Cool News
Cool Making of Superman throwing the Shuttle Bit!
Hey folks, Harry here. I love stuff like this - so here ya go....
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so there !
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living in the UK it only came out this weekend, and I loved it, best summer film so far (fingers crossed for Miami Vice). I honestly must say, I didn't think that was CGI in the cinema. I noticed other bits that were CGI supes, but not that shot. Although I still think Davy Jones is the most realistic CGI character I've seen, I mean, at no point does it look anything but real, and considering how fantastical it is that's quite the accomplishment.
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Sounds like I'm gonna have a helluva day at the cinema tomorrow - I'm double billing Superman Lives with Pirates.
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It really is amazing how they can make CGI look that freaking real.. Impressive.
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as "Brandon Routh".
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Next to Dead Man's Chest. Still, to have these two films released in back to back weekends is quite the blessing.
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Too bad it comes in at 40 min in and the flick never tops it. Still, the whole shuttle / plane scene is quite kickass. I almost applauded at Supes' line to the passengers.
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Since that was about the extent of his utilization of his powers.
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that this scene is the highlight of the movie which it never tops. The rest of the story concerns itself with both a zany real estate scheme and a superheroic version 'Days Of Our Lives' complete with a soapoperatic hospital scene.
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looked real, but wonder why they couldn't capture the real deal for it?
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5 Million goes to that shit scene with Jor-el speaking behind the shower curtain. But I guess they should embelish this scene since its the ONLY ACTION SCENE worth 2 bits in the movie.
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Cause i sure didn't see it go anywhere else in that hack of a film... Harry haven't you heard? Supes Returns sucks freeze dried monkey testicles. Singer ruined supes like only shumaccer can ruin batman.
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I'll repeat it because it deserves repeating - HE WAS CGI IN THAT SCENE?
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So lame singer, so utterly lame.
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I would've laid down money that was real.
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are you drunk? its decent cgi, but how could anyone think it was real?
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Which scene or shot exactly is he CGI? I'm at work and am only seeing a white square. They block everything fun.
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Look at Pirates- a film that cost 20 million more to make ( if we are to beleive that 200 million dollars is what SR cost). You can see where all the money went in POTC DMC. The special effects looked great and it seems like the money was well spent. In Superman returns nobody has a clue where all the money went. It went on shit like this, that could have easily been green screened. So they spent all their money on bullshit effects and hired a couple of 20 something goons to write the WB tentpole movie of the summer and what do they get? A HEAPING PILE OF SHIT OF A MOVIE
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... so let me spoil for you: Supes uses his heat vision multiple times (including right before this scene where he melts the clamps off off the airplane); he uses "super-breath" to blow out the gas fires that nearly blow up the oil refinery plant; he also uses the "super-breath" to steathily blow out Lois' lighter on the rooftop; he uses "super-whistle" while dressed as Clark Kent to hail Lois a cab; he uses his x-ray vision in one of the most poetic scenes ever given to any superhero EVER; and ... well ... he flies around, which is pretty fucking sweet all by itself. I guess he doesn't throw out a cellophane "S" or multiply himself into a bunch of illusions, or magically change clothes while falling without explanation, or turn back time, or magically erase Lois' memory ... HOWEVER, I'll admit there's nothing in SR that's so sly as Clark's quick catch of a bullet before it hits Lois as seen in the first film. But my guess here (even if I want to give you the benefit of the doubt) is that you may be engaging in the new AINT IT COOL passtime - hatin' on Singer. But I could be wrong, and if so I'll apologize.
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It's sad but true. Brandon Routh will likely never see another supes movie, and the franchise will go into kryptonian stasis for another 2-3 decades. Again, we get no braniac. Again, we get no Darkseid. Again, we get no Doomsday. And again, in 2035 when the next Superman Film is released we will see another actor dressing up as lex luthor to do the same old boring mesh we've seen a thousand times, whereby it will go into stasis for another 2-3 decades.
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have been... the sadness, and tragedy of Doomsday being tortured by these scientists to create a perfect lifeform... all he's known is hate, and cruelty... he's known nothing else... showing him punished, and assaulted while supes lives a fairly luthor free life on metropolis all carefree for the most part until doomsday is unleashed on the universe, and supes has to deal with the tragedy that is doomsday's creation, and whether he can really kill doomsday or not......... or a true evil darkseid vs. a true good supes... that stuff is movie magic, not regurgitated luthor jizz.
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Watch how everyone who loves singer & Co. speak out and say this film is not a failure, that it is indeed a hit and mention how it has made 1 Billion dollars in merchandising- or compare it to BatmanBegins at this time last year. THe best one is whethey include the Foreign Box Office with the Domestic Box Office . When in the history of film grosses have you ever included the foreign numbers? what a crock. Truth is ths film is a failure and if they do make a sequel - get rid of Singer and his screenwriters. Also find a guy who can act or at least speak in front of a camera. As for Spacey- leave him on that island and have decent villain who will kill Kate Bosworth in the firsat scene. Then, I might see the sequel
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But the story was mechanical and wooden.
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Cameron Bright for Luthor in 2035! But seriously, SR was a bit of a miss. Lex Luthor was mildly entertaining, but he wasn't threatening at all, he was disposed of in- 5 mins? I kept expecting he was going to pull some native Kryptonian fighting mechs on Superman or maybe he was going to genuinely save the world with the stuff he stole. But alas, he made a giant crystal doodie-bomb.
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You jump right on the boards to trash Singer, and then complain that the defenders will respond. Ooooo. Okay, how about this: SOMEHOW I IMAGINE THE STUDIOS MIGHT CARE ABOUT THE BOTTOM DOLLAR. Yeah, I know, who knows more about what Studio Execs think and believe that a bunch of wankers like us ... I mean, if "Superneal" says that the movie tanked, well, I'd take that information to the bank. That's Gold, Baby! I thought it was wonderful in some ways, mediocre in others, but didn't royally suck so often as X3. It seems most of the critics got my back ... 75% on the RottenTomatoes.com T-Meter ain't shabby, but then who the fuck cares about that? It's kicking the crap out of POTC and X3, percentage wise, but it's edged out by "The Devil Wears Prada" and "Prairie Home Companion" (which, in my opinion, was TRULY mediocre). I liked it, I'd liked to see sequels of that quality ... preferably of HIGHER quality in the vein of X2 and Spider-Man 2. But since I don't think it was THE WORST FUCKING MOVIE OF ALL TIME .... YEEEARGH! ... then I guess I'm a defender.
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I think you both hit the nail on the head there. Watching the shuttle launch I figured we must be in for a hell of a third act if this was going to be a 'taster' of Supes in action. How very sad and wrong I was as the whole theater sat and watched Superman slowly. Lift. A. Big. Lump. Of. Rock. Into. Space. Before. Falling. Into. An. Episode. Of. General. Hospital.
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and spent the extra money on BETTER SCRIPT WRITERS! Natch...
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Haley Joel Osment as Lex haha
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It's incredibly rich in essence, but I'd argue, poorly executed. OKAY - so, the guy leaves Earth in search of his home ... in search of Krypton, but he finds it destroyed. Nothing left of his homeworld but the Fortress of Solitude, and his family line - HIS WHOLE FUCKING RACE - ends with him. Right? Well, when he gets home, he finds first of all that he still has his life as Clark ... but how fucking awkward is that? He obviously doesn't fit on the farm where he grew up. The TV is all war and chaos. The only real friend he has in Metropolis is Jimmy ... who's nice and all, but come on. He's Jimmy. Then he finds the one fucking thing left of his Kryptonian heritage was STOLEN by a petty fucking asshole who got out of prison on a technicality while Supes was off on a self-centered star trek. LUTHOR STOLE ALL THAT WAS LEFT OF KRYPTON ... and BLEW IT ALL TO TURN A BUCK (well, actually, to rule the world - yeah, fuckers, it was a barren rock, but it was HIS barren rock and he controlled it. You see, he'd rather rule in hell than - like Supes - serve in heaven.) You know what Supes is saying when they're kicking the crap out of him? "Those were from my father, you stole them!" You see, Luthor managed to steal EVERYTHING that was Superman ... except for one thing. One thing that changed everything - the kid. That's what Lois whispered into his ear before she left. It wasn't her love that woke him up. It was realizing that his race would continue that Krypton would live on in the boy. ... OH AND I FORGOT - you see the film this way, and how fucking poetic is it that Supes pushed the Kryptonian continent into space? That, essentially, WAS the last bit of his home world. And he pushed it into outer space to save Earth. And nearly killed himself in the process. Yeah, I'll take that over some big fucking ROCK MONSTER pounding Superman for two hours. I saw plenty of that on Buffy. WHO'S STRONGER THAN WHO?!? PUNCH, PUNCH, KICK, KICK, ... up-down-up-down-left-right-left-right-B-A-start! This movie needed some SERIOUS polish, I'll admit it. But it's all there, and I'll take it a dozen times over the Ratner daytime Soap Opera crap that looks flashy on the service but has absolutely nothing at it's core. Really, these two films are like mirror opposites of each other. Some like Ratner, some like Singer, some like both and some like neither. Wow, huh? Ain't it cool.
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there was a beautiful solid scene in digital effects and you say he shoulda been green screened? for what? so you fuckers can say how fake it looked?
you guys are worse than teenage girls -
can be Luthor in 2035!
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I'd rent Dead Poets Society. THIs is the Return of Superman. I need some action for pete's sake -Not him crying 3 different times
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it was far from perfect. It just wasn't really a Superman movie. It was a modern day Emily Bronte novel complete starring Superman, with stormy seas and hair flapping in the wind. The only thing missing was a crumbly estate on the Scottish moors.
And they should not have used the John Williams theme. THIS should have been the real theme song:
When I was young
I never needed anyone
And makin love was just for fun
Those days are gone/
Livin alone
I think of all the friends Ive known
But when I dial the telephone
Nobodys home/
All by myself
Dont wanna be
All by myself anymore
All by myself
Dont wanna live
All by myself anymore... -
Of. My. Home. World. Flying. Off. Into. Space. How. Poetic. ( Note. To. Super. Self. Must. Rent. Dead. Poets. Society. When. I. Get. Back. To. Earth. )
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Man, that totally nails it. Sure he used his other powers sparingly, but come on. They wanted to show how they can now do MUSCLE DEFORMATION IN CGI! Too bad Zod's not around anymore.
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he's been gone five years? come on, she looks like she's barely 20. i think the villan was the main problem. how did superman lift the new continent if it had all that kryptonite on it? i mean earlier he couldn't even walk across it. not to say i didn't like the movie but this should have been a home run not a ground rule double.
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I'm sure the Hollywood Cookie Cutter Machine won't let you down next time. BRING ON RATNER! We'll get Doomsday pounding Supes through a few buildings, who'll then get smacked around by Lobo and Mongul ... oh, and Metallo, why not? MORE EXPLOSIONS!!! Don't get me wrong, I love action as much as the next guy. Shuttle scene was great, bank robbery scene was great, Supes flying through the city to save people during the earthquake had me gasping. 90 minutes of mutants blowing shit up bored the crap out of me. But that's me. Tell you what, next time I see you at Blockbuster, I'll point you towards the Chuck Norris section. (And geez, Superman's been known to blow out stars like you'd blow out a match ... how could it possibly be fun to spend two hours seeing who could punch harder? Again, that's just me ... whatever ...)
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I have to say I'm a little disappointed by superman returns. they got alot right-the look of the film is beautiful, brandon makes a great superman and the effects are pretty hot. But what really makes this movie suffer is that nothing is expanded upon or played out for long enough so the whole thing feels sketchy...almost like an idea for a movie rather than a finished one. Not one set-piece is left to play out for any length of time...like the final showdown.... lasts all of 2 minutes...the shuttle...all of 5. Its just a shame because I really think theyve got the right cast and the right director...hell I even liked the whole concept of the story and how it pushes the boundaries of what we see in a superman film...theres some really nice dilemmas in there. but I dunno...how can a 2 and a half hour movie feel like a 1/3 of a movie? I also think that superman having a son is going to be difficult to write into further movies but I like this enough to hope for a better sequel. Disappointing summer all round...man I cant get over how much of a mess POTC2 was....and last xmas we had king kong whcich was also a mess......shit! roll on indy 4,die hard and spidey....
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Super. Lame. (aaaaah, I'm just kiddin', you're great ...)
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Haha, i think i had a bit of a Shatner moment there. Actually, that's not a bad idea - let's see Shatner don the cape and boots ! (This idea's either genius OR pig shit. Mmmmmmm.)
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blockbuster movie of the summer. I think the reason most people didn't like is that they came in expecting wall to wall action and instead all they got was a gorgeous film that dealt with some pretty dense and interesting themes (although, I'll admit that I felt at times the film was standing in the shadow of Donner's original, but this is a minor criticism in comparison to everything good in the film). I think that a good deal of these people will change their minds if they saw the movie a second time knowing the film isn't going to be just a bunch of dumb action. Then there are those who just have something against Singer and will never see past their hatred. Their opinions are basically worthless. Personally, I don't know what everyone's complaining about, you get Pirates 2 as a fun summer fluff piece that, although decently crafted, doesn't have much to it, and then you get Superman Returns as the thinking man's action film. Shouldn't everyone be happy? It seems like a lot of people want every superhero flick to be X-Men 2, and while X2 was great, I've already seen it and don't feel like seeing a retread with different superpowers (besides, that's what Pirates 2 was for). Whatever you think of Superman Returns, at least it was a movie that took some major risks, and for that alone I think it should be commended. I don't want to know what's going to happen in a movie the moment a step into a theater. I'm glad films actually break my expectations, and Superman Returns had the balls to do just that. It shows once again that Superhero movies can be more than just fluff.
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I totally agree with you. Watching it didn't feel right. The movie didn't flow. It was so long and it didn't feel like a whole hell of a lot happened. I liked it a lot, but I wish Singer could have gotten the pacing better.
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So brilliant it's scary ... NO WAIT, I was thinking about this: http://tinyurl.com/nv4wb (And if you want to have fun in a whole different sort of flame war, WHICH IS A BETTER PARODY? http://tinyurl.com/pr539 or http://tinyurl.com/q462v ... I vote for the latter, but then it actually has something to do with the plot. You know, plot, poetry, all that icky girly stuff.)
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saving the world int he original film is 50 thousand times better than in this film. You were gasping? Next time take a Nebulizer in the theater with you. BTW - if you were "gasping" during the scene of Superman saving people from the earthquake (allegedly), you need to see more movies cause that sequence was pretty lame. You are the only talkbacker you is praising that scene...the rest of us were sleeping
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In the past few years, the only one who seem to 'get' it are Raimi and Spielberg (I thought WOTW was flawed but hugely entertaining). Maybe Raimi can hold a seminar for all the other filmmakers in Hollywood, titled, How to Make a Great Summer Popcorn Movie.
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I'm off to play with my Shatner cape while listening to my ManOWar vinyl !
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Contrary to some TBers here, I feel your take was right on the money. Yeah it WAS all there. Homeworld, son, chunk of rock, thematic significance.. In theory, it would've made a hell of a movie. But unfortunately, that wasn't the movie you or I saw, eh? Pacing was off. It ended up being unfocused and bloated. But yes, you are right, it had good intentions.
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Superneal, it's amazing. It's like you have some super-ability to pack in every immature Talkbacker habit into a single message. And in only three sentences, no less! Okay, aside from teh misspeling (heh), I don't have to admit anything about my preferences, let alone anything as stupid as saying that one film is "50 thousand times better" than another. Maybe if we're using "base six" math ... or the metric system ... that shit always confuses me. I like the original A LOT. I don't know if I like it "50 thousand times more," but I DO like it more than SR. And yeah, I was gasping. That happens to me when I'm watching films sometimes. Sorry you had such a boring experience ... but I'd love to see the movies you're seeing, which must be SOOOO FUCKING GREAT - maybe even, dare I say it, "50 millions times better" than SR?!? WOWEE!!! And, oh yeah, "the rest of us were sleeing." Huh, you were at Kip's Bay theater on opening night? 7pm show? Funny, I didn't see you there. Maybe you were the guy sleeping in the back, yet somehow aware that everyone else was sleeping ... everyone but me, who doesn't go to enough movies to know that this is OBVIOUSLY one of the lamest films ... EVER!!! Look, your hyperbole sucks, and your insistance that EVERYONE else agrees with you sucks. Other than that, I'm sure you're a great guy. I have a different opinion, I liked the film, I have NO idea if it'll stand up to the test of time. I haven't measured in it zero gravity to understand it's scientific properties just yet, so I don't feel qualified to measure it against the gold standard that is Donnor's masterpiece. I'm sure if I saw the SUPER-TERRIFIC-HAPPY Films that you get to see, then I'd realize how much SR sucked ... or maybe I'd like them both ... or maybe I'd have my own fucking opinion ... who knows, crazy world.
