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Massawyrm Figures Out WHO KILLED THE ELECTRIC CAR!!
Hola all. Massawyrm here.
I want an electric car. No really. I want an electric car. Right now. But I can’t have one. At least I can’t buy one. The car companies won’t sell one to me. Why not? Well, that’s the question posed by the surprisingly middle of the road Who Killed the Electric Car?
Middle of the road? Really? I thought this was one of those new fangled liberal documentaries, railing on the Republicans. Think again my friend. This isn’t a film about saving the environment or what will happen if we don’t dump the combustion engine for electric vehicles (EV), this is a film educating the public on the next evolution in transportation and probing why forces have worked against its acceptance. It’s a love letter to the electric car – a love letter that makes it hard not to fall in love yourself.
But it sure seems to start off on one hell of a liberal footing. In fact, the first five minutes actually had me and a friend laughing pretty hard. One of the first shots of the film is of Ed Begley Jr. weeping at the funeral of an electric car. Immediately followed up by narration by Martin Sheen. It mentions pollution, global warming, and our dependence on foreign oil. I immediately began to think - Oh god, what have I gotten myself into? But that’s what’s so damned smart about it – that’s where they get you. I don’t care where you stand politically – this isn’t a film hell-bent on changing your views of the world or on political parties. It sets you up thinking you’ve just walked into a liberal push to change the world, then hits you square in the jaw as it becomes a very balanced look at the EV and the forces that did it in. For now.
What do you mean, for now? The EV is dead. Oh, far from it. As the documentary unfolds, you quickly learn that this isn’t the story of a bunch of greenies trying to save humanity. This is the story of a bunch of consumers, offered a product that changed their lives, a product they quite simply fell in love with – and then had it taken away by the company that had offered it to them. Why are there almost no fully electric vehicles on the road? Because they failed? Quite the contrary. The companies took them all back. This documentary sets out to find out why.
And it does so in a riveting fashion, through a series of interviews with people across the board – from the celebrities and average-joes who drove them, to the people tasked to sell them, to the corporate execs charged with generating a demand for them – we follow the story of the car companies release of these EVs on up to their subsequent “recall” and destruction of them. And it begins to piss you off. Because when they come back around to the Funeral for the electric car, you understand exactly why Ed Begley Jr. is crying.
And the documentary is incredibly honest about the product. It talks more about the limitations than it does the benefits. And yet, it’s hard to dissuade you – because the limitations are nothing compared to the benefits. One dealership mechanic’s comments on servicing the EVs will drop your jaw. It’s a fascinating, riveting and ultimately frustrating look at the future of transportation – a future we actually could have now, if there wasn’t so much money to be made in keeping the Combustion engine alive.
While Who Killed the Electric Car? isn’t the best documentary I’ve ever seen, insomuch as it’s not any kind of a tension builder, it certainly has excited me more than any Documentary has in years. I’ve spent all day researching the new breed of cars coming out from upstart motor companies (like the incredibly badass Tesla Roadster that streets next summer), and IMing buddies to talk about it. It’s a piece that will really get you talking and investigating the new technology. And it’s a movie that gets you angry about a great technology that can change our lives, but is being kept from us because it’s too good at what it does.
So will it offend Right Wingers? Probably just a little. The Bush Administration is mentioned for a short while, particularly the Administrations push to help kill the California legislation as well as their push for Hydrogen based cars. If you’re the type of person that can’t stand even the least bit of criticism of the current administration, then yes, there will be a few offensive minutes in this film. But overall, it’s very even handed in its approach, body checks several people throughout the political spectrum, and discusses every aspect of the EVs that no one else has bothered to tell us.
Really, it’s a film that makes me want to write a piece thousands of words long on my feelings about it and the info it revealed and led me to – but there’s no way I could tell it better than they do. It’s a film that changed the way I look at cars. I want an electric car. I want it now. Had you told me last week that I would have felt this way, I would have gotten one hell of a laugh out of it. I’m not laughing. In fact, I’m kind of pissed.
