Dec. 24, 2005, 3:17 a.m. CST
Dec. 24, 2005, 3:28 a.m. CST
Dec. 24, 2005, 3:34 a.m. CST
by Gheorghe Zamfir
those look pretty good. I was a bit hesistant about a film like this being done on a soundstage, but I may be turned around on it, at the least, if it looks this good now, I can't wait to see what this will look like in its finished form.
Dec. 24, 2005, 3:49 a.m. CST
But not the graphic novel. Does it completely ignore the other greek soldiers that were there?
Dec. 24, 2005, 3:53 a.m. CST
If the finished product looks like those rough composites, or better, then it's already a right side better than I'd have pictured it looking. Which admittedly isn't saying much, since I pictured it looking like crap. But those pikchers, those look pretty nice. I like Zack Snyder and I like "300," so I'm more than willing to cut this film a little slack. They're doing some interesting things with the official website, so anybody who's interested might want to keep their eyes glued to that place as well...
Dec. 24, 2005, 4:08 a.m. CST
check Alatriste teaser http://www.fox.es/trailers/alatriste-11015/132/
Dec. 24, 2005, 4:12 a.m. CST
He really seems passionate in the video diary. Do all movie sites have movie diaries nowadays? I can't wait until people like Uwe Boll start with them. "300" looks good, but I hope it'll be spectacular.
Dec. 24, 2005, 4:13 a.m. CST
looks interesting though.
Dec. 24, 2005, 6:42 a.m. CST
fetch my slave boy!
Dec. 24, 2005, 7:03 a.m. CST
I hated Dawn of the Dead, the first time I saw it. But it grew on me after watching the unrated version a couple of times. Zack has definitely got my interest in his take on 300. Can't wait to see this.
Dec. 24, 2005, 7:53 a.m. CST
Sometimes I have to read through twice just to make some sort of sense of it all.
Dec. 24, 2005, 8:55 a.m. CST
I'm a Frank Miller fanatic and that was awesome! That was pretty much a perfect rendition. That gave me chills. Well done Zack Snyder.
Dec. 24, 2005, 9:01 a.m. CST
Jayyy zusssss co-rist. I am damn fucking sick of the 'Gladiator/Blackhawk down and every movie remotly located near Persia/Arabia' having a fucking lamenting moaning wailing tom tom rhythemed sound track. Hollywood are the most inbred shit eaters (litterally if you think of what re using an idea actually is). Just create your own sound track. I'm sure music of the era/area has something other than the wail fest.
Dec. 24, 2005, 9:03 a.m. CST
by Southpaw Samurai
PurityofEssence: It's been awhile since I've read the comic, but I believe it's written with full emphasis on the Spartans, so the other Greeks who died at Themopylae are only really mentioned to point out how more important it is that there's Spartans in this battle. Fairly typical of almost all retellings of this story and it's a shame to the poor Theban and Thespian corpses that people only speak of the Spartans. True, the Spartans were the shock troops and man-to-man probably the best individual warriors at that spot, but it's like people believing that America won WW2 by itself. ------- What's funny is how Themopylae has been glorified as this great battle that 'saved democracy'. Firstly, Themopylae had a neglible effect on the outcome of the war against Persia. It bought a few extra days and caused some nice extensive casualties on Xerxes' forces as they tried to take an easily defensible piece of land. The only significant benefit to the Greeks was that it became an inspiring rally point for their war. Themopylae was one of those rare chances to mix martyrdom with legendary heroics. And as for the 'democracy' it saved...yes, the Greeks had democracy and, but most of the cities had governments of the people for ONLY those people it cared about....usually the wealthy upper-crust....perhaps all too consistent with how democracy is practiced today as well, but certainly not the glorified aspirations people picture when they think of the term.
Dec. 24, 2005, 9:12 a.m. CST
Who would win?