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I think you're basically right, but I'm not going to let the Prefect be the enemy of the Good. And it was a good film to my eyes. Saw it twice within the same week (which I very rarely do), and there were things I liked more - things I liked less on the second viewing. Then I popped in Batman Begins for the first time in a year. Imagine it? Somethings I liked more. Some things I liked less. But I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a sequel, because Singer NAILED IT OUT OF THE FUCKING PARK (my hyperbole in action, Superneal) on X2. MY THEORY? Singer is WAAAAAY to willing to cut scenes. The deleted scenes from X1 would've made it ten times the movie it was on screen. (I'd say, oh, maybe 35 thousand times better, give or take a thou'.) He's nervous with big budgets and doesn't have the patented Terry Gilliam "fuck 'em, I'm makin' my fucking movie my fucking way" attitude, so he buckles and let's key scenes get cut. I'm looking forward to the DVD for just that reason ... Just a hunch.
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Jesus Christ, quit doing Returns talkbacks so I can retire that.
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Explain to me how Luthor was planning on ruling this barren rocky landscape? Real estate? Ummm okay, how was he going to build real estate on a bunch of jutting rocks everywhere. How was he going to landscape the entire rock? How was he going to defend it against foreign invaders? With those other pieces of krypton he stole? How? Luthor didn't give us a frigging ounce of demonstration on how those pieces of rock could be used to defend against say for instance the fucking U.S. ARMY ... he had all of five guys with him. ya sure poetic license right? It's all about him stealing the only thing superman had left from his pa right? SURE!!! Explain to me why giving supes a kid was a good smart idea except to please neanderthals that are brainwashed by meandering innane plots on daytime soaps everyday (ie 'JONNY!! James is your son!!!" cue suspensful and climactic music) Further, wtf do you supes fools think it's okay to have a 19 year old playing as top reporter Lois Lane in metropolis??? Look up her date of birth on IMDB... she is god damn younger than 99 percent of the people who post here. Who can say they're working at a top reporter firm at the age of 19??? Oh right, it's suspension of disbelief again is it? Superman can do whatever he likes as far as I'm concerned, but when they start changing the real world around him too much it pisses me off. Let's get one thing straight...to those saying that having doomsday, Darkseid, or Brainiac in a Supes movie would only be one powerful due bashing another all movie is !@#$ING idiotic. Just goes to show the extent of your intelligence that you think that's all it could be. Doomsday is a tragic story of a character that was tortured his entire existence. Darkseid is the epitomy of evil, a Faust among comic lore. Brainiac is 10 times the evil genius that Luthor is. SO STFU before you know what you're talking about. Further, the amount of dialogue in that movie = the amount of dialogue in a 30 minute teletubbie special
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As you can tell from my name, I am a Superman fan. THe truth is, I am extremely dissapointed with this film. I was expecting something great from Singer,( A director I admired), and I was let down...bigtime. Truth is the numbers don't lie and this film is not doing as well as anticipated. I must not be the only person who thought this film blew otherwise SR wouldn't be in abattle for 4th place this weekend with the Devil wears Prada. As for seeing GREAT films, there aren't that many out there- but the original Superman is considered great in my eyes. If you are gonna bring a franchise back to life- you better bring your A game..Singer and company didn't
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Calling it a night, folks! I'm crippled by wolack22's massive debating skills. I'm literally crushed (literally, I say!) under the mighty weight of his rhetorical devices. (Oh, and he's pissed off, LOOK OUT!!!) Gah, I'm SOOOOOO fucking stupid I can't stand it!!! Sigh ... oh well ... g'nite ...
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I loved the movie, but everytime they went in for close-ups on the body double I cringed. I couldn' understand why they did that? It's like thy wanted to show off, "hey look how good our CG is; were you fooled?" I wasn't. It was obnoxious and distracting. It felt like those awful moments in Matrix Reloaded and Revolutions when the real Neo and Smiths arbitrarily switched to CG versions. It was blatantly obvious, and very UNseamless (seamFul does not communicate the thought well). YOUR FX ARE NOT THAT GOOD. IF IT DOES NOT LOOK PERFECT, DON'T DO USE IT. Blargh....
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I don't understand this obsession with Superman Return's box office numbers. I've heard arguments on both sides of the SR camp. Some arguments against it are rancor filled idiocy while others are well thought out, and even if I don't agree with them, I respect the idea behind them. However, I will never believe that a film's box office reflects its quality. Using the same logic then Titanic is obviously the best film ever made. We know that's not true, and neither is "Superman Returns sucks because it didn't make enough money." Knock Superman Returns all you want, but please don't use its box office numbers to do so.
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Yes...based on Friday's box office estimates...Superman Returns will only take in about 9 million dollars over the weekend. That's less than half of last week's take for the movie. and at this rate, one can safely predict that Superman Returns' box office will fall to about 4.5 million next weekend...and the weekend after, only a mere 2.2 million. This is an embarrassment of, dare I say, epic proportions for Warner Brothers...that of all of Hollywood is measuring right now, with open and hung mouths. This is the reason why Disney is lowering the production output of its film roster, from 18, to just 8 films a year...Why? Because even though its Pirates film is doing astoundingly great at the box office, and even breaking records as I speak...Disney could have easily found itself in Warner Brother's shoes if their Pirates sequel had tanked at the box office. A fact that Disney execs are well aware of...as exposed by their cautious new attitude in respect to film making and proper budgeting therein.
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Jul 15, 2006 8:57:23 PM CDT
Some of you need to update your eyeglasses prescription
by george newman
Ya geeks with no good eyeglasses but all the HD TVs and players and the Laven!
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Forget poetic, the movie missed the point entirely. It was, really, a Lois Lane movie about her "settling down and giving up on the impossible ideal (supes)". While there were still interesting elements, the bit about him pushing his homeworld from earth was indeed a smart metaphor, the problem is that the core of the character needs to resonate with the issues of today. Personally, I feel they would have been better served to consider the hardworking, upright father angle. Today's world hates strength, integrity, or honesty. They only react instinctually to victimhood, where they claim that weakness is virtue. Therefore, because Superman at heart reveals their own weaknesses and limitations, people are predisposed to hate the man (even when they need him). I think that separation, that core is what makes him interesting. The scene that got me in the movie (the only one) was where they were just beating him. It was very human. I do feel, also, that they need to rein in his godlike powers. I'll be ready to kill if he "blows out a star" in the next film. I like Brian Singer (huge fan of X-2), but both POTC and even the middling X-3 were better films.
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To: Superneal and Rbatty024...actually you are both right on this subject. Although box office numbers can not always be used to judge a film's quality...often times they can be used to do just that!!! And as far as Superman Returns is concerned, the word of mouth is in...and it isn't good...according to most audiences. However, I can look at films like Dark City, The 13th Floor, Frequency and Somewhere In Time, and tell you that those films were fantastic lost gems...that should have had huge numbers at the box office or at least in DVD/video rentals and sales. Unfortunately, that hasn't happened...nevertheless, they are great films...so great that The Warchowski Brothers ripped-off Dark City...added lots of machine gun fire and wire fu, and renamed it The Matrix...and James Cameron ripped-off Somewhere In Time...got rid of the time travel element and replaced it with flashbacks and flash forward scenes...and pasted the end "everybody dies, but lives on in spirit, if not in our memories" (smiling ghosts) scene from the climax of Space Cruiser Yamato...to create Titanic. Check them out for yourselves...you'll see the stollen archetypes right before your eyes!!! But I digress...Back to the subject, box office is not always the final judgement of a film's quality...but sometimes...it can be a lasting one!!! Now, if you want to see a really great super hero film, speaking of lost gems, forget about Superman Returns, and rent or buy The Rocketeer...a underrated and truly great film that's a cross between the first Chris Reeves Superman film...and Raiders Of The Lost Ark!!!
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really subtle facial work, I'm pretty sure I'd have thought it was live action had I not seen this clip.
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Honestly, while I'm sure that Warners were a little dissatisfied with the numbers on this movie, there are so many other variables that need to be taken into account. They spent nearly $50 million developing this movie before Singer even came on board. I'm sure it's partially a relief to not have that all gone in vain. Also, ending up around $200 million domestic, maybe a little less, isn't too bad. You still have to factor in international box office, and then the inevitable DVD sales. In the long run, I think that Superman will turn a profit, albeit a small one and nowhere near what they were hoping for. Yet all this means is that for the sequel there's a clean slate. No more worrying about reigniting the franchise, since it's already been done. Hopefully the pressure is off, Singer will learn from his mistakes and make the Superman film I know he can.
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Luthor's master plan was moronic. Five guys ruling a continent? Please. And it's all rock? If you're going to make a hunk of land the size of North America, where are you planning on growing food? And wouldn't it have made some kind of sense to pack a few other precious minerals in that crystal-missile so that his new country would have some form of natural resources beyond rocks and green crystals?
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Batman didn't cost 210 to 300 million dollars, as Superman Returns did, with a over ten year development process...and at least 150 million dollars in advertisements, promotions, film print duplication costs and distribution expenses. And although both Batman Begins and Superman Returns both sucked as films...at least Batman had some good ideas that just weren't executed right...but Superman Returns was just a weird uneven bore fest. Add to that the fact that Superman, was a super stalker with a haunting obsession with Lois Lane. When you have Superman taking time to spy on her conversations and her family...that is some serious Pervert 101 kind of stuff. I mean...isn't Batman supposed to be the one who is mentally unstable, not Superman? I was just waiting for Superman Returns to turn into Super Ex Girlfriend at any minute!!! Anyway...with Superman unnecessarily costing between 210 to 300 million dollars, as detailed above in my text...trying to compare its box office take to Batman Begins...is like trying to compare the cost of the U.S. attacking Panama...to the cost of our involvement in Iraq!!! There is no way in Heaven or in hell that Warner Brothers is going to make as much money off of Superman Returns as it did with Batman Begins, no matter what the final numbers are!!! Brian Singer should have shortened his film by an hour or more, and added more action if he wanted to deliver higher box office totals. That, and a better script would have made Superman Returns a film worth making sequels for!!!
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Once he destroyed 75% of the world's population, exactly WHO would be lining up to buy real estate from this guy? Most people would be dead, and the countries that would be left (in his giant map o' destruction) weren't the richest ones in the world... Yeah. People will rush to Lex's rocky continent from Siberia, China, and the middle of Africa- The rest of the world has been destroyed or sunk below the significantly risen ocean level. I guess after a global disaster of that magnitude, you'd covet a barren, jagged rock for a yard.
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Just imagine watching this segment of the film, the five second worth, and seeing how many thousands of dollars it was worth.
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He'll make a DC hero movie that blows everyone away. Drop the same money on Dini's version of the Justice League as you did on this abortion version of Superman, and you'll see what these things are supposed to look like.
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and people complain about wolack's debate skills but his analysis of luthor's plan is pretty dead on. Superman is just a dissapointment. Fanboys like it. The public is bored by it. Pirates really just hit the spot for american movie goers this summer because it was exactly what it advertised itself to be. A fun non-stop action adventure that doesn't take itself too seriously. Superman took itself WAY too seriously.
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whose plan was more lame? The bad guy from Batman Begins with his evaporate the water-crazy-people plan. Or Lex's lets build an uninhabitable rock to play cards on and watch fuzzy cable with Kumar? Actually this isn't a question Superman's villan plot was much more lame.
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it looks a little too "CG".
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1. Superman goes back to krypton after scientists somehow manage to locate a planet that no longer exists. I won't even bring up the fact that Jor-El shows Supes the exact friggen location of the planet in the first movie, yet he never seemed eager to return to it. 2. Jimmy Olson not remembering clarks name. They've been working together how long? 3. A healthy superman struggles to save a plane while a severly weakened superman effortlessly manages lift an entire continent and throw it into space. 4. Lois never wonders how Superman impregnated her. 5. Even with a runtime 2.5 hours nothing ever gets resolved. Superman doesn't get Lois, his, crystals, or even Luthor. All Superman manages to do is get beat up. You can bet the sequel will be a 3 hour court battle to get custody of his kid. It ends in a mistrial.
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I am so sick of people saying that it had breathtaking visuals. The visuals sucked, and so did the actors. I hate Kate Bosworth with a passion for ruining Lois Lane.
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they've been doing muscle deformation for years now. Started off with jiggle deforming to simulate the look of muscle jiggling, and then moved on to muscle deformation. I believe JP3 was one of the big examples to use it in production, if memory serves.
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Superman The Remake has officially killed Superman due to falling box office and lack of anything original. Perhaps next time WB will hire someone that has at least some talent before they throw away what will end up being at least 100 million on this steaming insipid boring pile of pig shit. Fuck Singer. Hopefully he won't get anymore comic movies to project his homo angst on. I still love that video of his dumbass stumbling through an interview when somone asks him about POTC.
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given all it had to contend with. Consider the development hell this movie went through, just to finally be made. REMEMBER -- JON PETERS IS FRIKIN' INSANELY STUPID AND WAS DETERMINED TO TORPEDO THIS CHARACTER. How many movies start off with a $60 million liability?? ANY movie that has had as many hands in the pot as this one has is going to have problems. Given all that, I think Singer pulled a pretty good rabbit out of the hat. The movie is gorgeous -- true, it lacks a little in the energy department, but it's still miles above anything that has been done for the Man of Steel on the big screen before.
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Only the PLANET KRYPTON explodes -- get it right next time, 'kay? Maybe try reading the comic for a few key pointers, eh?
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I was reading about it the other day. Warner Brothers is already having meetings about how big the budget for the sequel will be and so on. It's not an "if" question it's "when?" They're not going to let their franchise die after they went to so much expense to bring it back. Is Paramount letting Star Trek die after Nemesis bombed and Enterprise was cancelled? Nope. And Superman Returns is sure as hell doing a whole let better than Nemesis did. So hopefully Summer 2008 will bring us another Superman film.
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Indeed.
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I noticed that too man. WTF?
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sequel. Get over it. After loosing what will end up being around 100 million for WB you're a fuckin' loon if you think WB is going to do shit with this franchise right now. Perhaps in a few years we can get a real Supes movie and not this steaming pile of pig vomit we got.
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...you fucked up!
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Why? For the love of god, hate X3. Please, hate that movie, but not this. I admit when I saw superman returns for the first time, I was underwhelmed, but it was still a good movie. Yea, lex's plot was kind of stupid, but he's insane. What do you expect? I thought the kryptonite island was a cool twist. Superman hurling that thing into silent space was a great moment in the movie. I saw it 3 times already. The third time in IMAX, which I must say, feels like an entirely different movie. I really think superman returns was the best movie of the summer. Even though Lois and Superman dont get together in the end, it was still a good experience. I really dont understand the hating.
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This was, without a doubt, the best sequence in the entire film.
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JL: Starcrossed was a better movie than Superman Returns.
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Twilight two-parter from Season 2 of the Justice League did more justice for Superman than Superman Returns.
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I highly doubt there will be a sequel now. If only they had brought back Superman with a story like Doomsday and not Superman redux.
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First, people let's get one thing straight: DVD sales drive the business now. Studios no longer count on Theatrical runs to drive business. Superman will make at least its budgets worth at the box office, and more on the flip side in all the satellite, cable, merchandising deals, and in the DVD sales, which are Hollywoods primary money maker now. Second: The movie I saw was good, even great, but the thing we must consider is that this was written with the plot centered around characters and choices. Was it a fun movie? In parts. But elsewhere it was better than fun, it was a film I was proud to see somebody make. I've seen dozens of actions movies, and if I had to be pressed on the issue, I wouldn't call Superman Returns one of the best action movies of all time. It doesn't rank low, by any means, but it just wasn't centered around that. This movie dared to make it's characters real. As for Luthor? I think the Land deal is just an excuse. He's after power, to gather to himself. The real reason to make the Kryptonite laced Island is to put the world at his feet. Killing billions and bankrupting the economy are not like problem for him, since they represent that outcome quite well
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Superman Returns is a success, in terms of being a failure!!! Yes, if that was the plan to crash land Superman, well, Brian Singer has indeed hit a home run...No...a grand slam!!! Who knows, maybe this was just some intentional big fat tax right off from the beginning. If true, I applaud Warner Brothers for its efforts. You really know how to drive away audiences!!! And of course, I must congratulate all of Warner Brother's PLANTS who keep on posting positive claims, and revised (lowered) budget numbers for Superman Returns each time the box office slips, from day to day...and week to week!!! It's a good cover to make sure Warner covers all its bases so that can't be accused of building a money shelter for itself through this movie!!!