This is the very best kind of documentary there is. It’s one that will change the way you look at things. I highly recommend this film to anyone who is Eco-minded, wishes there was some magical way to reduce our dependence on foreign oil, loves documentaries exposing the corruption in big business or just plain loves technology. Who Killed the Electric Car?. has the chance to make a real impact on the way we live. It’s gonna show people what we’re missing out on and they’re gonna want one. Once people want them, companies will make them. And then it’s all over for the combustion engine. It won’t happen overnight, but it will happen, it is happening and no doubt this film will have a footnote in history as being the film that touched off our discussing it as a nation.
Until next time friends, smoke ‘em if ya got ‘em. I know I will.
Massawyrm
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JINGO!
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...and that's saying something.
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I got nothing...
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but once we solve that whole Energon cube problem, the electric car will be dead for good...
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I haven't seen this, but I generally agree with your opinion of most movies so I'll check it out. And hey is Reel Deal still on Wed? If so, what time?
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Below is a post I recently read in response to this film. I'm yet to see the film myself, so really have no idea how much of a balanced view it actually presents, but after reading this post I sure am a lot more 'iffy' on it than I was before..Sorta sounds like the electric car killed itself more than anything.......Are any of these issues addressed in the film at all, or do they quietly sweep them to the side? Anyways, blah blah...Should be an interesting watch regardless...
In the 90's GM produced a line of electric cars called the EV1
that had a following of hard core fans in California, Tom
Hanks and Mel Gibson among them. These cars had no trouble
accelerating and keeping up in California traffic, and once
they went from lead-acid to NiMH batteries, the range between
>charging was 130 miles. None of these cars were sold, however,
only leased. Once US Automakers managed to defeat California's
"zero emissions" requirement, GM quit renewing leases, repossessed
the cars, and destroyed them. A bunch of fans of the cars offered
GM $1.9 million for the last 78 used EV1's that were sitting in a
lot, but they were taken away and crushed. GM kept insisting
that no one wanted to buy the cars.
Some facts about the EV1, the research and development of which
was produced by _my_ division of GM, Hughes Electronics:
General Motors lost two billion dollars on the project, and lost
money on every single EV1 produced. The leases didn't even cover
the costs of servicing them.
The range of 130 miles is bogus. None of them ever achieved that
under normal driving conditions. Running the air conditioning or
heater could halve that range. Even running the headlights
reduced it by 10%.
Minimum recharge time was two hours using special charging
stations that except for fleet use didn't exist. The effective
recharge time, using the equipment that could be installed in a
lessee's garage, was eight hours. Home electrical systems simply
couldn't handle the necessary current draw for "fast" charging.
NiMH batteries that had lasted up to three years in testing were
failing after six months in service. There was no way to keep
them from overheating without doubling the size of the battery
pack. Lead-acid batteries were superior to NiMH in actual daily
use.
Battery replacement was a task performed by skilled technicians
taking the sorts of precautions that electricians do when working
on live circuits, because that's what they were doing -- working
on live circuits. You cannot turn batteries "off." This is the
reason the vehicles were leased, rather than sold. As long as
the terms of the lease prohibited maintenance by other than a
Hughes technician, GM's liability in the event of a screw-up was
much reduced. Technicians can encounter high voltages in hybrid
vehicles. In the EV1, there were _really_ high voltages present.
Lessees were complaining that their electric bills had increased
to the point that they'd rather be using gasoline.
One of the guys I worked with transferred to the EV1 program
after what was by then a division of Raytheon lost the C-130 ATS
contract. He's now back working for us. He has some interesting
stories, none of them good, though he did like the
company-subsidized apartment in Malibu. He said the car was a
dream to drive, if you didn't mind being stranded between
Bakersfield and Barstow on a hot July afternoon when a battery
blew up from the combined heat of the day and the current draw. -
Check out this website and drool. Some silicon valley geeks are taking on the big guys. Zero to sixty in four seconds.
http://www.teslamotors.com -
I guess I should've read the entire post before posting myself. Carry on.
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One problem with the electric car, how do we generate the juice to charge them? Imagine our overloaded electrical grids trying to charge 2 cars per house! We need to build more nuclear plants or find an alernative clean way to generate electricty or the electric car isn't pratical. In CT we've shut down several nuclear plants, and we just keep adding gas turbines to generate more power.
A windmill farm off of Cap Cod is currently being blocked by the Kennedy's since it might ruin their view.
