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Topher Grace Vs. Your Friendly Neighborhood SPIDER-MAN'
Ahoy, squirts... Quint here and I'll be goddamned if this isn't the weirdest bit of casting yet. I love Topher Grace, who has just been announced by HOLLYWOOD REPORTER as being cast as the 2nd of two villains in SPIDER-MAN 3, but I'm a little confused by this casting.
Don't get me wrong. I love the idea of Grace in the movie. However, if the rumblings I've heard about who villain #2 is going to be are true... then this doesn't fit.
He have a source deep inside Sony who has seen the wardrobe and effects tests. These tests were later confirmed by Raimi. The source said there was a ton of sand being used, which fit in with all the Sandman rumblings I've heard out of the industry. We've heard from him/her/it very recently and he/she/it made mention of seeing something else.
There were apparently 3 different busts featuring VENOM in different poses. One, apparently, had an arm pointing its claw-like fingers out, one had an open "monster mouth" and one was just a regular bust. These were in the vein of McFarlane's vision of the character. There was also a lot of black cloth laying about the wardrobe area.
I've been sure Venom wasn't going to be in the film, but this source has nailed a few specifics in the past, so I'm inclined to believe him/her/it.
If this is true, then does that mean Topher Grace is Venom? That doesn't fit. I could see Thomas Hayden Church as Venom, though. So, then does that mean Topher is Sandman? He's not a fit for either character.
But no matter what, we know that Topher Grace is playing one of two villains in SPIDER-MAN 3 and Thomas Hayden Church is playing the other villain. I love Venom as the polar opposite of SPIDER-MAN, but would rather see him develope over a couple movies... and certainly not being in a movie with Sandman, who has very, very similar powers. What do you folks think?
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Crotch Gobblers!
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M'kay?
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May 19, 2005 11:40:30 PM CDT
Good job, Wanker! Want to get back to complaining about how much
by team america
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He was good in that Company movie. It'd be nice to see him in a role where we could actually "see" him (unlike the goblin).
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I don't care if people who say "First" in talkbacks are idiots or Hulk Hogan has a beer etc. I do think it's ironic that I beat all of you to a talkback the day that Episode 3 is released. As a Lucas fan, a fan of Harry and a proponent to all the infidel defyers on this site, it's quite poetic. Spiderman rules, though I don't know what to think of Topher, except he's funny and such. -Az
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Venom would be awesome, as would Sandman. But both in the same movie seems a bit much to pull off. If it is true, Raimi and co. will have their work cut out for em.
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+ Osborne Jr + those early rumors way back when that Black Cat might be in the flick (would also explain the black cloth), you toss a couple other guys in there, and I wonder if Raimi is shaping up his own version of the Sinister 6. Sposed to be his last flick, maybe he's aiming to really go out on a bang.
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Mmm, good. So I was wrong, maybe. Looks like there will be Venom in this movie, maybe. Wanna hear my two cents? No? Okay, well they're free, you ungrateful bastards, so hear goes: if Venom is indeed bad guy numbah too, then I'd be inclined to believe that it's Mister Topher who'll be Eddie Brock. Doesn't make sense? Hells naw. At least not the way he's visualized in the comics (then again, Maggie Grace as Kitty Pryde doesn't make much sense either dot dot dot). BUT! Topher, for all his good looks and geeky charm, is well -- actually I guess I just said it. Kind of geeky-looking. In a Hollywood sorta way, you know; personally I think I've got him trumped. Ahem! So, maybe what they're going for, especially if Raimi doesn't really like the character of Venom to begin with, is to make Eddie Brock sort of like Peter Parker's doppelganger? You see what I'm saying? It certainly adds a different angle to their relationship from the audience's point of view, and perhaps makes the character of Venom more interesting to Raimi.
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Mmm, good. So I was wrong, maybe. Looks like there will be Venom in this movie, maybe. Wanna hear my two cents? No? Okay, well they're free, you ungrateful bastards, so hear goes: if Venom is indeed bad guy numbah too, then I'd be inclined to believe that it's Mister Topher who'll be Eddie Brock. Doesn't make sense? Hells naw. At least not the way he's visualized in the comics (then again, Maggie Grace as Kitty Pryde doesn't make much sense either dot dot dot). BUT! Topher, for all his good looks and geeky charm, is well -- actually I guess I just said it. Kind of geeky-looking. In a Hollywood sorta way, you know; personally I think I've got him trumped. Ahem! So, maybe what they're going for, especially if Raimi doesn't really like the character of Venom to begin with, is to make Eddie Brock sort of like Peter Parker's doppelganger? You see what I'm saying? It certainly adds a different angle to their relationship from the audience's point of view, and perhaps makes the character of Venom more interesting to Raimi.
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That's "Here goes," not "hear goes." Dammit.
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Eddie Brock. Guys, Tobey and Topher are extremely physically alike, even their faces. I know it may differ from canon, but who better to play Spider-Man's dark side than someone who looks pretty damn close? From what I'm gathering from little news bits here and there, it looks like Raimi could be doing 3&4 back to back, so my latest theory on plot goes: Spidey faces Sandman in #3, Black Cat comes along in 3 also and Peter's eye strays and he and MJ possibly breakup only to reunite in 4. Meanwhile, we get Eddie Brock setup in 3 and Spidey gets a black suit in 3 (result of Man-Wolf cameo? It sounds off, a little, but it's just crazy and out of the blue enough that something like that might get done, the way the bar of geekgasmicity -what a word!- keeps getting raised), only to have Brock get the suit by the middle of 4 (3 could end with black suit Spidey with Black Cat instead of MJ?) and pose a very immediate threat. No idea on how Harry Osbourne would fit into this. ///// By the way, can anyone answer me this? Where on earth did the big theory about having Spidey fight a villain pre-credits come from? That seems to be all the rage but it doesn't seem as though it would be likely to happen given the way the past two movies have done their credit sequences (Danny Elfman's spidery strings with the Marvel logo appearing is just GOLDEN). A deviation from what's been established would just be weird, and besides, it seems kinda formula at this point to start off with Peter going on about Mary Jane.