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How can you really hate Bosworth, or Routh for that matter? Sure she especially failed in the eyes of anyone over ten years of age in portraying Lois, but she's only trying to earn a living. Blame the person who thought it would be a good idea to choose her to play Lois
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I was going to post something about if the CGI's this "advanced" why not just make Chris Reeve Superman again, but thought that Reeve's memory deserves better than this lame tribute.
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To: Lobanhaki...Yeah...you're right about DVD sales and rentals. But the problem for Superman Returns is that its box office at theatres won't cover its production budget or its ads, promotions, print duplications and distribution budgets. Added together, that's about 450 million dollars. If you have been checking the box office take of Superman Returns, domestically and worldwide, this movie will only make 300 million dollars. And of course, theatres receive half of the box office take...leaving Warner Brothers with a 300 million dollar loss!!! And trust me...that's going to eat up all of the expected revenue that will be generated from DVD sales and rentals!!! Now, add in sales to worldwide tv networks, cable, satelite and pay-per-view. Well, they (Warner Brothers) would be lucky if they manage to break even...if that is even their goal. Like I said before, this movie may only represent a giant tax shelter to Warner Brothers...and hence may have been designed to lose money from the get go!!! Where is the IRS to audit company books, when you need them???!!!
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but at least we didn't have Nick Cage and Tim Burton fucking it up even worse. The movie was good. Routh did well, but he really, strangely, wasn't given much to do. I think it'll make enough to do a sequel, and maybe they can do it better. So all you whiny, girly fanboys out there can just go blow me.
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It really, really won't. It has to make 50 / 40 mil on just Geek Legs alone. I don't think there are enough DC / Superman geeks out there to bring to that ledge. I say round mid 80 mil is where it'll cap out that. Still not even its production budget.
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Superman Returns was a great movie. A great ACTION movie, no... but think about how many action scenes the original Superman movie had: 4. Count 'em: 4. Why did Lex build a big freaking kryptonite laced, kryptonian continent? Because he wanted to play with advanced alien technology and kill Superman...not because of all of that crap about getting rich in real estate. They underlined that fact in the scene where Lex and his henchmen are all sitting around with nothing to do, on his godforesaken continent, but to play cards. And wait for Superman to show up. Why do Lois Lane and Superman look so young? Because you can't make 3 sequels with a cast that's in their late 30's.
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Like when he took Lois for a fly... and she said Richard takes her flying, to which Superman replied "Not like this." Because he knows no one can compete with him, because he is freaking SUPERMAN. Or like the way Singer makes a point of Supes leaving that plane fuselage sitting in the middle of the ball diamond, and they way he so carefully crushes the car under the weight of the Daily Planet globe after he catches it.... He could have flown the trash away, but instead it's like: "Okay, I did the hard part and saved lives. Now go clean it up yourself". Or the way he flies out of the hospital without saying a word to anyone... no "thanks"... Superman knows who he is, understands he's The Man, that he's cock of the walk, and he's good with that.
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Should write the sequel...if there is one.
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sorry to interupt but I'm looking for the perfect talkback title phrase. I might go with, "Satan fucked Jesus... up the ass first!" instead. Any input would be appreciated.
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I liked the movie a lot but I hate that it began with the biggest plot hole of all time. Did Jor-El not say that he will have been dead for millenia in his recording? They even repeated it again in this one. It took baby Clark 100s of years to get to Earth originally and yet in this film he's been to Krypton and back in 5 years. Plot hole you can throw a continent through.
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Jul 16, 2006 3:11:26 AM CDT
I am getting really bored and tired of all the hate...
by spectrebeeyatch
Why so many love pointing out the FAILURES and blah blah. Well if you actually read reports about the BO you'd know that Hollywood ain't doing so well. Sure DVD sales are up and BO is up from the year before but barely any movies are banking like they should. MI3 has what 133 million that's not bad but not what they expected and when it cost about 150, sure DVD will make up but it still under performed. Posiedon bombed. Davinci Code made it's money back and more so Sony has a win. X3 cost around 230 million to make and it made so far 231 million. Also Fox took a huge blow when a movie that makes 120 million in one weekend can't double that. X3 was expected after that weekend to make 340 million. Oops bad word of mouth kicked that movie in the ass, so that in a sense is a failure and DVD sales will save it. Then June had two hits the Breakup which cost not very much and made over 100 million and Cars which has surpassed 200 million. Everything else under performed!!! So shut the fuck up about this grand failure or whatever the fuck you want to call Superman we all know it will come out even so who gives a shit? I for one enjoyed it and I think they are setting up for something epic a reall bad guy to come and fuck with things, because action sin't good unless it has emotion behind it. If you want pointless action go rent the Punisher or soemthing and get over yourselves.
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http://raincloud.warnerbros.com/wbmovies/supermanreturns/clips/shuttle_500.mov
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Every movie I've seen recently has been preceeded by more commercials than previews. They keep increasing the number of commercials prior to films, thereby increasing revenues for themselves, and yet have the fucking gall to charge me more and more for a ticket. I didn't pay to sit there and watch their shitty ads. I don't watch them on TV for free, I sure as fuck ain't gonna pay for them, and yet I have literally sat through 22 minutes of commercials once. FUCK THAT SHIT!!
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Superhero movies really need to acknowledge the fact that the world isnt the same place as it was in the 70s. And that compared to the insane and evil ideologies of Osama, the way they depict Lex Luther et al is pretty tame. I mean real estate? Iknow his plan would have killed millions, but lets actually see Lex or any of the other baddies do something to show us WHY they are called super villains. Trying to kill millions isnt the same as actually killing them. I mean they dont give prizes for effort here.
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Check out this brand new Snakes on a Plane Trailer !!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UHZ3ynQOfM -
The movie is out. It lost its second opening weekend to a pirate movie. It has been voted on numerous sites the biggest disappointing movie of the year, so far. But, we STILL get posts about the making of it?? Where's the CASINO ROYALE script reviews? The other HUNDREDS of stuff that's been promised to us "in a couple weeks" TWO years ago??? JESUSUSUSUSUSUSUSUSUSUSUSUSUs
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That the only person who would be able to bear Superman's child would be wonderwoman!!! Supes child would kill a normal human woman, the first kick from baby supes would rip apart the womb. That is what ruined it for me, anyone with me????? -
...loved it. In my eyes, she is the mainstream audience. She can witness Wolvie and Juggernaut beat each other shitless and have Prof. Xavier get vaporized and be like, "Meh, It was ok," but go all bonkers for the trailer for "The Devil Wears Prada". Btw, she didn't like X3 because it was "Sillier than part 2. Part was 2 was my favorite."
I really like how SR was kind of a downer. Superman realizes he is alone. Even with humanity worshipping him, they cannot comprehend what it is to be him.
He has been gone and everything has changed. War and disaster and tradgedy, all for his own search into his own history. He belongs to the people.
Lois Lane was fine with me. How strong is the woman who moves on and gets over SUPERMAN? She is a strong woman, a career woman, a mother and a devoted...fiance. It takes emotional resolve to get through what she has gone through.
Superman was cool, I liked his use of powers...the earthquake scene was tight. If only some of the other scenes had that frenetic sense of urgency and excitement to them...you can kind of tell this movie was supposed to be epic but was cut down heavily. That's why the pacing kind of left me twidling my fingers for a bit.
I really like that Supes knows he's Super. The scene with the bullet to the eye and his look of smug confidence, he he, made me wish I was Superman. I LOVED when he took Lois flying. He knows he's killing her and he knows Richard can never live up to him and he knows he's being a homewrecker, but shit man, he's Superman. He doesn't even have to try.
He has a son. Lois hasn't commited herself to him so he has no reason to step in. His son is in good hands with Richard just like he was with his Pa Kent. It was a downer because Superman had to realize his place in this new world that was created with his presence but now he knows that Lois still loves him and HE HAS A SON! He has so much to do now. I can't wait for the sequel...
when he flew down that street into the distance and everyone just was awed by this god in their presence...I felt their amazement.
When he lifted the crystal continent (more the size of a state I guess) and the John Williams theme played, dude...Superman is lifting a FUCKING CONTINENT into outer space...he was injured, speared with Kryptonite...and his determination to follow his mission, his destiny...sent by his father to set an example and save mankind, even if it means self sacrifice (just like Jesus), that was magic for me.
Superman isn't spider-man or daredevil, he is on such a whole other level of perfection...I loved it. Just move the story along a bit quicker in SUPERMAN DIES. I like that title. (Just hope the box office doesn't bomb, wow how ironic) The third should be titled SUPERMAN LIVES...yeah...I like that. Oh yeah, shit dude...if you have a sloppily done superman tattoo on your arm next to your tribal, shit man, go watch the damn movie maybe?
Sorry that was so long. Just my thoughts. -
This movie was made for a broad audience, not for the summer out-of-school pimple crowd who see movies over and over again. Sure, Warner Bros. would like you little profanity-riddled tykes to go see it and then go back again. But this movie was made to appeal to many age groups (in fact, it's a bit too much aimed at adults). Besides all that, even SUPERMAN: THE MOVIE got wildly mixed reviews back in 1978 (although few people these days remember that), and although it was targeted at the same broad audience, it made so much money from the fact that there was nothing like it at the time in theaters nor had there been. If it were released today, it would probably fair about as well a SR. SR is saddled with a similar problem that the first STAR TREK movie faced: millions had already been spent on failed/shelved projects, but that money was tacked on to the total cost of the film. Returning a profit was difficult. SUPERMAN RETURNS will definitely make a profit, especially considering the overseas take, and there will be a sequel by the same producer and cast. Hopefully they will fix a few of the problems that made this film less of a summer popcorn blockbuster while still retaining the broad, general appeal.
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lift a continent into space? What kind of levitation is that? What's he pushing against that gives him the force to lift a continent?
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I haven't the movie, but that sounds incredibly stupid, even in Superman environment. As for going to Krypton and back in 5 years: either he used a plothole or a wormhole, hahaha.
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NEVER allow directors who have to get their assistants to google the info about any superhero/sf/fantasy character so that they can come to Comic Con, and lie about how they are a longtime fan of the characters. Hire talent who have an understanding and history with the license you just poured money into. Singer did a half assed X-Men, and with Superman, it finally came home to roost. Someone said Dini, perfect choice for screenwriter. They have so many great Superman stories to mine, so many action scenes to pay homage to and we basically get a heavy object thrown and THEN an even heavier object thrown.....yawn!!! WB do not screw up Conan!
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You people (that is, teens, since most of you are) seem to forget that. Much like THE WIZARD OF OZ, superhero comic books, including Superman, are fantasy stories for children. The fact that ADULTS like them, too, doesn't change this fact. So trying to apply all this nitwit logic to Superman stories is idiotic. As Moore's WATCHMEN made perfectly clear, guys in tights fighting evil are just silly. Modern day comic writers (most of them former children who were fans) try to make Superhero comics more "serious" (which, laughingly, seems to translate into "adult") by adding tons of violence and more elaborate (that is, CONVOLUTED) storylines. It's okay to like Superman, The X-Men, etc. But they are characters meant for children. Try to keep that in mind before you get all pissy about why no one notices that Clark Kent is Superman with glasses, etc. You can all still feel good about yourselves AND accept that superhero comics are for kids.
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"How Can Superman lift a continent into space? What kind of levitation is that? What's he pushing against that gives him the force to lift a continent?" -Are you fucking serious?
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seanny youre spot on...the pacing was all over the place. whatever happened to the classic movie template? these guys need to sit down and watch raiders of the lost ark again. a film needs to unravel and build up to a showdown, with a little tension and mystery thrown in. Set-pieces need to push the character otherwise theyre pointless...especially when youre dealing with a virtually invincible character! The Matrix had a typical structure and therefore it was great whereas the others were a mess because there was no structure at all-just a barrage of pointless sequences. With better editing the sequels could have surpassed the first. Again, JP1-classic structure=great film JP2-crap structure=weak...even the berg lost it there. Orbots, I also loved WOTW...it's very watchable-and the hyper reality feel of it made the first alien reveal really effective-it's just a shame the ending wasnt long enough. (plus I was always disappointed the aliens looked so conventional for such a fresh movie) but anyway as for supes..how cool would it have been if Spaceys lex had fortified and defended the island so that supes had a harder time getting rid of it? the movie really needed superman dodging some missiles. The villain plotline was the weakest part yet could have been easily the best (if supes didnt just to go "okay ill just throw this island into space-job done." ah well heres hoping for a better sequel....
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I never bought Superman Returns because they are trying to say his kid has some powers because he is half human/half Kryptonian. But when Superman had sex with Lois it was after he was changed to human and lost all his Kryptonian power. Therefore his kid should be normal. Also, Lois got an extra zap of Kryptonian destroying powers when Superman reversed the machine and zapped the three villains, Lex and Lois. That should have done it to her fetus as well.
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darthevildead you absolutely must tell me which movie that final snake eating the playboy bunny in the bowling alley is from..as for this thread...WHY WOULD WARNER BROS PURPOSELY paint themselves into corner and PUBLICLY DECLARE the flick has to break $200M to merit a sequel? BECAUSE THEY ARE FED UP WITH SINGER AND HIS "CIRQUE DU SOGHEY". THEY DO NOT WANT HIM BACK. THEY ARE TALKING TO DONNER NOW. SINGER. IS. OUT.
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I agree with you harry nutsack. last week, I went to POTC 2. But i had tow wait until i go through the ad-crap before. I hate also when they repeat ads, two or three times. sometime ad-crap can be followed by trailer crap, which can be worse. No one in ireland saw failure to launch or that abomination imagine Me and you. Unlike POTC 2, at least the Sr was easier to follow. I wasnt as bothered by the kid, as alot of you seem to be. in lois and clark they did an episode in which a woman has a super child by becuase she said she shagged clark kent. There is a scene in Superman 2, where lois puts 2 and two together about clark and superman. SHe loves Superman and not Clark Kent, but doesnt realise, the two are the same and in the the second film towards the end in her apartment clark burns his hand on a candle and that is when Lois Realises that Clark and Superman are one in the same. Full of champagne, Clark and Lois hit the hay and when she wakes up the next morning with the brutal headache, clark is gone. Now it is left up to your imagination what went on in the bedroom scene. Superman the movies were a product of the regan and nixon era. family values were very much in vogue, so they couldnt show anything not out of line with the Reagan era. Child born out of wedlock, that kind of thing. Superman was a safe character, bland and is today, they should have toned down the Jesus bit, and was the whole green kryptonite thorn really necessary. Look, the film looked great and was techinally very well and thought the scene with Supes blasting the island into outer space was amazing.
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By either Harry or Bryan Singer. X3 was a much better movie, and the final fight was better than all the action scenes in SR combined. The fact is the only reason fanboys love SR and hate X3 is because Singer has been kissing your ass for two years and it has nothing to do with the end product. Admit it, most of you made up your minds about the film way in advance of walking into that theater. I mean, if Brett Ratner made SR and it was the same exact film shot for shot, you would all be bitching about how retarded it was that he gave Supes a son. Admit it. And you wonder why Bay has kept TF under wraps, because he wants you to judge the film on its merits, not on some opinion Harry Knowles makes a year before release.
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That's amazing! I haven't seen Pirates 2 yet, so I can't wait to see Davy Jones, but man, I can't believe that was CGI!
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I agree with what you say. It is destroying any excitement that there should be for films. Summer films are there entertain. You make up your own mind whether you go to see a film or not. Hollywood has been very foolish in bleeding their products dry by giving the public too much information. I liked SR, despite the bland story and Kate Bosworth, This site has become posionous, I remember the shite generated by harry and his trolls about x-3(a film that I was hugely entertained by and that bridge scene, wow). That stuff which had nothing to do with film, itself, ie the gay bashing, was sickening in its homophobia. The people who mock, knock and deride, have very little idea about how hard it is to put a film together(i am talking Big budget here). What, you actually think putting a big budget film is easy. Hollywood hates this site. And when Harry falls off his two horses, which he says he is riding, running this site and making films. I would love to see the movies that has been talking about for the past three years. He should either Put or shut up. I think ben affleck is boring. I will say this for bay and i have said it alread, he knows how to make big budget action films. There was some stunning stuff in Pearl Harbour and the nmovie looked great and Bay reacreated the time perfectly. Ben is still boring. Harry cant have it both ways, sure cries of being a sell out sting. He is with hollywood or he aint, simple as that.