Hopefully someday we'll have a Mister Fusion! -
...that your sign-off bugs the crap out of me every time I read it. You write with a sense of humour, and beats and timing are two/one of the most important things in comedy. Basically I'm being incredibly anal and feel free to ignore me but that sign-off just doesn't work as you have one beat too many. "Until next time friends, smoke 'em if ya got 'em" works. "Smoke 'em if ya got 'em, I know I will" sorta works, though not as well. The whole thing though? Too much. Sorry to all, but I just had to get that niggle off my chest. __________ Back on subject, thanks for the review. I've been wanting to see this since I saw the trailer, even if Begley is crazy. You would think though that sheer greed would have prompted one company to be at the point where they could offer a truly viable electric or hydro alternative just so that they could get the jump on the rest of the petrol/gasolene loving industry and have the market to themselves for years. Guess not.
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I'm sure you saw this coming a mile away Massa, but the reason the electric car was put out of commission was because the greedy fat cats want to keep getting richer. As clear a sign of the dark side of capitalism as there ever was. This review of course being printed right above your "Red Menace" Ant Bully review. I'm not pro-communism, anti-capitalism or any of that nonsense. I just thought I'd point out the big elephant in the living room.
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If you follow that link in the piece, it'll show you the company that's doing it. And they will have the jump for quite some time.
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Yeah - see the problem with your irony is that while I point out the Communist ideals of the film...I never once condemn them, nor the movie for it. Reread the piece - I simply have fun joking about the themes that are very prevalent in the film. It appears that the word Communist has ceased to be a description of a political philosophy and has become something of a swear word, like Fascist. It's hardly a Red menace piece, but people sure wanted to take it like one.
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I just thought I'd just get the obvious point out in the open before we saw someone come along saying "Massawyrm you hypocritical fuck!! Why don't you go suck Bill O'Reilly's cock!!" or something. Sort of like when Keanu Reeves shoots Jeff Daniels in the leg in Speed. Aw, forget it.
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The executives oil companies and car companies would chop the heads off anyone buying electric cars if they could. They'd boil you alive if it helped them make another couple of bucks in profits, so they can afford a little extra coke or a prettier whore. That is business. That is human nature. That is reality.
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Mother fucker! You shot me in the leg! ;)
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Theyre slow, too small, have short ranges, and have zero infrastucture. They are not yet practical and convenient enough to succeed. Period. Not everything you dont like is a conspiracy you nutbags.
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damn porch monkeys
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Or someone might point out that you need either coal or uranium to make the electricity a plug in car uses. And we wouldn't want either of those nasty things in pristine California, would we.
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Here's a shovel.
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Cancelled due to a lack of sales. I wonder how many of these oh-so-concerned tbers actually bought one.
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Is it any mystery why electric cars aren't around, or why most fuel efficient cars featured in news articles aren't made by large corporations? For the greater part of history the phrase "follow the money" is apt to explain most major decisions concerning the overall state of affairs. Simply those who are in power and profit from the present have it in their best interests to ensure their profits will increase, and that's ensured especially if what you need tommorow is what you also need today i.e. gas. Hence the neccessary evil of capitilism.
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Oh, wait - I'm about a hundred years too late for that fight. Damn horseless carriages!
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the honda insight is one of the ugliest cars i've ever seen. i'm what you would call an oh-so-concered tber, but i don't own a hybrid (it would be a prius) because i dump loads of time and money into an EDUCATION. *ahem* maybe they'll take a cue from tesla motors and make an eco-friendly car that a) doesn't look like crap and b) people over six feet tall will be able to fit in. they've got until i get my college degree to sort it out.
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Hey kids and child molesters,
Just got out of Michael Mann's Miami Vice staring Jamie Foxx and Colin Ferrell. So how was it? Well it was just okay. Which is not good, not bad. If you want to see a good Michael Mann movie go watch Heat. Then watch Heat again because its that fucking good. Then watch Collateral.
The movie has really nothing to do with the TV show, except for the character names. Thats about it. Oh yeah and there cops and one is black and the other is white and they live in Miami. Thats about it. They dont act like the characters of the show or anything. One thing about this movie..is its played real. There is nothing amazing happening here. No amazing stunts like MI3. Its set in the real world. And like people in the real world, these characters are boring. You will give two shits about Colin and Jamie in this film. These characters are boring..and you dont care about them on a emotional level. The Problem is Colin gets about 70% of the screen time in this movie. Jamie I think has 2 scenes in the movie that Colin is not in. Colin might have 20 scenes with no Jamie. And when Colin is on the screen..He is just sitting there stairing at the camera, with a fucked up look on his face. His character is played almost the same way he played John Smith in that Pochantas movie "The New World" he did. He does not do alot in the movie. So the more interesting of the characters Jamie, has a lot less screen time then the boring Colin.