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Now if Tobey decides to call it quits down the line he won't be able to...damn it all.
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May 20, 2005 12:01:58 AM CDT
I'm guessing Venom, with the added twist being that he becomes a
by dasher
After all, the two guys do look alike. And this would add an interesting dimension to Venom. We all know Raimi loves the Peter Parker story, so maybe this is what finally sold him on the Venom concept - that it's not just Spidey vs. Spidey, but also Parker vs. Parker. I think Raimi could do something interesting with that, but I agree that having Sandman in there as well is too much. Maybe they'll just use him as a supporting villain (like the Scarecrow in Batman Begins) or set him up for the next sequel.
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Does this mean that Raimi is abandoning the idea of using Harry as the new green goblin. They've certainly been setting that up over the last two films. Moreover, it was in the comic. I'd be the source is wrong or a plant. Quentin Beck, seems a far more likely role for Topher. It's the kind the comic part he'd be great for. Quentin Beck needs to have that same foppishness that Joaquin Pheonix had in 'Gladiator' with the same chilling malice lurking underneath. Hayden Church as Sandman is still a great pick. And I'm with Harry. Venom isn't going to happen in this movie. He's a cool character that rose out of a lame origin. Wolverine was similarly shallow in his original X-Men incarnation. It wasn't till Chris Claremont got hold of him that he really became anything to write home about. Claremenont was never one of my faves as a comics writer, Grant Morrisson, Neal Gaiman, Alan Moore, and Frank Miller are the heavyweights of the super hero genre. Still, Claremont did right by Wolverine, and oh, god, I'm rambling. Shouldn't have toke that... Aw, nevermind! What's important is that there are probably going to be three Spidey villains if this is true. Although, Harry could easily be persuaded to do a double back. I'd bet they'll resolve that storyline in the first act, with the rest of the story focusing on Church/Topher vs. Spidey. Who knows? Maybe we'll get a Spiderman movie with a 150 Minute running time. That'd give me the halo, wings, and glasses I need to get to geek Heaven. I sure hope there's a special Heaven for geeks. If I have to spend eternity with Pat Robertson, Ralph Reed, Anne Coulter, Rush Limbaugh and George Bush (both of 'em), I'll feel like I'm in Hell. ...I think I'll go worship Satan now. Later fellow talkbackers!
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May 20, 2005 12:07:28 AM CDT
If you told me Red Foreman was playing the Vulture, I'd buy it
by crimson dynamo
no, wait
"I'd buy that for a dollar" -
Spiderman has what, two cool enemies? Topher could be Stiltman! Or that douche with a fish bowl on his head. Yawn.
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Everyone is having a hard time placing topher in any role....but if in fact the spiderman 3 i read here, about vemon concepts at sony, then I suggest that topher is going to Carnage...its the only character i can think of that fits in the storyline...I can picture it...spiderman gets the alien suits and catchs topher( a murderer, as in the comic) but it spawns off onto him,( as in the comic) Then spiderman tosses the suit and WHAMMY! eddie brock...so it can kind of be a triangle of death...Vemon hates spiderman and carnage, carnage just wants to use his new suit to kill and spiderman is trying to hold it all together( as usual)...might seem a bit off, but topher would fit this character very well..i could picture him a fucked up carnage. Plus Carnage is cool.the suit is made of blood and he can make killing shit with it...plus he is a bad ass serial killer...could mean a more dark spiderman movie....its a thought...do with it as you will...
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No, they haven't been "setting [Harry's villainy] up" over the last two movies. They've been presenting the possibility. The most frustrating thing in arguing about whether or not Harry should "turn evil" with fans of this series and the comic book series is because, knowing what they already know, they take it as a given that certain events mean things that they don't necessarily mean. It's not a given that Harry's going to become the next Green Goblin, or "Hobgoblin," or whatever, just because he discovered his father's secret stash of Oz ooze. Any sane person (and they haven't established that he's that far off the rocker as of yet) would use that situation as an opportunity to escape from the desire to impress their tyrannical father, who turned out to be a bastard and an evil nutjob to boot.
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He wouldn't be perfect but they might be going with the Ultimate version of Venom. Which would suck because Venom, well, sucks. Could be worse, though I guess. Could be Carnage. Or Paste-Pot-Pete. Heck, Paste-Pot-Pete might even be kinda cool...Maybe it's Mysterio?
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If this TalkBack is going to keep going the way that it's currently going, I'd like to go on record saying I'm the first one who pointed out the idea of Topher being a Parker clone. Damn plagiarists.
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No way would I buy Topher Grace as a serial killer.
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Is that you cant keep true to the comic's origin...too much backloged Secret War BS. SO, forget everything we know. I assume this will be the first real depature in the franchise. Rami's kept it more or less real for two films and a zillion dollars, know he can do what ever he/ARAD wants to.
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Fuck taking credit. This is a TalkBack; people should be able to shoot the shit however they please. Sorry for the pathetic "ego" moment there, fellas, continue as you were.
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I agree. Like superhero said, it'll probably be something closer to the "Ultimate Spidey" version of Venom if there is a Venom at all. ********* One thing I'm slightly bi-curious about: there're gonna be TWO villains in this one? Is that the best idea? Something about that makes me nervous that, perhaps, neither character is particularly interesting. ********** By the way, I meant what I said in that last post. I shouldn't give a shit whether or not I was the first to say whatever; I'm one TalkBacker in a sea of hundreds.
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Isn't it possible that Harry finding the goblin stuff will have the revelation, "holy shit, my father was the green goblin... peter had to do what he had to do"... i mean, it's not great, but it ends that story... i can't remember how it was in the first film tho... harry didn't know norman was the gg, right?
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Personally, I thought that line was cute. Eh well. If you wanna check out corny dialogue, watch the latest 'Fantastic Four' trailer ("Good old Reed, always stretching..." ...groan).
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i do however want to see black cat.....but topher just doesn't have the curves to pull if....if i dare say myself.