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I guess i'm on the other side of your proposed demographic. To my mind, and still to this day, I dont see a difference between singer or ratner; they both seem like journeymen directors to my mind. Anywho, I wasnt impressed by anything released from the singer camp concerning SR. I haved everything from the actors and costumes to storyline and obvious plotholes. That said, when I saw the film a few days after its initial domestic release I was completely blown away. Yeah, there are still some holes here and there, but nothing more serious than your typical popcorn film (ID4, Star Wars, and batman anyone?), and I really enjoyed the characterization, themes, effects, and cinematography. For the record, I also enjoyed X3 (albiet not as much as SR) and I came into SR with very, very low expectations, but the audiences around me on the three occasions I saw it, however, seemed to love it as much as I did. And to whomever made that post about supes only earning 11 mil over the weekend and thinking SR wont make 200 domestic, you are aware films earn money during the weekdays, arent you? Considering this is only the film's third week of release and already earned 163ish million, it seems a bit likely that it will creep into 200 by the end of its release.
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Jul 16, 2006 12:54:22 PM CDT
Astonishing special effects. It's too bad the film..
by r.c. the "wise"
underperformed.
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1)The retard behind me who thinks I paid $10 to listen to him talk to his buds like he's sitting in his own living room.
2) Sloppy projectionists who don't pay attention to whether or not they (A.) Are using the right projection lens (B.) Have the friggin' film centered on the screen (C.) Forget to turn down the auditorium lights when the movie begins.(D.) Could care less if the sound is turned on or off
3) Asshats who put their feet up on the back of the chair in front of them
4)see point number one
5)see point number one, again -
Was that comment about me? Dude, I'm 20, I work for T-Mobile, and I live in Bakersfield. I am soooooo not a WB plant. Just saying, she doesn't get worked up about stuff like I do. She didn't want to see Da Vinci Code (she liked it) she liked Poseidon, she loved M:I3, we both loved F&F: Tokyo Drift, X3, I thinked its deeply flawed, don't get me started on jean...she thought it was too silly, and she didn't like that jean died. We both loved SR. Her taste against mine is all I'm saying. She has never read a comic book in all her life...I want to know what Richard Donner thinks of SR. Anyone ever read the novel, "the death and life of Superman"? The end of SR reminded me of it, when he was in the hospital. Dude I want to see how the game advances the story ahhhhh! We get or sequel in Nov on Xbox360...
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Jul 16, 2006 1:17:28 PM CDT
I wonder if middle America didn't see the film cause of
by r.c. the "wise"
all the "gay" rumors regarding the star, director, writers. A couple of pals of mine who work in the marketing research department for WB informed me how this, as well as other poorly executed marketing tactics contributed to Superman's lackluster performance. Overall, Superman received more positive reviews than X3, The Da Vinci Code, or Pirates II. Yet, it seems highly inprobable that the film will make $200 million domestically. That's a disasterous letdown. Additionally, it doesn't bold well for addtional DC future franchises like WonderWoman, Flash, and Green Lantern. Look for their budgets to be substancially reduced to turn a profit. The researchers are looking at all avenues to make a logical summation of whether or not to continue the franchise. That homophobic mindset could've contributed to the low turn out. Even if the film is a huge disappointment with poor word of mouth, those traits are normally shown in the second weekend of release. Supes made less than $85 million the first five days. A film of this scale with a character of this appeal in conjuction with a holiday weekend should've at least conjured up $150 million the first week. The only way they'll make a sequel is if the DVD sales are strong.
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And now I'm sold on it. Routh did a wonderful job, and if they make sequels, he'll only get more comfortable in the role.
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Honestly, if you took the Richard Donner movie, cut out that ridiculous "Can You Read My Mind" Margot Kidder scene, and made it with today's special effects, it would be AMAZING. But if you made this movie with 1970s special effects, it would be a piece of shit. Period. There would be nothing to watch. The stuff blowing up is nice, but it's few and far between and there's not enough character depth to sustain it anyway--not like Reeve had anwyway. For a movie to resonate it has to be human and this movie feels like a Martian wrote it, a robot directed it, and mole people starred in it.
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Let's assume the premise that "it's for kids" is correct. Is that any excuse for a sloppy plot that makes no sense? I heard many of the same arguments for the Star Wars prequels, and much in the same way cooler heads noted that no kid film involves decapitation, what kind of kid film involves death by piano? A good film is a good film, whether it's "Toy Story" or "The Shawshank Redemption." Both movies friggin' make sense and don't have the ignorance of storytelling evident in "Superman Returns." The "if you want to see any empty action film" arguments apply to SR in spades. All that was well done were the effects pieces, and all the rest that didn't have Spacy trying to salvage the script was dull and/or nonsensical.
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saved this movie from being a complete catastrophe. Of course, immediately afterwards Harry sold out to WB and basically did a 180. But releasing that script when he did was a major turning point for the Superman franchise. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me to find out it influenced Batman Begins, too.
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Remember what was originally planned : copy/paste
The first concept involves writer/director Kevin Smith. With his film Chasing Amy recently completed and generating good pre-release buzz, Smith was called in by executives at Warner Brothers to do some contract script work. He was offered a number of script ideas to develop or substantially revise, and was eventually shown an early script for the Superman movie by Gregory Poirer. After reading the script and discussing it with some Superman fan friends, he felt he had little to lose by telling Warner Brothers executives how bad he thought it was from the point of view of a comic book aficionado.
After a series of meetings involving more and more senior Warner Brothers executives, Smith met with Jon Peters and was eventually offered the chance to re-write the script. Peters laid down three major things that he wanted to see in the script:
Superman should never be seen flying on screen.
Superman should not wear the classic blue and red suit and cape.
Superman should fight a gigantic spider (later re-named a Tharangian Snare Beast) somewhere starting in the third act of the film.
Smith tried to work around these demands in creative ways (making Superman a blur that generates a sonic boom while in flight, for example) and eventually produced a script involving Superman, Brainiac, and Lex Luthor. Further demands from Peters for a fight between Brainiac and polar bears at the Fortress of Solitude, and a space dog sidekick for Lex Luther (to add the -
If you look at it as being about some other character with similar powers, then maybe it's a good soap opera movie, but as Superman it fails on every level. It's like Singer and everyone involved never picked up a Superman comic, or even bothered to watch the Dini/Timm version in any of the superior animated shows. The entire SPIRIT of Superman was lost- He went from being an authoritarian MAN to a whiny, confused, cocksure boy, and kind of a jerk, too. He's no leader, he's barely a follower. Lois is a kid who apparently got knocked up by Superman while she was a world-class teenage journalist. The kid was totally unnecessary, the husband was the only decent guy in the movie (He was more of a hero than Clark/SM ever was) and Lex was ridiculous and embarrassingly stupid. Nobody paid any attention to the personality Superman has had for the past 50 years- Instead, they imbued him with a lot of the worst qualities of the 90s heroes. He was a selfish, lovesick, jealous, ungrateful prick. There's a reason X3 kicked ass- Someone read a comic book.
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Was I high or didn't Jackman film a cameo as Pa Kent? And oh yeah Superman Returns was good if good you mean that it lacked the heart, soul and emotional impact of say... Superman IV.
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really. where were the LGBT's when this thing opened? Why aren't THEY helping this to break 200 now? please. even they know better. the whole world knew the marketing for this was courting the LGBT's right down to "The Advocate" mag cover, and yet today where is the gay voice/support? ....(insert crickets here....) the "homophobic mindset" unfortunately is the worlds market's largest paying demographic. respect it
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SR Supes is a creep. They don't get what is appealing about the character. Superman is the nicest guy there is, that leads, that you would trust your life with. That doesn't make him a Boy Scout. That is for simplistic people who don't understand what drives the character. He can have a selfish impulse, of course, but then he recognizes it and does what is right. He is a very intelligent character capable of going through a range of thoughts and emotions and then making deeply personal sacrifices. I guess Hollywood thinks no one can relate to that, but they're wrong. If you want to make a "smart" Superman film, make a movie about that.
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Be happy to spend your $10 on pretentious crap. Where is Superman? This is Superman and you will accept it. Whiner.
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had literally filmed a Psycho-like remake frame-by-frame of the Donner Superman that it would be making more money? The bottom line is no one wants to see a neurotic, Prozac-ready Superman dressed in dreary colors, set in a dreary palette. What a bunch of maroons!
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ABSOLUTELY FU**ING RIGHT!
This movie lacked everything Superman was ever made to be within the 50 years he existed.
And I don't know if you two, and the rest who actually read a Superman book once in their lives, are in the same state of mind as I am, but in my opinion only one man has ever humanized Superman... John Byrne's "Man of Steel" series.
He actually lowered down the Superpowers he once had so he was not so "God Like", and he even got the cape to shred by giving Superman an aura that makes anything within an inch or so invulnerable (as to why the costume isn't thorn to pieces).
JByrne's Man of Steel would've made one of the best movies ever instead of this crap that two schoolboys and an overzealous director made.
JByrne had made him more human and basically not so all powerful, which was great 'cause he could actually be hurt from time to time and having all but the green Kryptonite disappear from the storyline. Of course Dc Screwed it all once Byrne was off the Superman storyline, but they didn't go so far as giving him a Super-Kid knowing all to well that (forget the whole wonder woman speech, which was basically stolen from the Mallrats script) Alien genes and human genes would probably not mix really well.
I also agree that if this was not a Superman movie, it could've been on one of my best of flicks of 2006... But because they completely destroyed what Superman is, I have to give it a -5, which is 8 points less than I gave to Superman IV...
I really don't blame the actors, they were good, and you all must not forget that they are being "Directed" to a vision of what the director asks... This basically was nothing in this flick... I applause Routh, Bosworth, and Spacey for trying real hard to have a great movie... I would also like to smack around the Double Mint twins and Singer for fu**ing up so badly a story which gave us all wings when we were young... I think he once admitted to not being a comic book reader when he was young, so how can he now say he was a great fan of Superman and that he gets him on every level? I agree that he probably got his Assistant to google Superman on the web -
...homosexual reference because we all think that this movie sucked (no pun intended... i think?) I have an uncle who came out to his wife and three adult children about him being gay.. He nows lives with his partner and I am more than happy to have gain an uncle, instead of having a dead uncle because he was barely able to live with himself lying all those years... Plus one of my sister in law is married to yes another woman and they are now waiting a child (of course the donor is a gay friend of theirs.. hell the more I think about all this I should write a movie about this shit...)... and I love these people for having the guts to live and be happy instead of putting a bullet thru their skulls... So if you think that we are all homophobic because a gay Director did this crappy movie, you're way out of line... I would'nt have cares less if Routh, and Spacey were all freaking gay, that doesn't mean they can't do a great job with the part they're playing with (no pun intended again...).
No, the basis for 90% of what was wrong about this movie is that Singer tried something that does not reflect Superman in him having a child, him lifting a continent full of Kryptonite which would have killed him within the first second he touched that ground, and him being way too cocky (... pun intended I admit it..).
The Richard White character is the one true hero in this film, not Superman... He gave his love away to this woman by raising her child, then he helps her get back with Superman, then saving Superman (oh. yeah and Lois who can't stop putting her child in harm's way to get a freaking story yeah sure right, like me saying to my 16 month old little girl "Go ahead baby, go cut the grass in front with daddy's lawnmower"... riiight..) no this film was not a Superman movie.. it was a Superhero movie yes.. But not the story that should have been shown to people...
Who cares with who or what Singer sleeps with, gay or not, with those ideas the movie was flawed from the get-go... -
Snakes on a mother f****ing Space Shuttle!!
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However, I suspect it is the bad word of mouth killing it dead. You could tell by each of the trailers (no matter how hard they tried to misrepresent it as an action film) that there is huge dissonance between the image of what Superman is in the general publilc perception and what this film was presenting that likely kept people away. The film just stinks on so many levels. The only thing that didn't stink was the plane rescue sequence which simply should not have been that hard to top.
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now that the movie has tanked it's because people are filled with hatred toward fags. HAHA, this is a great spin WB you ignorant fucks. Instead of putting out a shitty remake of a 30 year old movie and copping to it, it's because people who find homos not quite their cup of tea didn't wanna go see it. This mindset is why Supes The Remake failed in the first place. Fuck this movie, I hope it flops on DVD to. Homophobes, gimme a fuckin' break WB.
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And what was with that E.T. dying hospital scene toward the end?
Really mediocre and disappointing.
SHITE!!!!!!!!! -
SR is cold like the X-Men films he did. This has been a summer of shit so far...
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I'm not going to watch it.
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there had been snakes on Lois's plane, absolutely. And I think I forgot to mention this...creating Supes as CG instead of just green-screening Routh into the shot was yet another huge waste of money by Singer and Co.
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following. Maybe it is time for hollywood to end its love affair comic books. Just stop making them, if they cant do them properly why do them at all. Normally if people stop watching something on tv, that is a sure sign that a program or programmes is not popular than that show is yanked off air. they tried but it didnt work out move to the next thing. At least by not making comics books, people then would not be able to make comments about that never met, about there sexuality. the idea that you can base sexuality on the fact that person makes comic books movies is outrageous, or two well because so and so is in a movie like superman returns therefore he is gay, is one of the stupidest things i have ever heard. So hollywood should just stop making something that doest work. and move on.
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There are about the same four or five people on the TBs going on about Singer being gay. The majority simply do not care. So take the drama elsewhere, eh?
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http://www.roadrunnerrecords.com/artists/NewYorkDolls/music.aspx
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If Singer wants to follow in Donner's footsteps so badly then the WB should FIRE HIM like the Salkinds. The franchise is totally salvagable. Keep the kid, Keep Routh, keep all the little stuff. I didn't have a problem with any of it. The real problem with Superman Returns was that it wasn't even the movie Singer kept pretentiously talking about. We never did see Superman in a world that didn't need him anymore. Just a lot of posturing, plot holes and horrible misteps. And yes, it was essentially "Superman Lifts". Ursa and Non lifting the bus full of people and throwing it at Superman was 1,000 cooler than this overated pedestrian plane sequence. Apparently Singer doesn't even "get" the Donner films. Hire someone who genuinely loves those films instead of some unoriginal hack who simply doesn't have the imagination to come up with anything on his own. Hire someone who can do something that brings respect and nods to those movies to the table but can inject their own original spirit of fun, excitement, action adventure and *genuine* romance. I'd say get Dick Donner himself to do the sequel but you can never really go home again...or can you. Anyhow, thank God HBO on Demand is Running Superman I and Superman II till the end of this month. Any of you still in trauma over this piece of crap need only go there.
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Who's idea WAS that point-finger-levitate thing in Superman II? And the cellophane S-Shield tossing concept; was that traceable back to LSD abuse or something?
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Um...Usual Suspects anyone? I think a lot of the heart from that film comes from the fact that these are all new characters and no one really knows what the hell is going on at first. Perhaps Singer should just stick with original content. And as for Supes having a kid, as much as I HATE that concept, its possible that it could have happened in Superman II when Clark was depowered and he was banging Lois (since this is considered a sequel to that). Although Supes erased her memories, perhaps he just left her the memory of how great it was to pork Superman to leave the door open for a booty call. How the kid would have powers in this case, I don't know, I just like using the term booty call in reference to Lois Lane. It gets even seedier when you consider Bosworth's age and the timeline of the films. I also stand by what I said earlier in that while SR entertained, the climax in X3 was the most true to comics fight I've seen on screen.
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Superman II is one of the greatest Superhero films ever made. Until Spiderman came along Superman I was the greatest. You're the troll who hates Batman Begins because they used a similar costume to the Burton films. I don't care what you think.
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got a little free-and-easy with the Superman powers. Doesn't work with the plot? Oh, there's a power for that.
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The telekinetic fingers and the cellophane S-Sheild don't hold up that well. I always chalk Zod and friends having the telekinesis as everyone from Krypton not getting the exact same powers from the yellow sun. The cellophane S is just another parlor trick of the fortress like all the holographic Supermen. I'll forgive Superman II that stuff because nothing yet in any Superhero film has topped the Kryptonian street fight. Yes, the effects are dated but the street fight is still awesome. Overall on screen General Zod could kick Magneto's ass into next week. Superman II is awesome even in it's camp. It's good camp. You could get high with your buddies and quote lines from Superman II for hours. I know I have.
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Moviemack never admits to the movies he enjoys watching (I've called him out on it, as have a slew of others, to no avail). In any case, yes, Superman 1 was indeed a reeeaaallly great movie, and if it werent for Hackman's version of Lex, I would called it perfect. Hell, I even like the ending, too (superman with his angry face has got to be one of the most chilling moments in comic books and comic movies). Again, if it werent for that stupid version of Luthor, the movie would have been even better than spiderman 2, in my eyes.