Dec. 24, 2005, 9:12 a.m. CST
Ok i accept that they want the 'Filmed stageplay look' I can dig that. . . . . . Two things that will suck about it though will be A: the 'recreate the comic visually' thing didn't work with Sin City no matter what Geeks like Harry who are corrupt when it comes to their fave medium and refuse to put it down so always manage to find 'something' redeeming in it . say. Sin City was just flat and lifeless. . . . . . B: From what i see in the production diary video and the way the guy talks it's clear that he doesn't know or care about what the Spartans really stood for or were like. It's just gonna be a Western modern movie with modern western sensibilitys. Don't even think about portraying the Spartans as defenders of freedom etc. They defended 'their own' freedom, just so happens that it was good for others too. The Spartans had vast armies of slaves and even tried to conquer all Greece and no doubt would have enslaved everyone there too. The helmets and cloaks look like something from an 18th centruy German opera. The bare chested looks is just gay. Mainly though the fighting formations will be retarded. It will be individuals dancing around cutting a swath through the hords. There will be no celebration of the true phalanx and it's fighting system. . . . All in all it will be an interesting movie for sure. I'm just not sure i can bare another end shot of a character wading at sunset through a wheat field putting he hand out to touch the tips of the stalks of wheat as she drifts by and laments her dead hero husband accompanied by the wailing sound track. Gladiator and others have done it and it's starting to get annoying.
Dec. 24, 2005, 9:40 a.m. CST
by Bass Ackwards
Miller tells a really great, exciting story, but its not necessarily a historical one. He did the series as a dramatization, not a graphic recreation. The story that got him excited was the heroism and the incredible odds, and that's what he's focusing on. Miller does tell his story with a certain respect for history, but he didn't by any means feel limited to it (though its not a lack of knowledge on his part, but a creative choice), so take it for what you will.
Dec. 24, 2005, 10:01 a.m. CST
we're going to look back at this comic book = green screen mentality with disgust... Can't you see how ugly this trend's going to get?
Dec. 24, 2005, 10:06 a.m. CST
Dec. 24, 2005, 10:15 a.m. CST
always knew he was a bender.
Dec. 24, 2005, 10:30 a.m. CST
..just because they read a book about something, then try to tell everyone else how things REALLy were, as if they were the only one who knows better. i guess you guys were there at the battle, spent time in ancient Greece, which is why you can be so sure of what happened, why, and the ramificatons. all those historians and professors are just bumbling fools, if only they had your insight into the REAL story of the Spartans, right? get the fuck over yourselves with the whole "i am familiar with the real story of the Battle of Thermopylae", as if thats some kind of privilaged information. oohh aahhh, we're all so impressed, you know who Xerxes was, ooohhh aaahhhh. so the fuck what, you know some Greek history, you and a few hundred million other people walking around. what does that have to do with a movie being made based on a graphic novel, which makes no bones about being a FICTIONALIZED version of a historical event? there is a saying, "a little bit of knowledge is dangerous", which can be very true, but i think there is another another take on that being, "a little knowledge is fucking irritating as shit" which holds true for our little amature historians here.
Dec. 24, 2005, 10:32 a.m. CST
by Sam Bones
Looks gay. Like body-builders who worked out in gyms all their lives and never stubbed their toes on a rock. And what is funny is the anti-gay theme to the comic book. Anyone that studied the history of the Spartans knows they actually ENCOURAGED homosexuality because it gave their soldiers and fighting units more reason to die for each other. This whole production based upon such an adolescent version of the real story seems very bizarre.