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Maybe he'll play Jason Philip Macendale, Jr. or one of those guys that was the Hobgoblin, but make him a business partner to Harry Osborn prior to his becoming the 2nd Green Goblin (which I personally don't want to happen.....recycling villains in comic books might be ok, but not in movies).
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you put everyone else's name in the subject line I figured I'd do it for you :)
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Why thank you. ;-)
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Forget everything you've learned about the origins of Venom. He'll be created quite simply as Spider-man was; a bio-engineered spider bites the hand of a Daily Bugle nerd who then becomes a super-powered 'hero'. Except this hero didn't have the guidance of an Uncle Ben to set him on the right track...He's been harassed and maligned all his life and he's going to give it right back to all those people who have been giving him flack; including everyone's favorite hero - Spiderman.
It's the nerd-duality of it all. I think it's genius and would make for an interesting set up for the 4th movie, which will be the downfall of Harry Osborne. -
I'm a little fuzzy on canon, but here's a weird idea: instead of the Spidey/Venom duality thing, what if they somehow worked in that storyline bit about how things turned out that Spidey died and his clone took his place? Though audiences would probably find it implausible given film technology these days.. // to everyone else, ok, so there's alot of talk about black cloth and Topher Grace has been hired. But who says that translates to Venom in #3? What if Eddie Brock is a villain in Peter Parker's personal life? Combine that with Black Cat and Peter Parker is going to get one hell of an emotional beatdown yet again, which is an angle Raimi apparently loves.
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Actually, the fact that two of the cast members are currently on Fox's payroll was not lost on me either. Seems a little suspicious, but I'm afraid to admit to myself that they're *that* cheap, although any production company that sends their films off to Vancouver to be shot ought not to be relied upon for filmmaking with integrity. Vancouver = cheap-ass production values. In any case, I think Chiklis and MacMahon will not be what sink this movie, and you're right: much as I have "beef" with Goyer, I'd much rather see him touch over 'FF' than Simon Kinberg. The dialogue really truly is atrocious, and I don't usually ask that much in the way of dialogue in movies like these. Makes me wonder how much coke the producers must have been doing to think his "puns" were funny. As for Thing? I think not CG'ing him was the way to go; he's bound to look a little fake either way.
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I don't know. The clones thing is waaay too convoluted for my tastes.
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May 20, 2005 1:14:17 AM CDT
Screw Spidey: When Are We Going to Get West Coast Avengers?
by van damned
I would laugh my ass all the way to the poorhouse from seeing it again and again.
Plus, all the dorks mentioned above would fit perfectly into the roles. Boffo box office, baby!
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Wait and see....
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It's a change, sure, but not really a crucial one. It's not like the Thing has to be huge; he just has to be strong.
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he shouldnt be in the fucking movie. Fuck you Sam Raimi!!!
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Grace could easily be Quentin Beck or the Chameleon, Carnage actually sounds right but I really doubt it and I acutally like the idea of him being Venom. Since my only complaint about Venom was he was a big retard in a black suit, at least a copy cat Peter Parker would make things interesting. Also the black suit stuff with claws couldn't that be black cat? So Venom might still might not even be considered. If he is that would mean they will either drop the Harry being the Goblin story or that somehow they've picked Tobey up to do 4 more Spidey films and save the Peter vs. Harry show down for the end of Raimi's series.
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Tofu-eating Tobey Maguire could kick Topher Grace's ass. In real life. Where's the conflict?
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If they're gonna do a clones story line, it oughta be something along the lines of Harry, knowing Parker is Spidey, trying to clone him, but then getting a result a la Goldblum/The Fly, where the cloning process couldn't handle Pete's human/Spidey DNA, and instead of making a Spidey-man makes a Spidey-monster! GRRRRR ARRGGGHHH!!!
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tee hee. You're funny.
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I'm fucking cracking up over here, man. Spidey-monster. God bless you.
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Have to agree w/some of the above. Topher Grace probably should've been cast as Spidey from the get go as he appears a much closer match to Peter as depicted in the comics(think the Lee/Ditko era). Never really watched his tv show but was impressed w/his performance on SNL recently and the trailer for that movie he did w/Dennis Quaid whose title escapes me now. Apparently he can handle both comedy and drama which is a essential for playing Peter Parker/Spider-Man. If they use him as a villian now he won't be able to play the role once Tobey's finished w/it, presumably w/part 3. That'd be a shame.
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You mean another actor has been playing Spider-Man for all these years?
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Seems logical that they'd change the character a bunch.
He'd be Peter Parker-like, but irresponsible. Seems to fit in with the great power/great responsibility crap. -
May 20, 2005 3:06:25 AM CDT
Topher as a villain is what's making this monkey pull his hair o
by monkey_king
Who the hell could he be playing? Isn't he still skinny as a rail? Hope they cast this sucker right this time around. 1st films casting was great(costume sucked), 2nd film was even better(costume was great), 3rd film? Back to suckiness? Could be, unless Raimi pulls a miracle and a boomstick out of his ass.
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the movie will rock, regardless who's doing what or if there's any storyline.
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They're going with a more Ultimate Spider-Man route with the Venom character. In Ultimate, for those who don't know, Eddie Brock is a kid from Pete's past who was a family friend from before his parents (scientists looking for a cure for all kinds of disease with a symbiotic fluid) died. Brock finds their old research, and Pete finds the fluid, which attaches itself to him. It's a really good read, and better in my opinion than a suit he found on another planet, or space goop from the cartoon.
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Topher is in Spidey 4
He is Venom, through the course of the story, he is consumed by the black suit.
Key word = CONSUMED -
Couldn't one of the villains be Hobgoblin? Wouldn't that make sense with the direction Raimi has been taking the films, and with Topher's casting?
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Thomas Haden Church could indeed be playing Venom and Topher Grace could be playing Carnage, who the hell knows...
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Sam Raimi has yet to let me down with the casting in the Spider-Man movies. I'm sure it'll be great.
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May 20, 2005 4:14:21 AM CDT
raimi would have to be an absolute dick to put venom in SM3..
by bearison ford
it would go against everything he's said in the past about the character. I just don't buy it.