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But there is a lot of inconsistent character stuff, like Superman giving up his powers to bed Lois. You know, Donner & Co. probably did get high with their friends before writing that. Pffft... Wouldn't it be great if Superman got some? Shooooook....Yeahhhh, mannnnn.
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Because it was the only conceivable way a man could defy gravity and do the things Superman did. Still makes some sense, to my mind, but laser fingers, celophane S's, and Donner's inability to provide SOME exposition as to how Superman spins the earth pretty much lowered the mentality of the films. Still, I'm a pretty forgiving guy, and so Superman gets my full support. True, I also greatly enjoyed Superman Returns, so maybe my opinion doesnt hold much creedence around these parts...
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liked this movie. It was the fanboys who disliked it. In fact the complaints were as follows;The Kid!, It wasn't a donner film;Brandon isn't Reeve;Kate wasn't Lois. But those same people who complained of those things and what Superman wouldn't do support Smallville which doesn't follow much of anything of Superman. It breaks rules too. Then the same ones also like Lois and Clark and they called Superman Returns a Soap Opera?? Lois and Clark could have went straight to daytime TV alongside those other soapy's.
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It's "kill the man with the ball" here at AICN. "Hey, everyone, we HATE Singer, don't we?" "Yeah, yeah YEAH, hate Singer ... hate hate hate (fag) hate hate hate ..." See, it's not enough that they didn't enjoy the film (probably because it didn't conform to their fanboy script they wrote in their heads when they were twelve). Everything about it MUST SUCK!!!!!!!! See, it was, in fact - scientifically - the MOST BORING FILM ... EVER!!! Oh boy, any of you who believe that the film absolutely has to remain loyal to the whole fifty years of Superman storytelling MUST flip around this website for a while: http://www.superdickery.com/ Go now. And it doesn't even cover the "Blue Electric" phase. Look, none of us fuckers own "Superman" as a character, and there is no ONE "Superman" character. This is an interpretation as much as Donnor's was an interpretation. As much as the old cartoon, the "Superfriends," the new cartoon, George Reeves and the whole lot. It'll be interesting to see where this interpretation goes, especially with Singer's stellar track record in bringing comic book characters to life with real human drama (until, you know, the studio gets bored and flushes it all with a flash-in-the-plan EXPLOSION-FEST!!!!!). ... Oh, wait, I forgot. The Talkbackers - who have a finger directly on the pulse of big-wig studio execs - have spoken. See, they've said it's a bomb, so the franchise has been destroyed with the click of a button. Too bad. If only they'd read superninja's head beforehand and made the film HE wanted ... it'd broken every record ever. And you know that if it doesn't BREAK records then it was an abject failure. It's a FACT.
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or Dwayne McDuffie's head. They wrote and directed very intelligent Superman stories throughout their successful careers in animation. They actually understand the character. Superman Returns was dreck.
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Anything you liked in the past twenty years? Whats your favorite comic book films? Anything genre related? I mean, I've seen you here for quite some time, so surely you have something constructive to say, right?
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Now don't try to deny it--you do, you really do hate that film;)
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I was actually watching it the other night and I thought "that's fucking stupid. Even if he did spin the earth backwards that wouldn't reverse the flow of time" the sun would just reverse it's place in the sky. So the only way to rationalize that is that Superman actually flew so fast the he himself went backwards in time and not the earth. That makes a hell of a lot more sense. Though of course you run into all the Doctor Who crap about him being a part of the events and then it get's messy. But who cares, Lois was dead. Now she isn't. And yes, Superninja, Superman boning Lois in the fortress is very, very "seventies". I'd love to see the original version of that scene with Margot Kidder walking around the Fortress talking to the Brando hologram and wearing the Superman top as a nite shirt. Hopefully they'll have that in the new DVD in a few months.
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I hated that Donner whacked Pa Kent and made Jor-El Superman's real dad. That paved the way for Singer to put the nail in the coffin in Superman's humanity. Superman works better as a story of an immigrant, not an alien savior.
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the close up cgi shots of Routh didn't work for me at all, and a high percentage of them seemed unnecessary. I'd much rather see a super-imposed 'real' Routh and use my imagination (ala reeve), than see a lifeless computer rendition. the second to last cgi shot of supes ascending into the sky really bugged me as i was already feeling low, as I thought the shallow exchange between lois and superman was a poor end to the film.
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I'm diggin' it, thanks! Watching Marlon being brought back from the dead was delightfully creepy and this was cool too! The planet and lighting was neat to see textured as well.
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finger thing as well as the cellophane "S" insignia came from Richard "I am an asshat" Lester -- NOT Richard Donner. That is all.
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And I am not kidding around. I smoked for 12 years and I stopped (notice I did not say quit) in 3 days. If you're a smoker (it doesn't matter how heavy), and want to know how to stop (don't have to stop today - just want to know how so you can when you're ready), just let me know right here and I'll give you the information - right here. I'm serious about this.
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Jul 16, 2006 7:39:53 PM CDT
Superman Mopey? Moviemack, did you ever read Superman?
by brokebackcowboy
Since I was a kid reading Superman comics, Superman was always "mopey". The idea that Superman always felt isolated was embodied in the concept of the Fortress of Solitude. It's part of the Superman lore.
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That's why Spiderman 2 is kind of a letdown. Thank CGI spiderman gets annoying after awhile especially when it's simple stuff like him tying his webs to sling shot himself. Greenscreen composites with real actors always look better. That's why the scene in Smallville where Clark flys up next to the plane and rips the door off looks better than most of the CGI flight stuff from this dud. How sad.
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and garabage S symbol thing in the fortress of solitude, but why does General Zod use it on the rednecks? wtf is that power anyway. lets just give superman new powers. what the hey, hehe
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I did see it on opening day and I can't wait to see it again on IMAX. Then when it's released on DVD I will buy it and watch it over and over again just I do with X1 and X2.
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::Damn that enter button::
Anyway, I have come to the conclusion that the only way to be "cool" is to hate something, therefore if you hate everything you will become the "coolest" person alive by proxy. Therefore I shall begin by saying, of course, Superman Returns and Bryan Singer sucks (ENTER GAY JOKE) and I hate them, just think how much better SR would have been if all the film wanted to do was entertain, like Pearl Harbor (the movie, not the event). Imagine Superman just killing anyone that was bad, like instead of sending Lex Luthor to jail he'd just punch a whole through his abdomen, simple yet crowd pleasing. On to X-3, it really just sucked, I mean this sincerely. As far as hating everything, the only real way to prove you hate everything is to commit suicide, that's why Kurt Cobain, Hunter S. Thompson and Socrates are the proverbial shit, cause they were so cool they just said "Fuck it". So anyone wanting to be labeled "cool" seek the help of the sages Smith and Wesson. -
see above.
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See zfisk.
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obviously the kids have a lot of bitching to do about the movie
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it's a lot more fun to be an asshole than to be a nice guy. there's a lot of them on this website
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I thought it was funny, gripping, heartbreaking, etc. Commence shitting on my opinion . . . now!
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Singer has become another great epic filmmaker of our time. I'm so glad they picked someone with a clear vision who respects for the characters and makes them feel real. A director with an eye for casting (Hugh Jackman anyone?) A director with a history of making great comic book films that are still brilliant and have stood the test of time. A director with a strong visual style which nobody ever talks about cause they clearly don't understand what it is that makes a great director. I really would not trust another director. Another director would have changed it too much. If a director changes up the characters too much then the fanboys complain (Transformers talkback) but when someone comes along with a respect for the material enough not to change what works they say "boring! nothing new! not original!". So you see they will hate no matter what, while the real world will continue to acknowledge directors like Singer and appreciate their work over and over again.
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Give it up for the summer interns of the WB's Marketing Dept! Great job kid!
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1. The trailers made obvious that the Superman they'd picked was a look-a-like, and the track record for those in film and tv alike is dismal. Not only movie geeks feel that.
2. The trailers likewise showcased Spacey, looking unsettlingly like he did in his cameo and the film version of Dr. Evil, hamming it up in fine Gene Hackman form. Plus, Spacey, on the heels of The Shipping News and other dreary non-earners, didn't give the film the big star excitement he once would have. And really, he's the only known face. Bosworth's well below even Dunst, for example, on the Hollywood power charts, and Routh is an unknown.
3. The trailer had some great effect sequences, but even it didn't look fun. And super hero movies get people into the theaters the first week with the thrill the character can deliver, Spidey swinging through NY. There was nothing about the trailer that even remotely threatened to raise the hair on the back of your neck.
4. The reviews were good, but they were good in a way that raised warning flags for fans of the character and did little to excite non-fans wanting to spend a night at a big summer movie. And since Superman probably needs a pretty good family demo to make the big bucks, the two hour plus running time was just silly.
5. Maybe the truth justice and whatever hurt it. I heard about that in quite a few places. I think it was a bum rap, especially considering they also couldn't choke out "It's a bird, it's a plane, it's Superman" but in addition to whatever patriotic hackles it might have raised it also smacked a bit of making sport of the hero. Superman's a character you sort of have to take as a package. For Superman to generate Super movie excitement you would have to generate a very delicate suspension of disbelief. So anyway, there were a lot of things that probably contributed to a not very dynamic opening, and afterwards, yeah, word of mouth has hurt a lot. Or maybe everyone's homophobic and the general movie going audience knows Singer's preferences and stood up as a nation to shout that only heterosexuals may tought the sacred texts of Action Comics. Geez. -
so obvious
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WB summer intern program indeedy!
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You fucking retard! What the hell does "zfisk" mean anyway, at least my handle has a sense of irony. I am offended (if that's even possible) at the accusations that I am [1] an alias of another individual [2] a person who loves animals. So you can shove your' "inability to type more than two seconds worth of cohesion" sense of humor up your cockass.
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that be funny, when people are in danger he just flies in and tells jokes during their predicament.. any takers/adders?
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Allen Moore took that one some 20 years ago. But his Comedian was more of a jingoistic, egotistical, rapist than the flying comic you're describing. I'm named after a jingoistic, egotistical, rapist. Gotta luv them funny books.
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And I love Bill Nighy. But the character was a total bore beyond it's design. You can have all the cool technology you want, but if the characer is a snooze on paper it wont matter.
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All these posts from a five-second FX clip? Oh, Superman, how mighty is your sperm!
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Gotta agree. The effects in Smallville are more "fun" than these over the top affairs. With the Clark catching a plane sequence in Smallville I'd add the scene where he flies to catch the missile. One of the main differences is that Welling's expresion displays more emotion and realism than what Routh delivered in the action scenes. Welling looks as if he's giving all he's got to save people. The scene with the machine gunner from Returns....look at Routh there, the animated Superman displays more realism
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People forget that the domestic box office a film does is only the tip of the iceberg in terms of how much money a film really earn. Most big budget earn about the same amount of money overseas as they do here in the states, sometimes significantly more. A couple years ago, Troy did about 3 times the business overseas as it did here. Most studios are now making 4-6 times as much on DVD sales as they are on first run ticket sales. Then factor in all the product tie ins (tons and tons of Superman toys and other products). Superman Returns may wind up being a disappointment, but it will be profitable in the long run and there will be a sequel, though the studio may decide to make it more kid friendly than Returns.
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most entertaining thing about POTC2 and can't wait for the sequel.
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Oh.."Superman Returns" I get it now, it's always only been about the returns......If the iconic Superman ain't flying in the U.S. like expected, I don't think much of the rest of the world will be more interested than American fans. The Red, White and Blue don't put bums on seats outside the U.S. anymore........as evidenced by lame attempts at dropping those "patriotic" elements from the film
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... what with your logic and reasoning about ACTUAL studio returns on their investments. You see, here at the Talkback, we have the REAL experts. They have the inside scoop, straight from their GUT! The new movie is a failure, get it? Why? Because it SUCKS! (You can't argue with capital letters.) Everyone hates it. (Everyone, I tell you!) And they're leaving it pissed ... expect rioting in the streets. In fact, word of mouth is so shitty, governments are being overthrown in response. And if you don't agree, you're a fucking moron. Here at the Talkback, they've consolidated "opinion" and "fact" so that propositions such as "the franchise is DEAD and Singer's career is OVER" don't require any thoughtful analysis. Saying it MAKES it true ... so you just take your merchandising and your overseas BO returns and shove it. (Aside from the fact that, you know, you're probably absolutely right ...)
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woah, talk about sour grapes and exxagerating to absurdity just to spite people.. hey,if you think weve been beating the drum too long now.. just wait til this week. your misery will endure because the sequel status aint been told yet. until then, expect more weeks of untold wrath an brimstone upon your multiusernameshillplantModhead.. for those who missed it,singers' priceless reaction here is very telling and clear(at least to me) that he is in fact "OUT". http://us.video.aol.com/video.index.adp?mode=1&pmmsid=1676445
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that video. It is indeed priceless. No pun intended but I bet WB has been riding his ass since this fucker proved to be a turkey. He is in complete shock the question was even asked. What a fucktard. I'm glad he's out.
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CG was so good at times I thought it was "MAN IN SUIT". Oh yeah. Angela's Eyes TB has been hijacked to discuss the finer things in life!
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me a question akin to: Hey, how do you like being sunk by the competition?
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How did he know where she lived? I figured he would go to her Penthouse. Weird how most of the City in SR is just background material unlike it being a character like in Spiderman. Metropolis looked dull boring and monochrome.
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So, yes, I imagine he did. Did you ever watch the anime cartoon the Big-O on Cartoon Network? In season 2 they get into a discussion of different philosophies on the nature of reality and the characters are performing in a play within the show. That's what this reminds me of - an adaptation of the Donner films by Singer, performed within the framework of the Donner story. Actors playing actors playing characters in very contrived sets. Weird little number.
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Thanks for that, quite telling really.
Singer looks like he's illiterate...but serves 'em right. Who'd let a guy who can't string a sentence together be in charge of reinventing a franchise the size of Superman, or any film worth $250,000,000 -
After you get completely owned on talkbacks and disappear for a few days before returning with renewed vigor -- like now -- is it because you start taking your medication or stop taking it? Check out the glorious insights of zfisk/homewrecker on his blog: www.homewrecker-returns.blogspot.com
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Those were to save money, aded after he was fired. If you watch the movies, you can see which stuff Donner filmed because all of the Fortress stuff was filmed early on when Reeve had A DIFFERENT HAIR STYLE (slightly longer on the top and parted different) and he was much skinnier (almost laughably so). Richard Lester was hired to just finish the film (which was mostly shot), with a small budget, and they limited any fighting in the fortress (which is also why the villains used the finger rays when they landed in "Houston").
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...but for adults it comes down to two different views: you either accept that they are childish, say the same way that fairytales are for kids but still appreciated by adults (for various reasons)...OR ELSE YOU TURN INTO SELF-LOATHING fanboys who CONSTANTLY want approval from the world for still liking comics. So you always approach superhero stuff (movies, t.v. shows, etc.) with the idea that they will somehow validate your love of superhero comics in the eyes of the world. And when the film's tone is not dark/violent enough or, MORE IMPORTANTLY, not logical enough, you get all angry. When you read the comics you will let ALL SORTS OF IDIOTIC concepts slide by ("Why the fuck would that guy where those kind of boots? And that color?"), but when watching superhero films you have a different set of needs. You want them to seem less silly when they are on the screen than when they are on the page. You really just need to accept that comics are for kids. They make NO SENSE. They are ALWAYS illogical. No one wears tights to fight crime! It makes no sense! No one dresses up like a bat TO SCARE people! That is stupid. How is that frightening? It's not. But so what? The very concept of "superhero" requires great and immediate suspension of disbelief. Always. Sometimes films try to address the childish nature of the characters, sometimes they don't. In the case of Superman, the myth of the character is usually enough; that's why the 1950s t.v. show worked, why the 1960s cartoons worked, and why the Reeve movies worked. Batman is much different because it's hard to convince an audience that a live action person would dress up like that (in the Adam West show they didn't even bother trying to explain it; they recognized how absurd it was and went from there...). SMALLVILLE tries to make things a bit more realistic because they try to deal with real-world stuff like dating, high school drama and that sort of FELICITY crap. BUT ALL OF THOSE EXAMPLES are still silly. I mean, I love the X-Men comics, but for crying out loud their costumes are RIDICULOUS!!! In fact, most of MARVEL's characters have incredibly dumb costumes. You all must recognize that! So try not to get too cynical when you watch these films, because if you like the comics SOMEHOW you can accept all that silliness and take it all in as "serious". You should really be able to view superhero FILMS that way, too. Unless, of course, you are secretly ashamed of superheros.