Another fucked up part of the movie is the fucking. There are two sex scenes in the movie that do nothing. Its that slow fucking in slow motion with music. Its not sex. There making love. And there long sex scenes. Each one is about 3 min long. So for 3 minutes we are stairing at really really soft core stuff in slow motion. You see no tits..No Pussy...No cumming..NOTHING!!! If your going to put some sex in your fucking movie atleast make it so a guy might get a hard on by watching it. Why the fuck do you Michael Mann think the audience would care to see Colin or Jamie's back to the camera..covering up the Lady their screwing for a total of 6 minutes? Why? I hate when directors put G rated sex in their movies for no fucking reason. Either put hardcore sex in your film...Or dont put that shit in it at all!!! If your not even going to show a breast or some pussy...Then dont fucking put it in your film...6 minutes of watching Jamie and Colin bobbing up and down in slow motion to music does shit for us. It does not advance the story..It does not make us hard....Its fucking useless...Your puting everyone in the theater to sleep!!
The plot of this movie is that Jamie and Colin must go undercover has drug smugglers to make a bust on a drug lord. Same plot we seen a million times in movies...They gain trust of the bad guys..then their cover gets blown...then one of their loved ones gets kidnapped..And they must save her and stop the bad guys... There really is not alot of action in the movie..and not a whole lot of tension either. Heat and Collateral were way more intense and interesting to look at. You actually cared about the characters in those films. There is a shoot out scene in the end that is signature Michael Mann that is great. But the film on a whole...is just okay. And in a summer of huge blockbusters thats just not good enough. I dont see this movie as a franchiese.. It looks like it will be one and done... And I expect after a good openning weekend this movie will fizzal...As bad word of mouth will hurt it.. So its a okay movie.. You wont be mad at it. You will just wish it was more..more Jamie....more action....more character development...and less Colin...and less (I cant believe Im fucking saying it) sex..
http://www.youtube.com/user/DarthEvilDead -
Electrical is only one of many solutions that should be implemented immediately. Natural Gas, Biodiesel, Ethanol, Solar, Wind, Tidal will take part in the move toward cleaner and/or renewable fuels. The Tesla car is beautiful! Too bad it's marketed for the wealthy. And to those that complain about battery range, the new battery technology has cars going 150-200 miles per charge (see AC Propulsion).
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Seriously. Oh, wait. I think it's the Stonecutters that held back the electric car. No, really seriously now. I'd have bought a hybrid if I could have afforded it. My only trepidation about the electric car is the inability to take sprawling cross-country drives, which I have enjoyed on occasion (and are very practical and necessary on other occasions). Of course, I imagine if the technology had been given a chance to flourish, you'd be able to put more than 100-150 miles in a day on one of those electric cars if you wanted.
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...who asked why concerned TBers didn't buy the discontinued Honda Insight. I could not afford a hybrid. If I could have afforded one, I would have bought one. Good point raised above, though, that I had considered: if everyone on the road was instantly and magically driving an electric car, the current energy crisis/blackout problem would be much worse.
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I'm a biodiesel guy myself and while I love the intent of the people who signed on to the electric car in the end it had a net polluting effect in that the amount of fossil fuels burned in generating the electricity to charge the thing was more than what internal combustion engines used. I can't wait for us to get rid of our usage of all fossil fuels and even my biodiesel emits polutants but the EV was not the way to help the environment.
Massa, did they cover this at all in the documentary. -
Jul 27, 2006 4:38:38 AM CDT
Gotta agree with the above...you need cash for hybrids
by big_bubbaloola
On one of the car progs over here in Blighty, they reviewed a hybrid SUV. Very good on and off road. While crawling thru town (as most SUV's do in this country) it sucks practically no fuel. Plenty of space as well. And the make of this high scoring, eco-friendlier car......LEXUS!!!!! It retails at something around
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Damned sexy chubby fingers!! DAMN THEM TO HELL!!!!!!!