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That is what everyone would have asked if he was Spiderman insted of Tobey. Harry will try to clone Parker, but Venom will be the result. Who cares if he changes the orgin of Venom, nobody knows who Venom! Only true fans know his real orgin, and most old head Spiderman fans hate Venom!!
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May 20, 2005 5:26:16 AM CDT
Not to flog a dead horse, but Topher playing Spidey in a James C
by the mothman
I haven't bothered to read Cameron's treatment, but with his work ethic, I can't imagine he screwed up THAT badly...or did he?
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... anyone with half a brain can see that Topher is perfect for Kraven. Look at the character in the comic! Now look at Topher! You can't tell the difference, can you!?
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... if that shitty-ass clone nonsense shows up in SM3, I'll be spending my money that summer on whatever piece o'crap Ashton Kutcher flick is out.
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May 20, 2005 6:27:48 AM CDT
So all 3 movies have a reluctant villain who was "possessed" by
by frankdrebin
This series has been big on pathos, so I could see Grace not wanting to be a bad guy, but getting corrupted by the venom costume. I was betting that John Jameson was gonna be Venom, with the symbiote brought back from space instead of the Moonstone (because, face it, a space-werewolf is a bit much, even for comic fans). But 'Adammon' might have figured it out: the radioactive spider from the first movie escaped, so it might bite another science nerd.
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Fantastic in Sideways! Now just put him alongside Bruce Campbell in at least one scene. Comedy gold!
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Topher Grace IS P.Parker. Why the fuck does he have to be in a Spidey movie as a villain??..
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'nuff said
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you heard it here first
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There was a story line that I hated in the late 80's that hada clone of spidey running around ... infact for the longest time no one new it was a clone. It almost ended up like a Bobby Ewing dream sequence thing on Dallas, a cheesy mechanism to erase a poor season.
Again I hated this storyline at that time but maybe they could treat the idea better now.
MY2CENTS
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May 20, 2005 8:27:14 AM CDT
Topher as the anti-Peter Parker with Venom as the anti-Spidey?
by rev_skarekroe
I love it. Much better than the muscle-bound blonde Eddie Brock from the comics. Sometimes movies actually improve upon the source material!
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NO time for establishment, NO time for power development, - awful. I don't even care anymore. I'm tired of being a geek. I'm going to get married, buy an easy chair and wait for death.
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May 20, 2005 8:35:34 AM CDT
Imagine Topher Grace as Morbius and try not laughing your ass of
by big bad clone
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Seriously, Trent Ford mastered that spoiled eurotrash thing on the West Wing, he's perfect for Michael Morbius (am I really spelling that right, I swear it's wrong). Topher Grace is a MUCH better fit for Peter Parker and Spider-Man than Toby Maguire ever was. Granted, both are kinda dead-pan and, at least in the case of Maguire, I think the gratest talent here has been fooling critics into thinking it's good, but still, Topher in a Spider-Man movie and not playing Peter Parker is just wrong. Church would also be a better Venom, but I would like them not to bother with that character before the Scorpion or King Pin or the Black Cat (which should be Kate Hudson or Mena Suvari).
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He's a sucky villain. Get one of those cool-ass, brutal 70's villains in there like Tarantula or the Shocker. Hell, I'd even settle for Rocket Racer, Morbius or Stegron over fucking Venom...
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Venom and Sandman together would not make any sense. Two CGI characters like Venom and his brother Carny would certainly fill more seats in the theatre.
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...is I always thought his girlfriend in That 70s Show, Laura Prepon, would have been a much better Mary Jane than butt-ugly Kirsten Dunst (that's righ, I said BUTT-UGLY!). Laura has the right body and the looks for the knock-out that MJ should be. And whoever said Topher should have been Peter was spot on.
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That makes sense from a casting point of view but flies in the face of the info that's been put out so far.
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He's playing the living bee swarm. SWAAAAARMMMM!
or Stilt Man. maybe its Stilt Man.
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Venom was kinda cool when he came out, but Marvel ruined the character. Also, how is Venom going to have the black and white suit?
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I don;t know if anyone has been paying attention, but Goofy McGee (Tobey Maguire) has really larded up and has been looking awful recently. Maybe he is pulling out and Grace is replacing him. I am all for that. I never LIKED Tobey, he IS however a good actor, but I just never bought him as Spider-Man. I really don't know why, but I can't get behind him. His wise-cracking seems forced I guess. But can you imagine Topher Grace flinging one liners at the likes of the Sandman? Phew, that would be sweet. As for the duder who said he'd never buy Grace as a serial killer, well, you obviously haven't seen Sin City, because anyone who has seen that knows that you can take any skinny nerd-boy and make him unbelievably creepy and effective as a serial killer (Elijah Wood).
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Didn't the Shocker suffer from low self esteem? Wouldn't you like to see Topher say, "No on listens to me! I'm gonna be a supervillian. My power is vibrations!"
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No, Topher as Venom makes a LOT of sense, if you look at Venom as Spidey's opposite. What if with great power came great IRRESPONSIBILITY? From a character point of view, it would be a lot of fun for Eddie Brock to show Peter Parker how cool it would be to use his powers for self-gratification and evil. Remember, the theme of the movies so far is "Parker's life sucks because of his burden of being (good) Spider-Man". An evil Spider-Man is very inspired. An alien costume that wants to eat Spider-Man is pretty boring.
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May 20, 2005 9:33:21 AM CDT
Hey, could it be that Topher is really playing Spidey, that Tobe
by johnnytremaine
Dunno. Topher Grace would be a good replacement though after his film debut in that Dennis Quaid movie. I remember critics praising him as a "young Tom Hanks".
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venom and carnage
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he is seen as an evil, "roided-up" Spiderman and he's definitely one of the coolest looking villains (admit it, a CGI Venom on film would be a site to behold)... I know a lot of diehard Spidey fans hate the character but I can't wait for him to be in the movies (probably because I was never a diehard Spidey fan to begin with)...