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I saw it on Friday and have been letting it settle since. My level of expectation changed a lot over time, but by the time I went to see it I was very hopeful and just buzzing about seeing a Superman film in the cinema again. What a shame I didn't really see a Superman film in the cinema. So much wrongness on the screen in so many ways. Why can't someone do Luthor right for a start? If Lois can morph from a seasoned hack in the Donner film to a, well, child, in this one, why couldn't Luthor have been presented differently. I want to see a billionaire Luthor plotting in his penthouse, while Supes floats outside goading him. If you present the character as having so much economic, political and cultural power that he spreads throughout Supermans world like a disease, THEN he becomes a threat to Superman, something he can't just fight with brawn. And what was Singers plan for the sequel (HA!) "Superman and Son: You Will believe a child can lift things"? Where was the magic, the adventure, the sense of wonder, the spirit, the energy, the awe? Okay. I'll stop. It's sunny, I have the day off work and I should really get a life and get outside. Just one more thing, if anybody is as excited as I am about the Donner cut of Superman II and you know where I can find out some more about it (apart from the usual places/sites) can you post some links. After this bloody mess and all coverage AICN has given it, they better do justice to and give decent coverage to the real Superman event happening this year in November. Pull Returns and stick that in the cinema as soon as it's done WB.
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My mrs suggested we see this on saturday so off we went. I'm not a massive Superman fan but I was pretty sure it would be a solid popcorn thriller. It started off brilliantly with the John Williams score and the credit style duplicated from the '78 original, the camera flying through space... everything was excellent until after the shuttle rescue when it slows down to a snails pace and follows Supermans emotional trauma and Lex Luthors boring and utterly stupid idea which just about any modern army could have thwarted, in fact it probably would have been harder for Superman to thwart due to the Kryptonite. Any baddie would have been better than Lex luthor. The thing is everything was well intentioned, the acting and cast was solid but the pacing and the story was terrible- way too long, I don't know how a 12 year old would sit through it - people in my cinema were walking out due to boredom (and I add that I'm in the UK where people are a little more restrined). Due to Jacksons LOTR + Kong suddenly everybody making a family film thinks 2.5 hrs and three false endings is the done thing.
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that's all.
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I mean, there's just something that doesn't sit right with any of us. I liked it, I thought it was a good film personally... but I can see that it's a film that has issues. big issues. the thing is...... what are those issues?? Is Routh good as superman? I just don't know. I think they could have done better. Is anyone well cast in this film?? Spacey perhaps but I just don't know damnit. And about this film being a 'semi' sequel. Damnit, I think now that its all said and done a brand new film may have been the way to go. The opening credits give me a lot of brain spasms. On one hand, the music is a fantastic rendition, but why did kryptons sun shrivil up before blowing up? that was just wierd. And you know how the original films opening had really poor special effects considering it was out at the time of star wars.... well, I think the space travel special effects were just as poor considering how good visual effects have been the past few years. Over all, a real mess of a film. But I still enjoyed it. But I also think X3 was a LOT better. oh well. who cares really. I just hope they don't screw the pooch on this films sequel.
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been the way to go...especially considering that new film would have been by abrams! I never read kevin smiths script...was it really that bad?
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Earlier, I was not trying to imply that you were also "zfisk". I was implying that zfisk (aka homewrecker) is a DUMB guy. But we all know that. However, I'm sorry for the lack of clarity and apparent confusion.
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Bitterness isn't NEARLY this much fun! (And if you think I'm exagerating, I guess you haven't actually been reading the Talkbacks ...) My point? Christ, people, let the film breath a little bit. I can just see some of you fuckers after Citizen Kane came out: "Booooooring ... what a let down ... and the critics HATE it ... Welles is such a fucking hack ... NO ONE will remember this film after the year's through!" And no, I'm not comparing SR to CK. I'm comparing a lot of Talkbackers here to ... well, Talkbackers who like to mouth off when a film lets them down instead of thinking, maybe, it's a film and filmgoers will have different reactions. Personally, I love the Hulk, despite the fact that a LOT of people here will tell you that liking that film is impossible. IMPOSSIBLE!
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i say nay.
yeah and...hugh jackman anyone?...wasn't his first choice...
dougray scott anyone?
it's just chance that cast hugh jackman.
if singer is worth anything it's luck.
the usual suspects was amazing because of the writing.
apt pupil because of mcckellen.
x-men because of the characters- even though they weren't even fully fleshed out-
superman returns well...singer finally got his way and look what we got- it lacks originality and it really didn't make me believe...they threw a kid in there which is such an incredibly easy and cheap trick. i would've hoped the writers and singer would've been smarter but eh...
the opening credits were the best part of the movie.
x-men 3 was dissapointing...incredibly so upon repeated viewings, so was superman returns...this has been a fairly dissapointing summer- so when a movie like pirates of the caribbean comes out that delivers on everything it promises- people will get excited.
and they did- i know i did.
singer WANTS to be the newest epic filmmaker...but it's just been luck so far- he needs to do something other than a comic book or even any adaptation. get away from the superhero thing- go back and do something original and show people what he's really made of
when it's just him.
or maybe he really is a hack. who knows. meh.
peace. -
I just learned that I didn't like Superman Returns because apparently a few homosexuals were involed in the making of this suckfest. I just didn't know that was the reason, thanks for clearing that up for me. I thought it was because it was too freaking long for my kids. Thankfully the theater was basically empty, about 10 other people not counting us, and this on the Friday the movie was released so my kids and my nephews could run up and down the isle. Hollywood simply has got to remember superheros are for kids and the kid in us, so make it shorter, the humanity of the hero is great but we are talking about a grown man running around in a costume so QUIT bringing it up so much that the absurdity of it becomes way to apparent. And last make it fun, spiderman was fun, skykids was fun, the incredibles was fun. Hollywood is going to kill superhero movies because they simply can't understand that the the basics of any popular idea, superman, transformers you name it need to be left alone and then create a story using the characters as the fans know them.
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Jul 17, 2006 10:13:01 AM CDT
so far down, stretched tb, noone will read this FUCK CG
by regicidal_maniac
If you're gonna use CGI for things that can be done with the real live actor in a studio then why not go the whole hog and completely CGI the cast of Superman ala Jar Jar or those fish guys in Pirates. Then we could have the perfect Superman, the perfect Lois etc and no need to recast ever, just use the template Perfect Superman model and voice actors like a big screen CGI version of STAS. Then at least you have no excuse to cast a boy and a young girl in parts that demand a man and a woman.
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Why am I here posting obsessively? Because I have nothing better to do? Ha, I wish! Okay, what has me really concerned after seeing the mediocre-fest that was X3 rack up higher BO receipts on the cheap (rushed out by the studio with "lowest common denominator" director Ratner) and POTC2 break every record is NOT that the studios will say to themselves, "Gee, those films did REALLY good ... let's head over to the AICN talkback and see why ..." Nor do I think the studio heads at WB are saying to themselves, "Eh, eighth biggest Wednesday opening in movie history just AIN'T enough these days ... let's see what the geniuses over at AICN talkback have to say ..." NO -- HERE'S WHAT FREAKS ME OUT -- studios are more likely (in my estimation) to say, "Hey, you can get a really mediocre director, throw a bunch of under-developed stock comic characters in a film set mostly at night (to save on effects) and pump it out at ONE HOUR, THIRTY MINUTES ... but to really seal the deal, what we need is PRETTY FACES! Yes, more Orlando Bloom ... more teen dreams for the girls, more EXPLOSIONS for the boys ... and get me the cheapest director you can find. Someone without any of that 'vision' crap so that we can pump it out before next summer." I'm not calling Singer's vision FANTASTIC (pales next to Donnor, but most superhero films do), but at least the guy fucking tries and he seems to make his decisions deliberately. I'd much rather support strong directors that studio "lowest fucking common denominator" thinking. THAT'S what has me concerned. You honestly think a bunch of us fanboy wankers are pulling any strings here? HERE'S THE BOTTOM LINE by my guessing --> do it on the cheap + pretty faces - director w/vision = BREAK BOX OFFICE RECORDS!!! (repeat as necessary) Ugh ...
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But I'd rather not support a director the makes movies that put me to sleep. And it fucken makes me laugh when the Singer fanboys come in on their high horse and trash movies that actually FUN to watch. Some vision Singer had. He couldn't decide whether Superman Returns is a sequel or a remake.
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Jul 17, 2006 11:33:56 AM CDT
Amazing CGI...but they totally could have just shot it.
by minderbinder
No reason to do that with CGI, just put him on a wire and act it out. I generally liked SR, and it is doing well at the box office, there's no denying that. Problem is, they spent so much it needed to do spectacularly at the BO to make a profit. Too bad, I'd like to see them come back and improve things in a sequel or two.
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I LOVED this movie. I loved the acting, I loved the special effects, I reeeeeally loved the opening credits, I cried when Luthor and his thugs were kicking Superman while he was down, and I loved Singer's direction. The man has immense talent. You don't make make Usual Suspects, Apt Pupil, and the first two Xmen flicks and make them all great if you don't have talent, and that talent was on full display in Superman Returns. The right color palettes, the right lighting, fantastic, beautiful shots, it had it all.
Once again, commence shitting on my opinion . . . NOW! -
http://www.comicbookmovie.com/news/articles/2838.asp
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So it bored you ... whoop-tee-do ... I've been proven wrong before (*sigh* too many times to count) but I'm going to be willing to put my money where my mouth is on this one - I've NEVER regretted seeing a Singer film in the theaters ... and I've NEVER regretted waiting to Netflix a Ratner film. I don't give a fuck who liked X3. I don't wish the franchise ill - FOX seemed intent enough on destroying the whole thing all by itself, and that does piss me off ... there's no reason we shouldn't be talking X4 right now, but they fucking CHOSE to destroy that franchise. (Not by poor scripting or whatever, but by deliberately scripting the thing into the ground with a "rush job" mentality.) I'm looking at a director's potential in the long run over several films. Singer brought us USUAL SUSPECTS (top 5 film for me - I can watch three times in one day ... okay, maybe on a really slow, rainy day ...) one good X-film and one FUCKING AMAZING X-film. Whatever you think of Ratner, no way in hell would I put that track record up against the "Rush Hour" mastermind. Talkbackers like you, Thumper2k1, seem to have the memory span of a goldfish. Sure, HULK wasn't everyone's cup of tee, but good lord, ANG LEE!!! Fantastic Four (I'm guessing) probably made the studio more money ... it bored the shit out of me, but maybe people actually liked it more. But if you're looking forward to "TAXI 2: Electric Boogaloo" instead of wondering what Ang's going to do next ... wow, we're just on different planes. I'm not saying you SUCK if you dislike this film ... I'm not saying you SUCK if you like other films that came out this summer better. (There's some virus amongst many Talkbackers that convinces them that liking a film they don't like = person delusional/crazy/stupid.) I'm saying that regardless of how many records the other BIG blockbusters break this summer, I'll put my money on Singer in the long run ... and I hope and pray WB and DC don't go the quickie, "dime a dozen" Marvel approach. Trust me, you won't get "faithful to the fanboy" flicks that way. You'll get fucking Jackie Chan-level "action" with all your favorite Teen Dreams from the latest "OC" rip-off. I walked out of X1 thinking, "meh." I walked out of X2 thinking, "Holy Shit, Jesus has returned and he brought a movie with him." I'm more than willing to give Singer the chance to make a film I'll LOVE after giving me a take on Supes that I found entertaining enough for a good summer film.
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Are we supposed to believe AskaniSon2001 that Singer's phenomenal career so far has been based on luck? Is it lucky that he has earned the respect of other visionary filmmakers like Jackson and Cameron. The man clearly has skill, like mechasheeva said Superman Returns is brilliantly directed, Singer and his team used a a beautiful set of colors, set pieces, lighting, camera work, it was all there. Remember the Speilberg-esque scene in Superman Returns that ends with a shot of skyscrapers then fades to I believe Lois' room but it matched visibly, of course alot of you don't remember that. Remember in the hospital scene where we get a close-up of Superman's face and the camera just holds on his face for at least a full minute, and you think he's gonna open his eyes, but he does not. I guess you were too bored with the scene to notice the brilliant patience Singer showed there. Casting, whether you like it or not Singer knows how to cast a film and work with actors, not just Hugh Jackman either, can you imagine anyone else to play Xavier or Magneto? how about the bunch of no names and underrated actors he discovered for Usual Suspects? I guess if you failed to recognize good direction and good casting, it's safe to say they also don't know much about good acting either which critics have mostly been happy with the acting in Superman Returns. Singer brought a story that had an emotional impact. He crafted the characters and made them memorable. He provided mind-blowing action set-pieces that served the story and made sense, it was never pointless. It's really sad to me what has happened to film goers these days. All they want is an hour and half of fast-paced mindnumbing action like a live action kids television program and they are satified.
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from now on, we have directors who actually are fans of the genre make the films. No more Singers, no more Burtons, and no more Ang Lee's. Although I should mention that I do not support giving said opportunities to the Albert Pyunns and the Mark Steven Johnsons of the world to make up for the wake caused by the disappearance of said Singers, Burtons, and Schumachers.
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Seriously, is this studio not done yet? If WB Pictures goes ahead and makes *I Am Legend* with Will Smith in the role of Robert Neville, then that disaster-in-the-making will finish off the studio for good. That combined with the defeat of HD-DVD and assorted loss of patent monies.
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Atleast The Hulk had some ACTUAL character depth. That's where Superman went wrong. It tried to be deep, but it ended up being more shallow than a puddle of water. The whole "emotional" side of the story revolves around the fact that Superman was such a cocksucker that he couldn't tell the woman he loved that he's going away for awhile. What? Did he think she wouldn't understand his need to go back to his roots? Bullshit. He had no problem telling his mother. 5 years later Lois moves on with her life and Clark seems surprised by this. How dare she move on even though he leaves her without saying one fucking word? Then we get to see more of Superman's "depth" while he uses his super-powers to stalk Lois. And just when I think Superman couldn't get deeper, he starts flirting with an engaged woman who has a kid. Never mind that it's Superman's kid, because at the time he didn't know. Superman didn't care if he is wrecking the boy's family life. The saddest thing about Superman Returns was that the Richard White character was more "Superman" than Superman was.
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Sky News today said it's on the way to becoming the "biggest-grossing film of the year" - so somebody, somewhere is happy.
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One of the most important comic book films, brought a reemergence of seriously made comic book films. It is so full of great moments. The film begins brilliantly with the Magneto concentration camp scene. We get the first snowy perfect introduction to the Hugh Jackman as Wolverine character and early fight with Sabertooth. We get introduced to Patrick Stewart as Charles Xavier and the school. Ian Mckellen was great as Magento although I admit his plan was not that great. Cyclops actually used his powers, why he became less important in the next two sequel I have no idea. The characters were true to the comics. The mutant battles were fun. I think people may need watch it again.
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And what you described - just to get around to real discussion of the film's merits (*gasp!*) - sounds to me like a lot of emotional depth. You sound upset that he's not completely forthright and virtuous. My take on it was ... what the hell could he say to anyone? The Donnor take on the character has emphasized his alienation from the world (no pun there - he is an alien, he feels alienated). The closer he got to Lois, the more he realized that his Clark/Superman identities would never successfully merge. And yes, he was bloody arrogant, too! I'd kind of guess that having nearly limitless power might do that to someone. He left when he wanted to, and that's the pivot point. It immediately adds an emotional dimension. Honestly, how dare he leave!? I take it that it makes Superman fatally flawed and (the bane of all superhero flicks) "not the REAL Superman." I don't think it's "sad" at all that Richard was more of a "superman." It made Lois's decision both understandable and smart. Richard flies (in a plane) but he never hides his identity ... doesn't hide behind glasses ... doesn't constantly push Lois away. He's tragically human, but he's willing to risk his life all the same. He's not some putz substitute. He's the real deal, and Superman knows that. And yeah ... Superman is wrong and creepy when he follows Lois home to look inside. I don't think that's a flaw in the script. It shows that, yeah, having all that power can lead a person to abuse when he's in love. (There's something so puritanical about some fans here - like, it's all locker room talk about how we'd all use our X-Ray vision to peek in on the ladies changing, but the thought that Superman might actually do something only a fraction so offensive is blasphemous.) I took the film as the flip-side to Superman's mighty power. On the one hand, no human really can compare without cheating ... but goddamn, isn't Luthor RIGHT when he says that "Gods are selfish beings that fly around in little red capes and don't share their powers"? Not only that, but Superman was so isolated in his Fortress of Solitude that he wouldn't he even tell people he was leaving. Shit! That's emotional depth that's hard to swallow ... but it sounds to me like real questions you'd ask a real "Superhero." Why does it take a crook to steal Superman's secrets? What else is Superman hiding behind that "I'm always around" smile? What an arrogant fuck! Yet, one who's willing to bring himself to the brink to save mankind. Christ, there's so much packed into this film ... and you can say that the emotional depth is deeply troubling and contrary to the Superman you know and love (that wouldn't be Blue Electric Superman, would it? Because, you know, that would oh so "true" to the comis - sorry, my point is that Supes has evolved over the decades, so how "true" to the character could you possibly be?) but I don't buy it that the film is "shallow."