Dec. 24, 2005, 12:15 p.m. CST
... personally, yes that does get a bit annoying when its placed in all kinds of movies, but here, it is where it belongs... i am greek, and even today you hear music to that effect in our religion and our culture... so when a movie is made about ancient sparta, and you hear the woman singing, not "wailing", it becomes more realistic, and it excentuates the spirituality of the people of that time, and the other reason they were fighting the persians - their devotion to the gods.... ive been following this movie since the summer when i heard gerry was gonna star in it... yes, i am a gerry fan, and i know he got major bashing in the past, but seriously, in everything he's done, whether its been a failure or success, he is the one good thing about it, and hes going rock in this movie... its about time the world will get to see what an amazing actor he is.. and harry got it right when he said he acts with his eyes, cause he really does; watch his movies and you will see how powerful they are... and i think robert rodriquez got it perfect with sin city, and the green/blue screen really gave it the graphic novel feel to the film... like others have said, this isnt a historical piece, its a graphic novel adaptation, so thats what its going to try to portray, not so much a textbook accuracy of the event.... this movie is going to be SICK!!!
Dec. 24, 2005, 12:35 p.m. CST
"The helmets and cloaks look like something from an 18th century German Opera." Bingo. I like that! Miller's comic book always seemed kind of operatic to me with its stylized drawings in ink against a lush painted background by Lynne Varley. I think Snyder is on the right track. I like that he kept the Miller helmets instead of going for the authentic bronze ones they probably used. As for the bare-chested look being gay. Well, they wore very little clothing back then. I like the look the Spartans have. They almost look like they stepped out of a Frazetta painting with those physiques. How long do I have to wait for this movie to hit theaters?
Dec. 24, 2005, 1:17 p.m. CST
by Southpaw Samurai
Pevin, you seem to be quite sensitive about anyone divulging any information. I will not attempt to ponder why, as such would only flame whatever is irking you this fine day, but I will say that I see no self-defined 'experts' here as of yet. People have been merely making comments on how this tale fares against historical facts and how certain aspects are disappointing. Anytime you do an historical piece, such debates will arise. People here are just backing their arguments with facts. If facts annoy you, skip such posts. A number of people have an issue with portraying this as a 'Europoean democracy vs. Middle East/Asian despotism', which the website does promote (and, strangely enough, I don't remember it being played up so much in the original graphic novel..but it's been awhile). To me, that's a valid point about the movie and would be even if the movie was an outright fantasy. The portrayal of Thermopylae as an analogy of current West vs. East was annoying in the Cold War era '300 Spartans' and it's worse now. -------- As to the 300 Spartans vs. 300 Samurai question, as much as these types of debates are usually pointless in the sheer amount of variables on much consider, I'd probably go Spartans, if we're talking about giving each side similar technology and quality of weaponry. Samurai were a social class, not an occupation, and if you picked 300 random people of that class, you'd just as likely come across great poets with no fighting skills and out of shape fops as able warriors. If one is to believe contemporary Greek accounts of Sparta in its prime, nearly every citizen was in great physical condition and a prerequisite of any male to be a citizen of Sparta (and survive adolescence) was to be able to fight (Spartan society was built on a foundation of slaves, so the citizens DID have time to work out and hone their skills each day). Certainly it wasn't a utopia of chiseled men and women, but if you're grabbing a random selection of people to engage in a fictious battle, you can't go very wrong with Sparta in its prime.
Dec. 24, 2005, 1:19 p.m. CST
People know a bit of history whats the big deal dick. They might not have access to a time machine to fact check everything but they know enough to recognise an infusion of cream panted fanboy sensibilities. The Miller treatment although fun as a comic will be as silly as a film as the crappy 50's version was. . . . . Fact is that it is one of the most amazing millitary stories in world history and to think that Hollywood had the cash and the chance to tell it and they choose to tell the dooded up comic version rather than the just as interesting historical version makes you wonder what kind of airheads are in charge here. Let's face it, Gladiator, Troy, Alexander, Kingdom of Heaven etc don't exactly show a good track record of Classical era films. So excuuuuuuuse the fuck us if we have thoughts on the matter. . . . . Annamaria, I appreciate that you are greek but as with Italians and just about everyone else who now occupy countries that had some history 2500 years ago. There is very little of the same genetic pool still there and the culture, language and music would be even less recognizable so the wailing might match todays Greece but i doubt it did the Spartans. . . . . As to who would win between 300 Spartans or Samurai. Well the Sams came along about a thousand years after the Spartans and didn't mature skillfully till two thousand years after ( about 1500 ad) but they have amazing parallels in attitude and approach to the role of combat in daily life. That would be a matchup for sure. Don't know who would win but i never heard of Three hundred Japs holding off half a million Chinese.