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The venom\carnage arcs help revive the comic, i could totally see grace as an insane killer
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...should've been Spidey from the get-go. The build, the voice, the sense of humor are all perfect. I like ythe movies so far, but Spidey's character has always felt like Tobey was playing him on Prozac. I'm kind of sad to hear Topher will be in 3, apparently as a villain, acting alongside Tobey when he should be replacing the guy after he ditches the series when his contract is up.
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I don't know how right I am about this but you all seem to be assuming if Venom is in it that he would be a main bad-guy in both 3 (&, hypothetically, 4). They seem to have established with the first two and the Osborn plot they're willing to do a slow build, which works best (the whole is Harry going to flip/isn't he) so whoever said if they do 3 and 4 and Venom would build up on 3 and be the main villan in 4 would be right. The main thing to remember about the villans is Raimi uses them as metaphors of what is going on in Peter's life... the inclusion of Black Cat to introduce a some twist in Peter's love life a seems safe bet and the villan being Sandman representing the breakdown of his situation and inability to hold the situation together. In this situation 3 and 4 would make sense if they built a Spidey/Black Cat arch up over the two, if they were to act on the relationship, as Sandman would represent the breakdown in the relationship between Peter & MJ could lead on to 4 where Venom represents an aspect of Peter himself and a metaphor for his own emotions turning in on him, for betraying his true love, MJ, for lust with Black Cat. That's kinda my guess anyway and Raimi has been noted for saying that the villans serve as the story for Peter's life in the films rather than have villans because of their 'cool' factor. As for doing a pre sequence villan, I doubt they'd waste the money and time on building up all the effects for one for a brief scene.
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I will also settle for Scarlet Johanson.
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Gobby Jr - Lowell Mather - Eric Cartman Trio, and Sylvestor Stallone as Freeze; oh wait wrong movie.
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I think that Topher Grace would make a great Man-Wolf. He wouldn't actually be a villian by choice but someone who is infected by a piece of moon rock and has no choice in the fact that he turns into a werewolf.
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May 20, 2005 10:47:37 AM CDT
What about the rumors that Raimi is shooting 3 and 4 at the same
by barry egan
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1) Thomas Haden Church is only playing the Eddie Brock character, with Topher as the Venom/Parker clone
2) This is double-casting for films 3 and 4 to be shot simultaneously - Church as Sandman in #3, Grace as Venom in #4
The more I think about it, the more I think the second choice as likely.
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Yes, I remember everyone was screaming for Topher to be Spidey back in! Give me a break!!! Topher as anti-Spidey is a great idea. I love the way people think that a movie with more than one villain can't work. They site the crappy Batman's as an example. I have way more faith in Raimi the Schumacher! More than one villain will be fine. In fact I say the more the merrier!
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what happened to doc connors. I wanted to see the LIZARD!
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It's possible that Topher is Ned Leeds, but it's more likely that he's just someone that works for Oscorp or something of that ilk.
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Regardless of what Grace plays, it seems as though, despite everything Raimi said ( although he may have been dicking around with the press) about Venom, Sony still heard the fan outcry loud and clear and "decided" that Venom had to be in one of the next movies. Which brings as back to Grace and the whole controversy over who he plays as well as the danger of dabbling with mutliples villains. Has any of you over-caffeinated fanboys stop to consider the possibility that they are filimg both Spiderman 3 & 4 simlutaneously (ala the Matrix sequels and LOTR) and has been previously rumoured, with one continuous story arch and with the mulitple villains each playing a major role in either but not necessarily both sequels. It could be that Sandman takes centre stage in SM 3 - prodded along by Hobgoblin, only to get eliminated by the end of that movie, and Venom, introduced in parts as garce in SM3 then develops slowly through SM 3 before taking a major role in SM 4 with the possibility of a cliffhanger ending at the end of SM 3. That would work for me. YOu could even throw in Larry David's Vulture for mucho cameo time and SEvigny's Black Cat to add that Black Cat/ Love triangle twist that everyone's been hinting at. Those 2 Spiderman movies would kick the crap out of any Superman movie that Singer can possibly dream up. Speaking of which, expect major changes to Supes suit, following widespread fan backlash over those test photos with Routh a while back. I'm telling you guys, studios listen out for this kind of stuff before a movie is released and "sanction" changes as the need arises as has hopefully been demonstrated with Venom's inclusion here......And one more thing......EAT IT, ALL YOU VENOM HATERS!!!!! VENOM RULES ( or rahter, will rule, in Spidey 4; wooohoo!!!)
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.....good grief, I need some freaking coffee....
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Clone Saga on the big screen! It's the only possible scenario worse than having Venom as a villain!
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There have been just as many voices decrying the idea of having Venom as a villain. If I were Sam, and Sony tried to shove Venom down my throat as a villain, I'd tell them to kiss my ass and walk away. The only way this will work is if they skip the whole 'black suit' deal and go straight to Brock becoming Venom. Even then, I just personally don't like Venom.
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I'd make it so the scientists at the museum (or whatever it was) from the first movie figure out that their escaped genetically altered spider must have created Spider-Man. So they try to duplicate its effects, and end up with Venom. Seems pretty simple to me.
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Most reports have the two villains being Sandman and Hobgoblin. I think it all depends on the storyline. But since Sandman is a shoe-in for 3, I don't see how Venon is in there as well. Most likely Sandman is the result of an OsCorp accident (resulting from a Spidey-Hobby battle most likely), but Hobby will not be Harry Osbourne, but Topher's character (there are plenty of ways to bring him in: cousin, childhood friend, lackey, oppressed nerd at OsCorp). Sandman will want revenge on Spidey and Hobby and Harry Osbourne. The thing practically writes itself from there.
Much better and much more practical than a half-assed Spider-Hulk plot. -
I mean, thats how it happened in the comics, and its kind of necessary for the suit to gain its hatred for him. Brock hates Parker for ruining his career with the whole sin-eater thing, and the suit hates him for rejecting it. Their shared hatred is what brings them together, and how he emulates spider mans powers. Kind of doesnt work for him to just show up outta nowhere.