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First you got these people saying Superman is gay. Then you got these Repulican wackos saying he's not American enough. Then you got these fanboy holding some grudge against Harry for hating X-men. This is just ridiculous. Why do people want to hate this movie so bad? Maybe the world doesn't need Superman.
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i'm not saying that bryan singer isn't talented- i think he is. as i said- from what i've seen so far i don't really know HOW talented the man bryan singer is. so far it just...its quite curious that many of the decisions that other people made or the happy accidents are what created the best of his work. the best part of all of singers films has been the writing. i just think saying superman returns is "brilliant" is a bit...crazy...because as a film- it is not. as a comic book film it's not even.
it's one of those movies that is frustrating, as were most movies this summer: so close to possibly reaching greatness but those few mistakes just hit so hard it was just painful. and unfortunate. i never said x-men 3 or superman returns were BAD BAD movies. i said they were dissapointing. i had fun in both- but i didn't think about them afterward really until i'm reminded of them by someone else...nor did i have any true desire to see either again by my own volition.
but what do i know...
peace. -
and yes zooch i for one enjoyed the first x-men to the second- minus the awkward fighting scenes- it actually made me wanna be a hero, unlike superman, batman begins or x2.
peace. -
He fought for dead beat dads, husbandless families, bastard kids, Brian Singer, two gay writers, Frank Langella, stalkers, non-black casts, cgi over plot and images of 9/11 used to sell a superhero film.
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That's being as shallow as you possibly can be. It makes no give a damn about him or his problems. Which is bad considering he is the title character. He's creepy and almost a villain in movie. But he is supposed to be the HERO. This isn't Richard White Returns. It's Superman Returns. But I am glad you brought up the god angle because Superman in the movies is an allegory to Jesus. Which is why he wouldn't be using his powers for personal gain. Though I don't know why you would agree with Lex about gods being selfish and not sharing their power. Especially when Lex gets the "power of the gods" and his first instinct is to cause the deaths of billions. As for Superman being too isolated in the fortress. I don't know where you got that from. Especially when he spends most of his time in metropolis. And there you have it. The movie fails on a emotional level, because Superman is nothing but a dipshit in the film. It fails on a intellectual level, because Lex's not-even-half-baked diabolical scheme is probably the most idiotic scheme ever filmed. It doesn't even work on a visual level because (with the exception of the plane rescue) the isn't anything to see. Except Superman floating around in drab colours.
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Just saw the film, very disappointing. Crap opening with Luthor. Crap title sequence, no oomph behind it. Very disjointed, terrible plot, not one memorable line of dialogue. A bit rubbish really. Oh well.
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At least on *Lois & Clark* and *Smallville* the producers were smart enough to portray Clark Kent as the true persona and not a phony alter-ego of Kal-El's. That's the best thing that Byrne brought to the mythos, along with his take on Lex Luthor. You know, the take on proto-Lex that *Smallville* follows. Yet despite the massive budget on this film, the producer, writer, and director did not go for such a take and decided to retread the tired characterization of the original Donner films despite the progress made in terms of characterization in the comics and other more recent adaptations. This is why some of us are willing to equate Smallville > Superman Returns despite the long history of sub-part scripting on that series. And if the storytelling on a $260 million film isn't greater than a television series on a 4th rate television network, then one should not greenlight such a project.
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I'm channeling my inner-Reagan there. YOU WROTE: "Which is why he wouldn't be using his powers for personal gain." Sure, in MY SUPERMAN, BY THUMPER2K1, I'm sure Superman would act exactly as you would have him act. But you're using the old "b-b-b-b-b-but that's not how my hero acts" line. Raimi's Spider-Man isn't REALLY "Spider-Man" because he doesn't make witty banter. Lee's Hulk isn't REALLY "Hulk" because Bruce doesn't seek a cure in desparation. "Blah, blah, blah," I say! Again, it's a challenging view of the character, which I found troubling but intriguing. And I never said Lex was virtuous, but he made a valid point about Superman, that's all. And dude, it's called the fucking FORTRESS OF SOLITUDE. It's not called his "weekend getaway for shits and giggles." It's where he goes to be alone and remember who he really is ... i.e., NOT human. "Though you've been raised as a human, you're not one of them." The movie fails for you, buddy. That doesn't mean THE MOVIE FAILS, THERE YOU HAVE IT! Wow, proof positive ... done deal, it's a fact. WRONG! Your fucking opinion. And "nothing to see"!?! Okay, your opinion and your choice to wear blinders as the film was rolling. Lifting the continent? Flying through the city, turning upside-down and shooting heat rays? How about the sight of all those people on the street standing still and staring upwards? That gave me chills everytime I saw it! The opening sequence ALONE had more to look at than any other film I've seen this year. Though, I'll say, for all I liked and disliked about the film, there was really only ONE scene that I thought raised above the usual comic-book movie morass - when Supes is in the hospital, and you feel all the chaos of the ER and these helpless doctors trying to do something for the man who saved their lives. And everything they try is useless and the machines blow up - THAT was the magic that was missing from the rest. More scenes like that would've made this a masterpiece instead of just a good summer flick. ... DISCLAIMER: My opinion. So there you have nothing but my dumbass opinion. Christ, at least I don't take the same fucking arrogant stand so many people here do: "Done, it sucks, 'cause I say so, ... um, OBJECTIVELY!"
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Does anyone have a link that doesn't have AOL requiring me to update anything? I would like to see Bryan trying to explain the lack of box-office.
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Maybe you have a point EXCEPT that this movie is a SEQUEL to two movies that already fucking establish the character. Making it pretty idiotic to change the character for no reason other than Singer says so. As for the the fortress of solitude, maybe it's not called "His weekend getaway" but that's sure is why he uses it. In Superman II Lois asks Superman if he lives there and he tells her no, he lives a few blocks away from her. If this was a remake, all your point would be valid. But it's not.
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on why superman returns sucked. His take on the latest Star Wars films is classic. Boy do I feel like a goon for getting all excited during those mini movies Singer released on Bluetights.net
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Singer is so utterly, fabulously flabbergasted at the comment he can barely get out a p.c., super non-answer. Well I guess it is a little entertaining to see him squirm a bit. Despite what fols associated with the film say at this point they know its commercially a failure. I'm not talking just box office wise - I mean there is no buzz at all with this movie. There is no "Oh man you gotta see it!" factor amongst the people. Coming in second to Pirates was foreseen and acceptable but you gotta have at least a strong word of mouth and this film sorely lack that. Don't brand me a hater because I enjoyed the movie, I liked it, didn't love it but I'm just calling it as I see it. And I echo the sentiments earlier in the talkback - during the Comic Con presentation someone must confront Singer about his choices, make him defend his mediocre masterpiece, however do not be crass or rude, we need and honest, educated, well opinionated representative as our defender. So in case by some miracle of Allah a sequel is greenlit there will be some recognition of what us Superman fans want not just what Singer, his crap writers and the studio suits think we want.
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...SNAKES ON A PLANE!!! Hear me out, people. You see, if New Line does gangbusters with Snakes then studios will mindlessly follow the trend of listening to geeks on message boards and giving them exactly what they want verbatim. Which means me and Superninja will probably be the ghost writers of the next Superman film since the two of us have done the most collective bitching on it over the past few weeks. So WB if you're reading this, it's really simple. Keep Routh, keep the kid, we've got no problem with any of that stuff. Just fire Singer and hire Dick Donner or Doug Liman or Alfonso Curan or PEYTON REED! Get Jude Law to play General Zod back for revenge(who spends the 1st third of the movie still depowered but just as dangerous), Helena Bonham Carter for Ursa and some wrestler for Non. Get a shit-hot unknown that looks like Helen Slater for Supergirl and make a kick ass sequel(and partial Superman II retread without the finger crap) full of crazy Kryptonian street fights done with todays effects. You can call it "SUPERMAN ROCKS!" ...No I don't seriously think they'll do it but what the hell.
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...When My Super Ex Girlfriend comes out and has a more entertaining plot, better action sequences and flying effects. If Uma does more cool shit then Routh did in this movie then it's over. Shit if Uma punches something, ANYTHING in that piece of shit movie she'll be tougher than Singer's "emo Superman". That's just pathetic.
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First off, I'll give the flick a B average. Singer should have shown Supes going to Krypton and discovering its a graveyard at the beginning of film or during the opening credits- he's going to show it on the DVD. Didn't like the fact the kid is his, they painted themselves into a corner with this plot device. Anyway, liked Brandon Routh, he didn't dissappoint.
Okay, I'm no movie guy but I also read WB will greenlight the sequel if Superman Returns makes 200 million domestically, does that mean the film has until Labor Day weekend-the official end of summer-to make 200 million? Anyone, anyone? -
I was just thinking about a couple things...like why there hasn't been a mention of a sequel yet,(aside from the "box office" reason) and other things like where the sequel might go.
First of all, I loved this movie.
Sure there might have been a few nit-picky things, but I just loved the hell out of this.
Second, I am thinkning that with the San Diego comic con coming this week, and Singer showing up for a panel to be possibly questioned and or attacked by Z/fisk...or the like, I think it might be the perfect setting to announce the news of a Sequel.
As far as what I think, I think the the crystal Island that was lifted into space is going to turn into NEW KRYPTON, and because it is laced with Krytponite, it will serve as a further reminder that he is alone, he can't even go to it. but the three goons that were left there will provide plenty of DNA to help create the three new villains that spring up from the brainiac program that grows on the new planetoid. maybe this will develop over the course of the sequel or maybe BE the sequel, but It is one road that it might go. Think about it, The superman movies have always made it like he was the ONLY one, the only hero, the only alien, except for Zod and crew, and we just can't count Solar man, but I feel like when they want to have him face a villain, they would probably invent a new one rather than use the ones from the comics.
Wouldn't it have been cool if one of the Jet fighters escorting the 777 was named Jordan? Just thinking about how simple that could have been.
I look forward to the next one, especially with Singers track record, he set things up in this one, as far as returning Superman, giving him conflict and now the next one can go straight for the jugular...I can't wait. Here's hoping...and for all you negative bastiches that are clamoring for the death of the superman movies...I'll see you in line for the sequel, make sure to wear your tattered superman shirts! :) -
would have made a fantastic film. It wasn't about his life, it wasn't about where he came from. It was just a pure Superman film. He was established and it was just a real good read. And it was clever too. Superman was really cool. His dialogue. His rescues. His attitude. It was good fun. Also, when clark first interacts with Loise, he revelas himself as Superman. And it worked. Ok, I've blown kevin Smith to much in this post. But overall, I understand why they went along with Singer's 'safe' premise. But Kevin Smith had a great idea for superman and one day I'd love to see that script reworked. but it'll never happen.
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Yeah I remember reading it and thinking it was pretty cool. I liked the whole reveal himself to her angle. Could have been cool.Who knows, maybe Smith will direct the Wolrds finest movie down the line...
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What a joke. Talk about fanboy abuse.
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the Sun going out due to Brainiac or something, but I remember liking it as a new version of Superman..like a cool action movie...but I can't remember the details... What I think would be cool, which would NEVER HAPPEN, would be if after the two sequels of BAtman Begins and hopefully Superman Returns, before the third for each film, we could get a Worlds Finest film ,Directed by Singer and Nolan together, each tackling each others character...y'know, Singer directing the Batman Scenes and Nolan Directing the Superman ones...I think that both characters have established their own seperate worlds, but I think that they CAN blend together in the films. I think when Singer says that Batman would be the enemy , it would be more that Superman couldn't envision the darkness it would take to make a man be as violent and dangerous as Batman is. Superman never kicks the assess of the people he stops, 'cause he doesn't need to , but Bats needs to, so therein lies the conflict, their goals are the same but their tactics are vastly different. So at first it would make sense if they were at odds. How cool would that be, if Raimi is able to do all this amazing stuff with Spidey, why can't we get the awesomeness of a worlds finest by the directors who ushered them back to health in the first place. It could be like the old image comics when they first started out and each artist lent a hand on the others comic...ah well , never in a million years...
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I don't mind the Batman/Superman cross over idea, but why suggest Singer direct the Batman scenes? He's fucked up Superman already, at least keep him away from Batman.....or anyone else
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Because they are all gay and unless they announced that SR was making loads of cash around the world, Singer said he wouldn't suck them off anymore.
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I saw something similar on ITV last night. I couldn't work it out until I saw in the credits that the footage they were using of the Premier, clips from the film (obviously), interviews with actors etc was all directly given/ sold to them by Warner. I think the British media is atempting to generate a buzz on WB's orders or they are not getting any of the footage. I was going to go and see it tonight on student tuesday (I am not a student- but they slash the prices in the Camden Odeon on tuesdays, and I am not paying the fucking extortionate
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Except that Singer's kind of "having his cake and eating it too." The Donnor movies are "vaguely connected," and that's been said repeatedly. They're not a DIRECT sequel, so you can't take everything in them verbatim. There're very few explicit references to the first film aside from the Marlon Brando quotes. Remember when Kitty says, "You act like you've been here before" (or whatever)? Luthor just stares ... now, come on, how hard would it have been to say, "Duh, yeah, I talk about it all the time!" I took that throw-away line to mean, "Yeah, but we're not going to talk about those films so explicitly ... just accept them as vague history." Besides, if you took it SOOOO directly as a sequel, how the hell could you explain the amazing leaps in technology and fashion style between Superman II and SR? Daily Planet sure as hell looks a lot different! (Granted, Batman Returns clearly IS a direct sequel to Batman, and the architecture of Gotham sure did change a lot between films - to say NOTHING of the Schumacher Gotham ... but that's another story.) My point is and has been that Superman - like all comic characters - is a flexible entity and subject to numerous interpretations. I'm not going to insist, "Oh, wait now ... the Superman I know can only fly 99% the speed of light and he'd never do anything selfish!" Hell, if you wanted to be a purest, you'd say, "Oh, wait now ... the Superman I know can only leap really far (like the Hulk). He doesn't ACTUALLY fly!" Singer offered up a Superman that actually has some character growth to do, and if there's a sequel (Please, God!), I have little doubt there will be some serious reckoning to be had between Lois, Supes, and Richard. Think about that - there's some 'splaining to do ... if only for Lois to tell Richard why she's lying to him about the birth of their child. Awkward fucking conversation - unless Richard already knows! Okay, a little soap-opera, maybe, but I like to have a little human drama in between the punch-punch-kick-kick. No, it's not the Supes of the Donnor film, not exactly. I have the Donnor films if I want to see that Supes again. This is a different take on Supes, and I'd rather judge it on that basis ... not the unavoidably crushing standard of 70 years of mythos. Great effects, I say ... acting could've been better ... writing needed some polish ... waiting for the DVD to see what got cut (Singer has an unfortunate habit of cutting crucial scenes - just see what got cut out of X1, it's fucking criminal!) ... faithful that a sequel could pop our eyes out of their fucking sockets if WB doesn't go all FOX on us ...
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Don't worry, I'm not going to say anything condescending like call you "irrational haters" or whatever. I can totally see not liking this film. (Now, if you don't like X2 - by contrast - that's a different story!) But I wonder if there's a sense of, "Oh, damn it, I wanted so long for a Superman film to call my own, and now it's all fucked up!" I can see that, if it's going through any of your heads. There's a lot I didn't like about this film, but not enough to stick in my craw (is that the expression? whatever). And then it hit me - THERE CAN AND WILL BE NEW SUPERMAN STORIES IN THE FUTURE. Hell, Smallville is on right now, and do you honestly think there won't be "reboots" and new visions or retro-visions or whatever else 10, 20, 30 years from now? Just a throw-away thought ... this isn't like Star Wars. We'll NEVER get a good Star Wars prequel trilogy. Nor will we EVER get a satisfactory Matrix sequel. (Did I just piss off everyone here?) But hey, at least you can know for certain that, if Singer wasn't your cup of tea, all you have to do is wait him out.