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Sone of the weds you used in the Ant Bully review:"bizarre," "subversive", "What? You think I
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Electric cars will prevail once the power problem is solved, which will be sooner than you think. We stand at the precipice of rapid technological change, so fast you'll get whiplash. Or haven't you heard? The Singularity is Near! http://www.singularity.com/
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For the sequel to "Who Killed Roger Rabbit", and this is the shit they give me? I'm very disappointed.
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And they also made Steve Guttenberg a star.
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Good point, Arche Logos - co2 neutral is best. Better to emit carbon dioxide that was recently pulled right out of the atmosphere than to dig up old carbon and pump that into the snuggly heat-reflecting blanket we've been making for ourselves. The oil industry is like a smack addict... they can't put down the needle (drill), although somewhere through the haze of their addiction, they know it's destroying their future and their families'. They could switch to methadone (methanol), but it doesn't feel as good (smaller vacation homes), so they listen to the voice of the addiction ("there is no scientific consensus!"). Seems fitting that I'll be seeing this in a double bill with A Scanner Darkly (finally!) this weekend. Riding there in a fossil-burning vehicle... oops.
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Not having seen the movie, I don't know if this was addressed. However, a few points.... One, the two biggest problems with the electric car was the battery life and the time it takes to recharge. The EV-1 only got about 100 miles on a charge, and then took between 4 and eight hours to recharge. The beach is four hours away from where I live; I couldn't make that trip easily with the EV-1. Second point, the EV-1 *does* live on; the technology has been adapted for use with hybrid vehicles, which make more sense as a transitory product.
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I don't know if this is a coincidence, but that's two in a row from this guy where he launches into a rant right off the bat. Next up...a treatise on why Talladega Nights is pandering to the bible belt...
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We've got power outages or rolling blackouts all over the country because the idiots running the power companys won't upgrade their equipment, which in most cases is 70 YEARS OLD!......And we want to plug in MILLIONS of electric cars? If that happened your power would be off more than on.
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... and rob cavefish of their sight!
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Almost every part on the EV was unique & therefore, due to the miniscule quantity of cars, absurdly expensive. So who get sued when Ed Begley's brakes/tranny/drivetrain fails in 5 years because mechanics were jury-rigging improper solutions and an acid-filled missile careens into a playground? Not Eddie....GM!!! GM didn't want to/COULDN'T support this car once production stopped, so they HAD to kill it to prevent lawsuits down the road. That's why it was only offered via lease.
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Just so the unhappy fucktard Pro-Bush groupies wont come on here and ramble off some stupid bullshit about how Eletric cars are for tree hugging hippies, and if you drive one you hate America. Fucking A' Man
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start a car company of your own to build and sell them.
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Truly one of the greatest, most useful, and most influential inventions of all time.
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Can't wait to see this one. And I want one of those Tesla Roadsters!!!! Bad-asss.
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He's killing The Transformers, so he probably started by eliminating random electric cars. Just a wild guess.
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...video killed the electric car... video killed the electric car.... LOL
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The nation is still mourning!
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I'm serious. The reason the EV1 was never sold, is that it cost GM 80K$ a car to make.
Anti-monopoly laws prohibit an auto manufacturer from selling a car below cost. (That is considered anti-competitive dumping)
So GM had to sell them for 80 thousand dollars, or lease them for a more reasonable rate. They went with the lease--that's why nobody has one.
Once the lease terms where up, they dah a choice--keep them in circulation or take them all back.
It make no sense to maintain parts and repair expertise for a fleet of 800 cars, so they did the reasonable thing.
The whole thing was a financial debacle, forced on them by Californias regulators. It has been payed for by everyone of us who has to buy a regular car from GM, and by the American taxpayers who lost tens of millions in tax revenue that GM wrote off as losses from the "experiment". -
i would like to purchase an electric car for not much more than a gas car (less parts, they should be cheaper, except for batteries). I would like one because I drive 9 miles to and from work everyday, then to lunch and back too, and when I go somewhere to shop it's always within 20 miles. I have 2 cars anyway might as well have one of them be electric since all I use it for is driving to work, so where my $25000 electric cars at, the ones that are arn't intentionally stupid looking, like the EV1. I'd but a used Ranger EV or one of the others but they are 5 years or more old and I need a loan to purchase one of these cars. Used I can afford $3000, new I can afford $25,000 you see, the used EV's fall in between there.