Dec. 24, 2005, 2:02 p.m. CST
totally understand what youre saying, i hope it didnt sound like i was trying to pick a fight or anything... but on a side note, my mother's father can trace his entire family to ancient athens, so obviously having that connection cant tell us what went on back then, but i just thought i was interesting to point out that theres still that link to the past... for spartans vs. samurai, well i am a little biased, but id go with the spartans, cause they were vicious people, and while it seems that the samurai had excellent swordfighting skills, they cant beat the innate rage and bloodlust and just manly grrrrrr power that the spartans had imo... i prefer the cavemen vs. astronauts discussion... (cavemen would kick ass)
Dec. 24, 2005, 2:41 p.m. CST
looks really cool so far, as still pictures. his is Snyder's second film right? Still not sure if he can get the right performance out of the actors. I was afraid that since Snyder was using the exact same process that Rodriguiz was using for SIn City, that this would just be a shitty ME TOO flick, but so far looks good. This where snyder gets his cahnce to really prove himself. i hope he does, i liked his version of DAWN. But Im with Filmrage on this one, CUT THE FUCKIN MOANING SOUNDTRACKS. Why was that shit in KING NONG anyway? Annamaria doesn't it depend on what kind of astronauts you're competing against the cavemen? The astronauts of the sixties were hardcore badass "stick a flag pole up yer ass and salute" muther fuckers. Astronauts of today just... float around. So yeah theyd be skewered and slow roasted.
Dec. 24, 2005, 4:36 p.m. CST
Submit, bitches! Alan Shephard, bah!
Dec. 24, 2005, 5:58 p.m. CST
Miller's version of this story is almost directly from Herodotus, so even if it's ludicrous in terms of history (and it is) it's still a great story that's been around for centuries--not something that a bunch of Hollywood hacks slapped together on tuesday. The comic is pure mythology and doesn't really claim to be anything else; unlike most Hollywood historical epics, this is going to be stylized and over-the-top--none of this "sense of reality" stuff--so I don't think anyone's going to be fooled into thinking that it's real history. This is Miller's best comic, by the way, and adapting it faithfully makes MUCH more sense than doing the same to Sin City; 300 is practically a movie in comic book form.
Dec. 24, 2005, 6:17 p.m. CST
I hope this movie kicks all manner of ass - I really do. I'm lucky enough to be an ancient historian (bona fide, you haters out there) and although I have the common apprehensions of all fanboys, in whatever genre, when Hollywood picks up their particular passion (comics, history, novels, whatever), I'm also excited to see both of my particular passions - Ancient Greece and Movies - coming together. It's been ages since a good one came along - Troy and Alexander were just GASH. How could such great stories get so badly mauled? I know 300 does not claim to be a 'historical' account, so I'm not going to complain about the details, whether the Thespaians are there or not...I just want to see the battle up there on screen. And anything that brings these great tales to a modern audience, and gets more kids into my classroom, is A Good Thing in my book. Out of interest, does anyone know what the hell happened to the adaptation of Steven Pressfield's Gates of Fire? I heard Michael Mann and Clooney were linked, but then it fell off the face of the earth.
Dec. 25, 2005, 3:18 a.m. CST
I think Peven has a point. seems like a lot of people like to blow hot air (kind of like me right now) In regards to hollywood choosing to tell the dooded up comic version rather than the just as interesting historical version: I think that whole safe bet/proven material thing might come into play. It might be less of a risk to make something people are already familiar with. Not only the story but the writer. ahhh theres my know it all two cents.