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Fair one! Film is such a subjective thing anyway - as is all art - as I'm sure you well know. My main point (heavily veiled, admittedly) is that I am sick and tired of people on here going on about a film's box office take as if it was some measure of quality, and they had a financial stake in it. It's almost like certain people can't bring themselves to like a film unless it makes huge amounts of cash. By this rationale, Blade Runner is a shit film; however we all know that the vast majority of people/critics hold it in very high regard. But then we're back to my point about subjectivity again! Picture a snake eating its' own tail...
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I don't recall the sun going out, but It did feature the death of superman angle. And batman had a brief appearance, silhouetted from the batcave to give his condolences to metropolis at supermans funeral. The best part about it were the little touches. the human touches that made it feel more real. Like when the scout team is on it's way to the fortress of solitude and they say :We've always known about this place, we just respect superman enough to give him his privacy. It wasn't a terrible script. It came very close to being produced. It only takes a couple big execs to get a little worried before these things fall apart.
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we will be stuck in the perpetual loop. I think the BO thing reflects a lot of people's genuine fear that they won't get a sequel as it is underperforming. So they look at why. Which leads them to the conclusion that the film must be shit (which is pretty much every report I have had from a British person, even the press gave it 3 stars out of 5- which translates as 1 star as they usually stuff 2 stars on a summer blockbuster to make sure they are not banned from the next important screening). This then leads to the venom and backlash towards the box office numbers, etc.
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we will be stuck in the perpetual loop. I think the BO thing reflects a lot of people's genuine fear that they won't get a sequel as it is underperforming. So they look at why. Which leads them to the conclusion that the film must be shit (which is pretty much every report I have had from a British person, even the press gave it 3 stars out of 5- which translates as 1 star as they usually stuff 2 stars on a summer blockbuster to make sure they are not banned from the next important screening). This then leads to the venom and backlash towards the box office numbers, etc.
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we will be stuck in the perpetual loop. I think the BO thing reflects a lot of people's genuine fear that they won't get a sequel as it is underperforming. So they look at why. Which leads them to the conclusion that the film must be shit (which is pretty much every report I have had from a British person, even the press gave it 3 stars out of 5- which translates as 1 star as they usually stuff 2 stars on a summer blockbuster to make sure they are not banned from the next important screening). This then leads to the venom and backlash towards the box office numbers, etc.
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sorry my computer went haywire. I will go and sit in the stupid corner. Shit, my bad
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How ironic we were talking about perpetual loops!
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Marketing. What WB should have done was done a full blown DVD (maybe even theatrical) re-release of Superman The Movie & Superman II. About 75% of Superman Returns cross refrences specific, finite details and plot points from Supes 1 & 2. I went back and watched Supes 1 over the weekend followed by SR (in IMAX 3D). Hate on Singer if you want, but the man did his homework. SR is practically a love letter to the first two flicks. Seeing Supes 1 again totally made me appreciate seeing SR for the 3rd time. A sequel is coming, yall. Hopefully this time with a hard ass Lex Luthor (no Kitty Kovalsky this time - was that a poor woman's Miss Teshmacher or what!!!), a nemesis with power equal to Supes, and, most importantly, an actress that actually has CHEMISTRY with Brandon Routh (Bosworth must go!)
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not Gay.
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In fact, it would've been super-sweet if they'd done a RE-RELEASE of those first two films in select theaters ... in fact, just to wet dream here, imagine a DONNOR-CUT OF SUPERMAN II ... on fucking Imax ... back-to-back with the original. Okay, now I've gone crazy because studios just don't do that kind of thing anymore. But they should have marketed the fuck out of the first two films in the months leading up to SR. That said, I thought the actresses weren't terrible. Bosworth may have been a weak link, but I'm willing to give her another go at it ... if only to avoid the inevitable disruption of re-casting the part. As for Kitty, first off, I generally LOVE Parker in anything she does. Her charm just naturally spills over into everything she does. Second, "a poor woman's Miss Teshmacher"? How is that possible? It's like saying "a poor man's Otis." The only reason those ridiculous characters work is because they all co-exist in the same scene with goofball Gene "who gives a fuck, I'm here to make money" Hackman. They're like a tripod of absurdity that keep one another standing. Kitty is, for better or for worse, just a bit of eye candy on the side with her anachronistic wardrobe and snide asides ... but it worked on me! Her delivery was great, and her comments were actually funny ... to me at least.
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This new Superman was just a bit too much of a basis on the past. Spacey really couldn't make the role his own, because he was bounded by Hackman's portrayal. Routh too, although there's not a whole variety of ways to portray the character. Bosworth took Lois a bit differently i thought, but not bad. But given how Warner Brothers relatively flopped with this movie compared to Pirates of the Caribbean- Dead Man's Chest, who knows if there'll be a sequel.
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1. Kity is Otis AND Miss Teshmacher rolled into one character! I wish I had a remote control with me in the theatre. I would fast forward past all the Lex Luthor scenes solely because of her! The first scene after the opening credits of SR 2 (or whatever they'll call it) should be Lex flying off in a plane leaving her to die on that deserted island. She sucked. Period. 2. I may be an "SR Apologist", but I'm not give Bosworth a pass. Anyone who knows their Supes 1 & 2 knows that Reeve and Kidder were friggin electric together on screen. Bosworth may have some acting chops deep down inside, but let's keep it real. Her performance was to SR what Natalie Portman's performance was to the prequels. Nuff said.
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1. Empire Magasine gave the movie five stars and said that Superman didnt just fly he soared.
2. Someone somewhere is possibly regretting not making the movie with the Smallvile cast. why they didnt do that is beyond me, maybe it was a back to the future/bond thing, ie. Wb tv(CW) did not want there cast to go if the movie bombed. Millar and gough must be laughing there asses off that they didnt get to make at least one superman movie. I agree that Bosworth must go. yes tom Welling is wooden, but casting him and the rest of the smallville would have made sense. but someone, somewhere obvisously nixed that idea. AS T would say"i pity the fools". Superman will return in 2009. Hopefully with a better script, the next time. -
so Hulk is setting a precedent with talk of a re-launch after only three years since the last movie. Can the WB beat that record?
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It's a heck of a day when a film that will most likely finish at over $180 Million domestic/$400 Million worldwide is labeled "flop", "failure", and "there won't be a sequel". I get it, the stakes were high on SR which makes the results a disappointment. But I think WB will simply cut it's losses and get back to the drawing board for a new Supes flick in 2009 (or so) - a flick that's leaner (in budget), meaner (in villans), and badder (in action).
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Considering how much stronger the Batman franchise is with its popularity with comic fans and Joe Public, I think the smartest thing to do would be to reboot the Superman films and have Clark donning the suit in Metropolis for the first time and that brings Bruce Wayne/Batman to the City to investigate. And immediately, Bruce and Clark figure out who the other is. By this time, Batman is established, so he serves as a semi-mentor (or at least for Clark "how not to uphold justice") and it cements their troubled friendship/alliance. Not only would it serve to compare/contrast Superman to Batman, but it would also contrast the difference between Bruce Wayne and his Wayne Enterprises against Lex Luthor and LexCorp/Luthor Corp. It would also serve to lay the foundation for a future *Batman vs. Superman* film, although I hope they'd do a different plotline than the death of Bruce Wayne's fiance which is a total cliche.
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I put this before in the POTC talkback, but it is still relevant here. Never trust an Empire Review. They gave AOTC 5 stars based on the fact that they gave TPM 4. I have been burnt far too many times by horribly sycophantic Empire reviews to ever trust them again, when they can cease with the shameless blockbuster cocksucking and actually review a major release on its merits then they can be trusted again . I would rather trust Harry- who I usually disagree with, as at least he is open about being a fan of whatever he is plugging.
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Check out this animated review of 'Superman Returns' on You Tube... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8Z0qmS0NWs
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I'm kidding, you don't suck (period or no). I just hate that Talkback habit of making. everything. a. definitive. statement. like you're writing a fucking scientific treatise or something. You have an opinion, and that's it. She's FUN! What's wrong with that? Can't please everyone, I guess ... You're right about the electricity between Reeves and Kidder - funny thing is that the DVD doc's seem to make it look like they were indiffernt to each other at BEST while filming. That's acting for you, I guess ... Seriously, though, I'm REALLY looking forward to the SR DVD for the cut scenes. Just look at X1 (I've harped on this before) - the shit they cut out of that would've made that film immensely better, all for the sake of shaving a few minutes. Singer gets antsy with the big budget and studio expectations. If SR2 has way lowered expectations, FANTASTIC! It'll give Singer the room he needs to breath and go at it full engine. On a side note, I seriously wonder if a lot of the people here on the board talking about "reboot" are thinking in their heads, "Gee, maybe then WB will read my mind and produce the Superman film based on my own (unwritten) fanboy script ... the one where Mogul, Lobo, and Mxylpsxtsysx (whatever) all team up and a GIIIIIIIIANT ROBOT crushes Metropolis ... oh, and the Justice League forms to stop Darkseid with the help of Luth-oh, wait, that was an epsidoe of Justice League Unlimited. WHY DID THEY CANCEL MY FAVORITE CARTOON, WHY?!?!?" Believe me, if they filmed the script in MY head, oh boy, it'd made $300 GAZILLION dollars!!!
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when Josie and the Pussycats got 4 stars, and also like Lost Prophet, I think they rated the SW PT too highly... there is definately an agenda...
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Gutted and disappointed by SR. But I am not going to dwell on it.
I am just here to forecast stormy times for Superman fans.
This was the start of a franchise. It introduced all the characters. Including Superman Jnr. This kid cannot be un-introduced. He will be in the next ones. The studios will want to have naff action scenes: perhaps him flying in school, perhaps defending school nerds, maybe getting a dog called Krypto. I think I can hear execs pitching it now! "It could be like Smallville but in pre-school!" (I think you call it Pre-School in the US).
I WARN YOU. IT WILL NOT BE GOOD.
Remember Anakin in ep 1? I foresee it being like that but ten times worse. Many people post on this site about the 2nd or 3rd instalment ruining a franchise. With SR I believe we have glimpsed the beginning of the end. I guarantee every talkbalker is going to complain about the kid destroying the next ones. Those of you who did enjoy this one will not even to be able to revisit SR after its inevitable awful sequels because you will see the moment it all went wrong. -
Fanboys posting on sites like AICN got Fox to cast Patrick Stewart as Professor X, as well as getting Christian Bale attached to the Batman franchise and Ra's Al Ghul made as the villain of that film. Negative feedback from fanboys online (courtesy of this site) sank *Batman & Robin* and got Schumacher removed from the franchise. It also forced WB Pictures to dump the JJ Abrams script for Superman. So with all of that having been said, your statement regarding the alleged futility of fanboys requesting a reboot on here is thoroughly negated. Hollywood does read the boards for free feedback. Now go back to your fortress of solitude and mediocrity, Mr. Singer.
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Huh, that's interesting ... really ... it's not that "Batman & Robin" sucked royally. It's that the fanboys drove away the movie-going public. See, what you're arguing isn't even that Studio Execs read this site. You're claiming that ALL OF AMERICA reads this site, since otherwise the movie could (theoretically) have done GANGBUSTERS instead of making only $107m when it cost $125m to make. http://tinyurl.com/m86bm And hey, since the site was only ONE YEAR OLD at the time, I think it's safe to assume that most moviegoers (let alone fanboys) weren't checking this site. So, us fanboys must've gone door-to-door on a massive smear campaign to sink that film. Whispering to people on the subway. Hiring blimps and buying airtime. "You know, I was goiong to see that bloated, strobe-light headache of a film starring Ah-nuld and George Clooney's codpiece, but a bunch of comic book lovers say it's no good." Look, I'm obviously being an ass, but your argument is kind of nuts. Feedback is one thing. Wielding influence is another. I'd love some evidence that we put Captain Picard in the wheelchair (what, they couldn't CGI Tellya Savalas?), but somehow I'm guessing the fact that he had established genre recognition, acting chops, and a bald fucking head had something more to do with it. Let's put it to the test, shall we? I'll be willing to put in my headline for every post I run for the next year, "JOHNNY DEPP SUCKS!!!" You do it too, and in theory, if a few more people join in, we can sink his career. Why not? We're the geeks that MADE his career, and we can end it, too! Heck, doesn't really matter what POTC does as the box office. And it certainly doesn't matter what Johnny's agent does or what the directors/producers have to say. THE TALKBACKERS HAVE SPOKEN! I'm oh-so thoroughly negated. Just call me Nega-Lawful from now on, because you've bested me in battle.
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Lord knows why, since I'm probably the last guy posting here - I think these forums arguably have GROWING influence, but it'll be seen most directly amongst those already predisposed to listen (yo, Kevin Smith, what up?) or in the case of Snakes on a Plane, VERY genre-specific "potentially cult" films with nothing to lose. With all our mighty powers, I don't think we could have gotten an unknown cast as Professor X, no matter how dead-on Mr. Unknown Actor would've been. I guess if you started up a massive, viral campaign (a la "JOHNNY DEPP SUCKS!"), then you could make something happen by the sheer bulk of it all regarding decisons that don't threaten the Hollywood Status Quo. (Yeah, yeah, Juggernaut said "Bitch." Funny stuff, really. I'm sure Ratner had to fight tooth and nail to get that in there - way to go, YouTube, you won!) Very people-power, democratic vision you have, which is great and all ... But look, treating AICN Talkback's "influence" like we're already fucking there is off, and imagining that Talkbackers have superior influence over the great unwashed who've never HEARD of AICN but pack theaters each weekend to see whatever film was most heavily promoted that week is delusional. It wouldn't have mattered if I wallpapered my apartment with ED WOOD posters and set up a shrine to Depp ... he becomes the household name we all know and love once POTC surprised people with (wait for it) BOX OFFICE MAGIC!!! Fifteen mid-performing Tim Burton films wouldn't have catipulted Depp to the "A-List" no matter how many "JOHNNY DEPP RULES!" posts were dropped on the web. Nor will a million "JOHNNY DEPP SUCKS!" posts keep him out of whatever the hell film the guy feels like picking up after POTC 3 busts another round of box office records. There's a million factors involved here ... the AICN crowd is at best a feather in the studio's hat (if they tickler our belly) and at worst a one-joke episode of ENTOURAGE.
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The reason SR hasnt done as well as thought is NOT not the unpopularity of the character it's just that the film doesnt deliever the action. 200+ million and you cant make an action film. I love the movie but it needs to be exciting.
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I thought Routh was excellent in this film.He showed more depth in his Superman than Reeve ever did (I still love the Reeve version, I consider them on a par with each other)and his Clark,although underwritten, was pretty sweet as well.I loved the film and cannot wait to see what happens next
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They've been trying to get a Superman film made for about 15 years. This is the problem. They've been looking for a concept, not a story. Storytelling is the basis of filmmaking and this is the area where the summer movies of the past 7/8 years have failed miserably. The story of SR is appalling. Riddled with credulity problems and logic deficiencies. They let Lex Luthor out of prison? SA guy that nearly destroyed America? Right. Sure they did. I didn't believe a word of it. The structure is fatally flawed. Scenes go nowhere but just sit there dead on-screen. There is no third act action scene. This si the problem when you hire young screenwriters, They have kn life experience. Mario Puzo's script for Superman had thematic depth and a life to it. There is nothing in SR. I was bored senseless. If I was a major Superman fan i'd be apoplectic just now. It simply shows the apathy of the modern moviegoer that people declare this movie to be awesome. Superman Returns stinks. And I haven't even mentione Kate Bosworth and James Marsden yet. Or the superkid. Or the crap henchmen with no dialogue. Or Parker Posey. Or the 15 mins lying in bed Superman dying/oh now he's ok ending. Horrible horrible bullshit. Go back to filmschool Singer. Whatever happened to the guy that made Usual Suspects? Sell out.
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(insert cuckoo clock sound effect...)
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It makes me sad that a terrific flick like Superman Returns, which was made with love, care and attention (well done to all involved) may not even get a sequel greenlit because it has been stomped into the ground (financially) by a lumbering, nonsensical, empty, souless, sad excuse for a movie (yep, Pirates) that was BASED ON A FUCKING THEME PARK RIDE???????!!!!!!! And what the fuck is wrong with you people in here (the majority anyway) who hate this movie? Have we all become so jaded in this day and age that a beautifully crafted movie like Superman Returns fails to impress us anymore? What do you want? Two hours of explosions and no character development? Ah fuck it, I was going to say more but I couldn't be arsed. Thanks for the great movie, Bryan. Hope you get to make another one.
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Superman Returns is lazy hack work. And for a $220 million movie where did all the money go???
The original Superman was a beautifully crafted movie. It had a good script though. Unlike this new one. -
What white screen, only new posts I can see in their entirety?
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