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gas R/C cars are more expensive than electric R/C cars, why should full size be any different, only batteries really.
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I like how you go into the movie thinking it has a liberal agenda because it talks about the environment and pollution. I also like how you make it a point to draw a distinction between "liberals" and consumers. I have my doubts about Oil company owning Republicans were the people driving around in the EV. Just like I have my doubts about your intelligence reagrding political issues. Meanwhile, it is my understanding based on what I have read about the movie, that it was essentially Republican policies and ideals that killed the car...although I may be wrong.
And to most people who want to blame regulation and expenses? Regulation was what put these cars on the road in the first place. It was the REPEAL of regulations due to preassure from oil companies, car companies, and of course their political allies. Once the regulations were REMOVED, the oil and car companies did everything they could to ensure we not only stick to gas guzzling vehicles (why do they still push SUVs so hard?) but to continue pushign to reduce fuel standards, etc. The fact is that change costs money and any initial money spent today is an investment in a cleaner and more efficient future. To expect an alternative to oil and gas to be completely perfect and cheap is idiotic (and that is being kind) because oil and gas are terrible now, heavy gouging is going on and it was never cheap to get into either. I'm not sure which is more ridiculous...the opening of this review or the apologists repeating the speaking points directly from the car manufacturers/oil companies PR department. But I guess wanting change and less pollution and more choice makes me a biased liberal according to Wyrmy. -
But it will never get a wide release.
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I have just about ever seen.
See how fast this technology is advancing? The real trick is getting the new tech stuff strongly into the marketplace so it can take hold and replace the war-producing industries we are suffering with now. -
Actually, in Europe and Asia, electric cars are readily available (Even Freeway-ready ones). Peugeot even sells one throughout Europe. The problem in the U.S. is the high cost of of the D.O.T.'s federal crash-testing, which costs somewhere around 50 MILLION dollars to complete. This prevents start-ups from moving forward with their businesses. Right now, their only alternative is to make 3-wheeled "cars" (which are legally classified as motorcycles and exempt from crash-testing), or to electronically limit the speed of the car (as they are doing with the Indian import Reva car) to 25 MPH so it is classified as a low-speed NEV (Neighborhood Electric Vehicle), also exempt from crash-testing.
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Ooooh, that will get the film TONS of credibility.
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...does look very cool. But there are no objective tests yet to see if it lives up to the claims for performance and range. And they are not for sale yet. Anybody can claim any level of perfomacne and price that they want. Let's wait and see if they are as good as claimed. If so, I would love one! But at 100 thousand dollars, I may have to wait.
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[lucky bastard!} "The problem in the U.S. is the high cost of of the D.O.T.'s federal crash-testing, which costs somewhere around 50 MILLION dollars to complete." What a dribbling shit bubble of inaccuracy..all it takes is 2-3 vehicles and maybe $50-100K per vehicle...if that. All kinds of small-volume cars get approved..do you think Saleen/Morgan/Aston Martin/Panoz are ponying up $50 mil per release to sell a handful of super-exotic cars per year? Or that GM pays $1/2 BILLION every time they update 10 models?
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In SFC's new series "Eureka", they all use cool lil' electric runabouts. I dunno if they're real, or just handmade props, but they're cool..and I just wanted to plug the show & suggest regular talkbacks..it's a GREAT show!!!!
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It was me, bitches! I killed the electric car! All it took was a little elbow grease and a pinch of salt...
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That was supposed to be 5 million not 50. This came from a press release from Reva of India, as to why they are not bringing the Reva highway-ready electric vehicle to the U.S. They budgeted 2.5 million for each of their 2 models, based on John Carney of the U.S. DoT saying that the average crash test is $20,000. And that the average company will go through between 50-100 crash tests using the standard trial-and-error method (1-2 million) until the car passes. Sometimes, the company runs out of money without the car ever passing. So while the figure was off, this is the number one reason why independent start-ups are not able to enter the electric vehicle market. As far as the Big 3 are concerned, they piss on $2.5 Million, not to mention producing multiple models based on identical chassis (Ex: Honda Civic = Honda CR-V "SUV" = Acura RSX), which require only one or two tests before passing.
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