Dec. 25, 2005, 2:31 p.m. CST
by Evil Chicken
This looks amazing. It should be great.
Dec. 25, 2005, 4:10 p.m. CST
Looks good but if you switched the helmets for construction hats you'd have a parade!
Dec. 25, 2005, 6:47 p.m. CST
I was impressed after seeing the rough comps from The Lord of the Rings, when compared with the final film... for now, I'm interested in '300', but not impressed yet. Frankly, it does not look anything like the comic, style-wise.
Dec. 25, 2005, 6:49 p.m. CST
Just remember: Mr. Pibb + Red Vines = http://www.crazydelish.com
Dec. 25, 2005, 6:52 p.m. CST
from a movie based on a graphic novel based on a movie (the 300 spartans) based on a notoriously inaccurate historical resource (the histories of herodotus) based on oral tradition? 300 is frank miller's poem to the ancient greek ideals of virtue. the issues were titled Honor, Duty, Glory, Combat and Victory for pete's sake. it's meant to be more like a modern version of simonides' elegy than the accounts of plutarch or herodotus. of course it's skewed to the spartan perspective, it's told from leonidas' p.o.v. while i agree all the bare-chestedness in a hoplite battle is just plain silly, they are supposed to have trained naked and at least we don't have to see that. bottom line: if they're bringing back the sword and sandal epic era, at least this is an interesting and stylized version. i just hope this puts us one step closer to a movie of frank miller's ronin, which should make it redundant for me to say i think 300 samurai would make quick work of 300 spartans. a slow, rigid phalanx of bronze shields, spears, and swords versus elite swordsmen and archers on horseback with the most meticulously tempered and folded steel in history? no contest.
Dec. 25, 2005, 6:57 p.m. CST
...Bill Sienkiewicz's (spelling?) Elektra: Assassin made into a movie. Now there's a goldmine waiting for a few good shovels.
Dec. 25, 2005, 7:13 p.m. CST
OK...it does look rather gay...
Dec. 26, 2005, 1:54 a.m. CST
Why does Hollywood let Zach handle such a topic? The guy is an idiot. He can shoot popcorn commercials, but not this movie.
Dec. 26, 2005, 2:05 a.m. CST
I mean damn every
Dec. 26, 2005, 2:35 a.m. CST
It's got a good cast and I think they did the right thing by making it look "illustrated", it will set it apart from Troy, Alexander, et al of bombs. Plus I'm desperately in love with Gerard Butler and he looks fantastic. (Yes, I am a chick.) He's actually a very talented actor who has rotten luck. It's kind of funny this site is condemning him as mediocre and then doing their damndest to ignore his Beowulf and Grendel in favor of the Robert Zemeckis version. (As most of Hollywood is doing...coincidence it isn't getting an American release?)
Dec. 26, 2005, 2:45 a.m. CST
If they'd been wearing more clothes, you'd be complaining they deviated from the comic book for fear of looking gay...pick a side, boys. Personally I'm amazed they've actually got them wearing leather Speedos. Really, even I would rather see Gerard Butler in pants.
Dec. 26, 2005, 8:24 a.m. CST
by Citizen Arcane
300, Brokeback Mountain, Men Alone 2: The KY Connection or Bryan Singer's Superman? Got to go with Superman. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Dec. 26, 2005, 5:51 p.m. CST
Stop complaining that the movie looks gay, guys, for Pete's sake!! (whoever Pete is) For the record, it is unlikely that the Spartans fought naked, so calm down! Depictions on ancient friezes of naked hoplites was probably a means for the artist to show off his skill in rendering musculature and the details of the human form than a record of reality; and though Miller depicts them naked nonetheless, I have no bones with that - I subscribe to the view of one of my loved ones, who reckons Miller may have partly used friezes as inspiration in his characterisation, to capture the artistry of the age...? Who knows. But never fear - watching well-honed, bare-chested Spartans will not turn you gay, unless you were half-way there already! Although Tomb Raider did make me fancy Angelina Jolie a little bit.