I guess the point I'm getting at is, dont they have to do a movie where Parker gets the symbiote first, then do Venom? Maybe the busts and the fabric are for Parker, not Venom? You know, maybe the fanged look is parker succumbing to the symbiote a litte, before he fights it off. I dunno, seems like that would make more sense. -
Venom will not be in the movie. They are saving him to draw fans back in after Raimi & Toby leave the Franchise!
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But not Venom. He could be Electro??? Sandman and Electro always went well with each other... and then we'd only need vulture, venom and Hobgoblin for a 6 movie.
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... We're probably going to have Thomas Haden Church as a new villain who's some sort of Venom-Sandman almagam and Topher Grace as a version of Carnage.
By the way, Maggie Grace is off X3 as the producers of Lost were going to kill off her character if she took time off to do the movie. -
I had forgotten about how 3 and 4 are shooting together, but given that, this bodes well. This is good. In the comic, New York always seemed bursting at the seams with supervillains - Spidey's always overworked and underpaid - and here's an opporunity to evoke that sense, while still having enough time to give each creep a satisfying character arc. In one 2 hour movie, the multiple villain scenario would be - well - X-men, at best. In two or more, you can have a Matrix/LOTR-scale story without the Wachowski-itis that comes with stretching character arcs too thin, and then stuffing it with filler. This could be bad as hell! The superhero movie to end them all! Imagine the villainous mayhem by Act 2 of the second film! New York has already been savaged by one fiendish foe, only to have 2 more follow through? Spidey can't possibly get out of this one! Tres Stan Lee! Put the puzzle pieces together right, and this is something to get excited about. Way to up the stakes, Sam Raimi! Watch closely, Joel Silver, and learn! "The Man" better have a spectacular cameo. Throw him to the mercy of these dastardly deed doers, dontchaknow!
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Venom is a pathetic excuse for a character. Weak and lame. I love Raimi, but why try and destroy my two fave superhero movie franchises in on week? Frasier as Beast?!? Venom?! Is this punishment for Star Wars being good again?
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and it could very well be just me, but doesnt church have the hair color, the build, and the frankenstein jaw-line to be brock? topher is the complete opposite!
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Well if Topher went all crazy go nuts I could kinda see him as Carnage. Maybe there's a lot more than we're hearing going on.
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Last year was the year of the Comicbook Spiderman, Garfield, Catwoman and Hellboy and blade triniy were some of the big comic movies that were released. SPiderman was a smash while Garfield, Catwoman and blade trinity bombed at the box office.
But what about hellboy. I Never saw Hellboy on its theatrical release, I watched it on DVD and I have to say it knocked me out of my seat.
I thought that it was the best comic book adaptation since superman and before that I tended to agree with lots of people like Roger Ebert said.
I know, i know comic book purists will blast me for saying that I enjoyed hellboy over spiderman. I thought Ron Perlman was a revelation in that movie.
I adored the scene where Hellboy is getting love tips from a teenage boy, while looking scornfully at John Myyers and Liz Sherman and I liked the darkness of it, I liked the slimy squidbeasts and the whole nazis from hell angle.
I hope there is a sequel to Hellboy. -
Only the Ditko issues count. Patrick Stewart IS "The Terrible Tinkerer". Jeffrey Combs IS The Chameleon.
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anyone think that killing off MJ early in spidey 3 would create an interesting plot development? Dunst has already said she wants out after the third film and how better to create a put-upon Parker than to have his true love killed off by one of the villans(which i personally hope is not venom - sandman and carnage sounds a good mix) and then we introduce the black cat, creating guilt in Peter for being attracted to someone so soon after MJ's death, which he takes out on his best friend Harry, leading harry to become the Hobgoblin in spiderman 4 maybe...im thinking kim bauer for Black Cat
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when she names you Topher.
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I heard from a VERY reliable source that they are going ahead with the clone story and are replacing Toby with Topher in the 4th film. The clone story is a convenient way to swap lead actors and maintain continuity. I'm not a big fan of the clone story, but that's their plan. PS. I made all that up, but it sounded pretty good, huh?
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I certainly don't know the sources, i.e. the comic books on which this will be based, but ^that would have been a surprising choice.
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Topher Grace plays the role of "Cock Goblin" (or maybe it's "Knob Goblin"--my "source" was unclear in his/her/its report). All I know is, the script portion I saw had the stage direction "[Topher gobbles cock vigorously]"
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My impression, strictly as a viewer of the films who read some comic books when I was a kid, but doesn't know what time Peter Parker Poos at night, was that there was little doubt the next film WOULD be about the return of the Green Goblin. Is Raimi putting that on the back burner and leaving Franco in the periferals again for Spidey 3? Did I just read that scene incorrectly? I thought it was obvious.
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Wasn't carnage skinny and bony like Grace?
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...isn't Kirsten Dunst the worst fucking choice EVER for MJ? Apart from her role in Interview with the Vampire she has sucked - heinously - in every part she has ever played. Now before you start attacking me, please know that I appreciate nipples in the rain as much as the next straight guy, but folks -- Dunst SUCKS. None of the MJ moxy we're used to from the comics is present in anything Dunst does.
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Everyone is assuming it will be Black Cat, but what about GWEN STACY? This could please fanboys (albeit out of order continuity), add a love triangle/relationship conflict for Pete and MJ, and avoid the too-many-villain syndrome. Fuckin kill her off at the end too!
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But then, I'm confused in general. Here's hoping Raimi is still on the ball and that he hasn't gone all Lucassy on us. Weesa goin' home.
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...is it too much to hope that Raimi's using the Bendis Ultimization of Venom, and Grace is that guy? And that they're building to that character over two films(there are rumors that 3 & 4 are to be shot back-to-back), rather than shoe-horning him into 3? Hmm.
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May 20, 2005 4:35:09 PM CDT
Raimi's a storyteller, he has to finish the Goblin arc somehow.
by darksider
Yes, they were setting up Harry with him using Doc Ock, the vision of Norman, and the discovery of a Goblin hideout. A Green Goblin or a Hobgoblin would be more realistic than Venom. If this is Raimi's last, I think he would want to wrap it up and not introduce all new shit.
