Re: Kirby's inability to roll over in his grave. I always wondered what was up with all the headdresses and whatnot.
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Keanu isn't inspired casting as anything. He's stealing money moreso than pretty much any actor in Hollywood. If you somehow caused Keanu to have 20,000 times the acting talent he has now, he'd still only be, what, Patrick Swayze?
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Marilyn Manson costume in the Dope Show video was slick and it made it look like he was made out of plastic. It looked good! I assume that the way they made that costume is a perhaps what they are doing for the Surfer?
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...but I didn't find the first FF movie to be THAT bad. It had it's bad moments, but overall it wasn't the WORST comics-adaptation movie I've ever seen. If they can pull off the SS with a live actor, I say go for it as live characters and set pieces have more actual weight than purely CG pieces unless the right director and effects team (such as PJ & WETA or Spielberg & ILM) are working on the project. Surely they can't muck the Surfer up mush more than the bastardized version of Dark Phoenix we got in X-MEN: THE LAST STAND. She was a massive ripoff of the Dark Willow character from BUFFY who was actually inspired by Dark Phoenix in the first place!!! Yeeeesh!
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Sep 14, 2006 12:21:11 PM CDT
Just use the Power Cosmic to overcome greenscreen probs
by det. john kimble
The Herald of Galactus deserves better than some Reynolds Wrap.
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Fantastic Four was such a botching of what should have been a nice franchise. I was giving this follow-up all sorts of slack because I would like for them to get righted. Turning the Silver Surfer into a very worldly "guy in costume" instead of otherworldly CG with the full range of motion and emotion is a very foolish mistake. Does this really surprise anyone, though? Instead of giving this franchise a silver platter, they've been cutting corners and hedging their bets - starting with their casting and interpretation of the characters straight through to this going cheap on an iconic comic character. If these guys just invested a bit more care and concern, they might *gasp* actually make a good Fantastic Four film.
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Props to someone who uses "ByTor" as his handle. I eagerly await the first flame war between him and the guy with the user handle "SnowDog".
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Props for getting the reference. I know Snow Dog wasn't the winner, but Snow Dog sounds stupid...which brings us back on topic. The first FF movie was horrible. The only worthwhile element (aside from watching Jessica Alba, but, really, there are plenty of attractive women to watch in better movies) was SOME of the back-and-forth between the Torch and Ben. THAT'S NOT A MOVIE, YOU STUPID STUDIO FUCKWADS. Consider splurging on a plot next time. And maybe some acting. And a Thing that doesn't look like crud stuck to the bottom of that cooler that everyone's got on a shelf in the garage that they haven't looked at for five years and now they're scared to.
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what a bunch of shit
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http://www.superherohype.com/news/fantasticfournews.php?id=4523
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Buy a sarcasm detector; dufus. And if Keanu Reeves had 10,000 times the acting ability he'd be johnny Depp- do the math
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since the green would reflect on the suit and then key out parts his body. They should just do CGI like they did with The Human Torch which looked awesome.
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THIS'LL BE THE SUIT USED FOR GREENSCREEN COMPING-OF COUSRCE IT'S GOING TO BE MOCAPPED-HE'S TRAVELLING 100 MILES AN HOUR ON A BOARD.
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It's not about using one effects technique over another it's about using both to create the best reality within the context of the film. This seems to be the direction of this action on the film (or I hope so).
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The first film was shit and made a ton of money. So of course as good businessmen, they are going to make another shit movie and make another big load of money that they can spend on coke and whores...you guys are kind of dense sometimes to not understand the obvious.
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They forgot to mention that Silver Surfer will also be anatomically correct in the film. They're just gonna strip down Jones & spraypaint his body. They don't anticipate an 'R' rating as nude women with their privates painted are even allowed on tv. As I recall, when he didn't have his surfboard, he was known as Silver Streaker.
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Upon reading this the first image that leaps to mind is tacky grey spandex, but I sincerely doubt they'd half-ass the silver surfer after all the shite they took for their awful Thing outfit. I'm not sold on the suit idea until I see it in action, but I'm pretty glad they aren't doing the obvious CGI thing, because it was perfected back in T2, so why do something everybody's seen before? No matter if it sucks, you gotta appreciate the creativity. I just wish they'd recast Sue with someone who could act.
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I agree, Cletus' comment on why Kirby can't roll over in his grave was hilarious. And poignant: The FF film wasn't bad (the interplay between Ben and Johnny was spot-on, on the other hand, Doom was no Vader). But it lacked that wonderful Kirby melodrama, where even picking up a bar of soap had impact. Kirby and Lee knew what they were doing back then – for every this-is-the-end-of-the-world pronouncement, you'd get three everyday indignities (Ben taking a bath, Reed shaving while Galactus was readying his planet-eating device up on the roof, the Yancy Streeters' pranks on Ben, etc.). Ben really was the lightning rod, acknowledging that the plot twists were way over-the-top, but 'sheesh', that's the hand we're dealt. He found everything ridiculous before the reader did, and encouraged him to play along anyway. ("Geez, another one taking over the world? That's three this month, and they all come here to do it! Next time, I say let 'em have it!")
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Thats a bad sign.Sounds like they dont know what they are doin over there.If anyone recalls,Star Wars had a similar problem in Episode 3.Whenever they had 3PO in a greenscreen shot his shiny-ness kept reflecting all that green.So when they dropped him in a composite,he looked like he was beaming aboard.They had to go in and retouch all those shots with vis.