Dec. 26, 2005, 5:54 p.m. CST
I couldn't agree more. Well said sir - your feelings encapsulate mine completely. Please let this one be good - the epic need not die yet!!
Dec. 26, 2005, 6:31 p.m. CST
by Citizen Arcane
That doesn't seem to wise. Unless there were no sharp weapons and we were all well oiled or in some sort of mud or Jello pit. Was that out loud?
Dec. 27, 2005, 2:02 p.m. CST
by Borgnine JR
or 300 Vikings?
Dec. 27, 2005, 7:21 p.m. CST
This movie looks amazing. Spartans vs. Persians - one wants to repel invaders who have attacked its homeland before and one is bent on world domination. Miller's graphic novel takes this premise and flies with it. It's like a dream we dreamed of warriors who lived and died long ago. Lots of books have the facts ordered correctly with emphasis on fighting techniques, armor, lists of soldiers, and historical accuracy. What I want (and what I believe Miller and Snyder are going to give me) is the experience of those times and that battle as art. Graphic novel art and movie-making art. I can read the text books and histories but they don't immerse me in the sight and sounds of battle, of growing to adulthood knowing that war is my destiny and of encountering that destiny on a hot summer day in a narrow pass outmanned 1000 to 1. That is what I want -- the talent of actors, CGI artists, musicians, costumers, set decorators, writers and a director that will take me to the dream that was Thermopylae and make me feel the heat, blood and agony of that war for those warriors. Oh, and Gerard Butler is a total babe!
Dec. 28, 2005, 12:29 a.m. CST
If I want to see the historical account of Thermopylae I will look to PBS or the History Channel or National Geographic or a history book or something of that nature. I look for movies to entertain. 300 MIGHT do that, the comic book did.
Dec. 28, 2005, 4:11 p.m. CST
by Childe Roland
...a six-inch mini Ditka? Depends. Are da Spartans nekkid? Yep? Ditka by 56 points. Seriously, though, I don't think historical accuracy has much of a leg to stand on in the viewing of a faithful adaptation of Miller's work. The guy is about caricatures more than characters and ideas more than events. Either let go and enjoy the ride or move on to something more mundane. And here's one to grow on: It takes balls to fight naked...and brains not to lose them while doing so.
Dec. 29, 2005, 11:15 a.m. CST
Thanks Cat...and Moviemack, I need to be inspired a bit to use it. My current dilemma is that it usually comes out when someone makes a political comment, and I am trying to avoid those subjects. Though if Paul Greengrass makes another movie, I am sure I will go into overdrive with it
Dec. 29, 2005, 11:24 a.m. CST
Yes hyper-reality is a word:
Dec. 29, 2005, 11:43 a.m. CST
OkOK now generation dumbass is out in full effect (happy moviemack?) the idea that a semblance of Historical accuracy, and even more interestingly historical tactical accuracy in battles= impossible to do in a film while keeping it entertaining = dumb, very dumb. We don
Dec. 29, 2005, 11:14 p.m. CST
Miller discusses 300 here: http://tinyurl.com/exkwy and has this to say "...this isn't a historical text; this is an adventure yarn." and Zack Snyder says the graphic novel is like a piece of beautiful art and wonders "How can I make that into a movie and not make it like a Hollywood version of the movie but how do I make that (the GN) live?" So I guess I trust Snyder to give us the version of the book that Miller wrote and not a Hollywood version of a movie about the Spartans. So don't take my hyper-real comment as a comment on what the film maker is actually going to do but as a comment on what I think might be an emotional experience when viewing the movie. Miller is quite aware of the actual tactics of battle and the history of this time and place and the people in it. The actors are physically ready to take on their roles and I'll bet BurlIvesLeft whatever that they are being choreographed too. Now, where did I put my kaleidoscope?