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Or The Mindworm. How about The Spot or maybe The Molten Man. Doubtful he will be The Rhino or Man Mountain Marko. But Seriously folks, I think he will probably be introduced in the 3rd film and become Venom in the 4th. I could be wrong but wasn't Eddie Brock a stringy geeky guy (like Topher) before the parasite found him? When it found him it was nearly dead and it drove Brock to bulk up? It gained strength through his increasing strenth. And when it was recovered they became Venom.
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The clone saga of Spiderman was a failure, even if it did save the comic franchise at the time.
Should we ever get a half dozen or so more films, it would make a great 3 film arc, with some reworking.
And Venom is a fantastic charecter possibility- just because he's suffered through some shit writing in the comics means jack dick, people. What's important is how he's handled in the film- and nothing sounds better to me than the dark side of spiderman. -
Mark my shout. Either that or Ben Reilly, of course.
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I've read through everyone's theory's and after Spidey 2, with him being at Empire State U and Aunt May needing money, has anyone else thought that this kinda sound like 'Spiderman and his Amazing Friends'?
Aunt May took on border Angelica Jones to help pay mortgage or rent or whatnot.
If they did decide to go this way and incoprorate that stuff in, which would probably not be the best move but whatever, could Topher be Iceman?
Just a theory.
If not I'm with whoever says that Topher is Toby's replacement as Spidey. -
A clone?! A FUCKIN' CLONE?! That storyline was the worst in the entire run of Spider-man comics... like something out of a bad '60's sci-fi flick. If they pick that story, they might as well get Chuck Dixon to write and Joel Schumacher to direct.
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He will be hopping around yelling things like shrimp on the barbie and I will squash ya mate. It will be a classic fight scene.
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I can't be Iceman, he's licenced to 20th Century Fox.
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May 20, 2005 5:25:39 PM CDT
"The clone saga of Spiderman was a failure, even if it did save
by shigeru
Are you fucking KIDDING ME?!? Please tell me that was a typo or something! The CLONE SAGA did not save the franchise, in fact it did the polar opposite... sales of Spidey comics plummeting from over a hundred thousand or something a month down to like 15k. Not to mention that it is infamous as a bunch of dreck. Marvel views the clone saga as Germany views the Nazis...whoops!
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I quit buying Spidey in the middle of that lame-brained hackery. One hundred percent, 5 star, 4 alarm, ham-handed, mind-fuckerizing PIG SHIIIIT!! That being said, it could have been better.
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The clone story did sort of revitalize the book... when it ended and Marvel realized they would actually have to hire WRITERS for their flagship character.
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I always thought that the filmmakers should have considered setting up Topher Grace to replace Tobey Macguire as Peter Parker when Macguire inevitably leaves the franchise. They say the studio wants to do a total of six Spiderman films, and I do not see Macguire and Kirsten Dunst doing many more beyond this third one. Thus, they will need to replace Macguire, and Topher Grace fits the bill. The added bonus would be a sly in-joke if they then cast Laura Prepon as Mary Jane, who I always thought from the start of these films is who they should have cast to begin with.
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Yes, I have seen 'Sin City.' So what you're saying is...constantly bathe Topher in shadows, make sure he has large white sunglasses that obscure his eyes, don't let him say a word, tell him to smile all the time, and ask him to move around like a cat. I'm sold on the idea already! No, Topher Grace as a serial killer in a Spider-Man movie WOULD NOT WORK, and casting Topher Grace as a mute, inexpressive creep who transforms into a mute, inexpressive computer effect would be a complete waste of casting Topher Grace.
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"That's it, Spider-Man! I'm hopping mad!!"
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I get that Spidey is ageless in the comic, but if they're only gonna do a limited 6 movie run with Spidey, I'd like to see Tobey finish it out, I don't mind seeing a Spidey that grows up throughout the films. I'm surprised to see people so gung ho about replacing him midway, this isn't Bond, they're actually trying to develop some continuity, I'd hate to see that ruined by recasting the film's main actor. I know Tobey can't do it indefinitely, but I'd like to see him finish out whatever the arc is for 6 movies, then they can reboot or whatnot with different actors.
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Maybe when everyone stops paying to see this overhyped, overacted, CGI infested garbage the movie industry might actually turn out something worth watching.
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I think Jeff Goldblum as Brundlefly should be the next villain. He could puke all over Spiderman and try to digest him. Wouldn't it be great in the next movie if what happened to Goldblum in the movie started happening to Peter? He became more and more like a spider. His webbing could come out of his bakside. He would dine exclusively on bugs. He could get extremely hairy and bulbous. You know, of course, I am kidding.
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Maybe if you crack open a movie history book you'd realize that 90% of the movie industry has always been derivative and populist.
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May 20, 2005 7:58:22 PM CDT
I'm thinking by 'villian' they may mean a Peter-like love foil f
by negative man
An effects guy that becomes obsessed with MJ while working with her on a movie set perhaps? That would fit nicely into their story arc.
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Venom's powers are NOTHING like Sandman's powers. Sandman throws sand, the Venom is a symbiote which shoots web and spits goo.
Who the HELL ARE YOU!!! -
I think I'm very confused. What about the narrative momentum of Green Goblin, that moon-rock Wolf-dude, and the Lizard? Are they all being put on the shelf for a movie? Are we that confident there will be a fourth? What are the odds it will have Tobey or Kirsten? It seems like they're screwing with the arc of the first two movies, but whatever. I guess you can resume the love-quadrilateral in the fourth movie with a different cast if necessary.
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Cuz I'm looking at Grace's skinny frame and age, and thinking he can't be anyone super-buff -- but Electro is regular size. Just as long as they don't have Electro in that lame-ass green-yellow outfit with the lighting suspenders and star-face get-up. I always thought that was the lamest costume in Marveldom. Do I get my no-prize?
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Topher Grace will be the wacky superhero SPEEDBALL!
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Electro is like 160 lbs with orange brown hair... and I can see him in that costume. Topher is one of the most underrated of the younger folk out there.