I could see them using the man in suit for other things.Like locations,and just Vis his face.
In the end,yeah I hated the first one.But Im glad they went with an actor instead of all CGI on Surfer.The thought of that was terrifying.
Not to live in the past but, yeah I still wish theyd of done it a circa 60's period piece.Thing ALONE looked cool,Thing standing in a crowd of normal people looked ,...out of place.(I would say lame ,but it doesnt apply)It looked like he walked in the location lot from a different shoot like"Hey, Im in this picture too" -
that mediocre doucebag who played Mr Fantastic. That guy isn't even tv-movie material.
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Not that that's a bad thing, necessarily, they're kind of slick. SS needs to be CG. A chrome body suit sounds like power rangers and we all know how ridiculous they look. And what's with the limited facial expression? CG is better than practical effects when you need something to move quickly and fluidly, which silver surfer obviously needs to. Bad move.
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HONESTLY.
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I can't help but wonder if his display of emotions, as FEEDBACK, was only acting, ...in a role with a fictional back-story of his father killing himself.
Perhaps we were moved by a good acting performance???
You decide.
What a surprise this is!
Here's a link, as proof:
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1794350/
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Isn't the main problem w/ CGI the fact that it looks so damn fake on certain things? I think that the Silver Surfer actuallt calls for being CGI. He has the look and motion that lends itself perfectly to CGI.I am sure they will come up w/ something cool. I would truly hope that someone at Marvel would be keeping a sharp eye on the look of SS. I don't think they would have let them use the SS in this film unless they do him justice. If they fuck this up m- that could destroy a SS stand alone flick before it even gets made - in turn costing everyone involved money in the long run. Fuck , I wish they would ditch this director! That one close-up of the Thing right before he stops the semi is abso-fu#*ing-lutely unforgiveable!
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Is kickin' back with his "real buddies" at the moment, laughing at that nerdy chump who swallowed the silver spandex story. Even funnier is how he sent it into a popular movie website, which published it. Funnier still, are the other chumps who believe it too.
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Thanks for the props. These quips aren't cheap, nice to know that one got some laughs!
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The X-Men films were filmed on the cheap in Canada. I firmly believe the film suffered because the studio wouldn't invest the money in it. So, when I see a movie filming in canada and suppose blockbuster i know it's on the cheap when it films in canada.
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...let me just say that it looked like Galactus ate a huge, Kirby-sized bag of Cheetos and crapped a statue.
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Sep 14, 2006 10:55:55 PM CDT
Perfected tech or not, CGI isn't right for Surfer...
by lettersoftransit
...the way it was for the robot in terminator 2, because the robot was a shape shifter and the surfer is not. That said, I am not sure the motionless and emotionless head is such a good idea. Surfer, as I recall, didn't emote much facially (though he did a lot verbally) but he did furrow the odd brow once in a while and here something they may have fogotten. When you got a good actor and you want the emotions underplayed, you can accomplish that by simply asking them to do it (or not, as the case may be)
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You can capture that emotion (or lack) of with mo-cap. Look at what they did with Kong - whether you liked the film or not, you gotta admit that Kong was a spectacular CG creation. They nailed the expressions and emotions of that big monkey. That said - Tim Story is no Peter Jackson.
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I mean, he was pretty much WHITE in the comic books. If they went with a White Silver surfer, they could do body paint easily, (would white pick up color from a greenscreen?)
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Sep 15, 2006 1:14:46 AM CDT
Originally BUDDY EBSEN was going to play Silver Surfer-
by bob cryptonight
--but he had a bad reaction to the silver paint makeup and they had to replace him with Ray Bolger. FACT!
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Referring to the US as the "colonies" is just a kind of twee jokey thing us Brits occasionally say, in a sort of "joke between transatlantic mates" type of way. Sorry you didn't get that and were therefore insulted. And no, sadly I don't think anyone will beat Chelsea this year.
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No make up at all, just Sammy bein' Sammy. "Yes, I'm a white silver surfer and I hope you burn in HELL!"
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As for me, I have just about had it with CGI characters. In a supporting role? Sure. Not as a lead. That would suck as it still looks like a video game, and that gets kinda old. Power ranger suit? No, but I'll take a good model/costume/makeup any day over a CGI character. Best Example? Aliens. No CGI and its fx are 10000000000000000000000x better than any video game CGI shit.
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Some of you people will never learn. These rumor starters know just where to go to blow smoke up peoples' asses and sit back and get their desired response. I can't speak on what's going on with the movie, but I know that the SS isn't going to be a guy in a power rangers type suit that painted silver.
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Harry dude, just give it a rest. We all know you have hatred for this film already. but at least lets all see some test footage or any type of footage before jumping the gun. I don't honestly have a lot of faith in FF2, but lets all just wait and see what happens.
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...did you really expect anything better? This sounds laughable. Silver spraypaint? Fixed expression? What?
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Doesn't sound like much of a character, but more like a plot device.
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Doug Jones as Norrin Radd is about one of the worst ideas I've heard in a long time. Almost as bad as making Bumblebee a mute who communicates using radio tunes and is like a loveable puppy dog.
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This film really is starting to sound like a movie version of a Power Rangers show. All they need to add now is a giant robot for the F4 to use to battle with Galacticus.
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