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I hope Sam Raimi keeps the pace going with the Spiderman franchise. Lessons learned from the past, with the Superman franchise, third times a harm in most cases. So far the casting has been decent, but they must be careful that they don't add fodder like the casting of Richard Pryor in Superman 3. A comic genius playing a hot shot computer hacker who invents a super computer bent on world domination, is vomit material at its best. A good arche nemesis and a conflicted super-hero is the backbone for an awesome comic book flick.
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If he is Electro, a costume loyal to the comic might be interesting. He could be proud of the costume, and yet people constantly make fun of him for wearing it...which ticks him off even more.
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Kirsten Dunst "sucked" in 'Interview with a Vampire' too. I'll be here all week, folks.
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May 20, 2005 11:54:29 PM CDT
Let's not bitch about Topher's "physique" until we actually know
by ribbons
I don't really know who he's playing, don't really care. Alls I know is Topher is a good actor and it's cool news that he's not on board. So let's cool it with the "I always knew Electro would make it as a villain" mumbo-jumbo.
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It's cool news that he IS on board. D'oh.
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It's cool news that he IS on board. D'oh.
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Any other villian than the Sandman? To me it makes sense to make him the sandman and Church the Lizard. Maybe that Venom stuff the Sony guy saw was like that Maquette everyone thought was what the thing was going to look like.
I'm sticking with Grace as either Hobgoblin or the Sandman and Church as either the Lizard or The Vulture. -
Looking back, going bankrupt was the best thing to happen to Marvel creatively in a long time. I was like 12 when that clone shit came out and even then I was like "Mom they fucked up Spider-Man!! I don't need any more money to buy it!"
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If Raimi was quoted saying Topher's casting will suit the 'complexities' of his role, and since many have it on record that venom will be in the flick, maybe Raimi is dipping into the Symbiote saga and Topher will play Carnage/Cletus Cassidy; I can certainly see Topher playing the maniac that Cletus was in the comics.
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It's pretty unlikely that Church will be the Lizard. A (one-armed) Doctor Connors, played by Dylan Baker, made an appearance in the last film. If they want to explore the Lizard story, they'll probably use him.
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Someone said the Clone story began in the late '80s. Besides for that one-off with the Jackal, didn't The Clone Saga begin in the mid-'90s? P.S., even though that thing was one big, unnecessary headache, I thought/think the Scarlet Spider's costume was the balls back in the day/presently.
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You're quote: "(and they haven't established that he's that far off the rocker as of yet)"
My comeback: The Hell they haven't! He saw his father's image in the mirror at the end of Spiderman 2. Unless you take it for granted that this really was Norman Osbourne's ghost, then it's clear that Harry was losing his mind at the end of Spidey 2. This doesn't mean that Peter isn't going to be able to save Harry from the dark side. He's a smart guy and he understands what Harry is going through. But Harry's transformation into a villain is certainly going to be dealt with. Still, they could deal with it in the first act and move on. This is the finale, after all. There may be more Spiderman movies, but the arc of the early films has clearly been set up as a trilogy. We can definetely expect more action in this one. Anyway, thanks for responding to my post. Time will tell which one of us will is right and when it does, no one will remember insignificant posts like these. -
Keep in mind, I didn't say you were "wrong," only premature. Now. The mirror thing. The way I choose to look at it is this: he was looking in the mirror and imagining what his father would be saying to him. The actual conversation was an exaggeration of what he was actually thinking, a storytelling device if you will, but not meant to prove Harry's crazy.
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Doesn't it seem a bit more realistic to see Topher as Peter's villain and not necessarily Spider-Man's?
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Perhaps, perhaps not. "Realistic" is a very slippery term when talking about a movie like this, but I see what you're saying. Time will tell.
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The actor who played Conner is too old and un impressive to play the main villian or any villian for that matter. Replace him with Church and you have a better actor and someone who could pull it off. Castiing Grace to play The Sandman makes sense to me as Raimi is doing back to back flicks and they may want him to be in both movies.
See if you read what they reported about Church having to be cast early because they needed to get a jump on the body molds and costume and digital body scanning done. If Church was to be the Sandman they wouldn't need that much lead time. But if he's t be the Lizard they would need as much time as possible to get him modeled in the puter and also readied for his latex costume. Grace could just walk in a be turned into Sand. They did it for The Mummy Movie pretty well.
Remember the whole thing about the Villian will be able to fight Spidey in his enviroment. Unless Church is going to be the Vulture H'll more likely be the Lizard. Church comes off as more of an intellect than some hood or stooge. Topher definately looks like some schlub who could have been working in a lab as a tech, working on Nanite technology and have gotten caught up in a scientific accident.
Besides every villian that sam wanted to put in the movie before ends up being in the next installment. Doc Ock was to be in Spidey 1. Lizard and Black Cat in Spidey 2. -
You talkbackers never stop. Just because a known actor is cast in any superhero movie you automatically assume their either a villian or the hero. Look, Rami loves the classic villians but even if he hates Venom,I think he's a big enough comic loyalist to not change a character from being 6'4 250 to 6'0 and a buck 20 soaking wet. The fact is that Arad and the rest of marvel probably pushed the Venom idea as far as they could and Rami might have caved. the black cloth and the bust are indications of that. So Sandman and Venom. The idea sucks in my mind to have any two baddies in the same movie but I guess Rami is the only guy that could pull it off. For those of you that say Venom sucks probably never pick up a comic in your lives and are just reading his bio from some crappy comic site. This dude had Spidey pissin his pants in every issue. So much so that he trick V into thinking he succeeded in killing him and left him on a island to live out the rest of his days eventhough he was a murderer and wanted criminal. His sole purpose in the comics isn't money, world domination, or science. It's to kill Spider-Man!!! I just want to hear the line "I want to eat your brain," and I'll be happy.
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May 21, 2005 4:40:42 AM CDT
The black cloth with claws... How is that not Black Cat?
by spectrebeeyatch
Grace being Venom is intersting and still could possibly happen but Venom and Sandman in one movie? I think they will have him playing Electro or Mysterio maybe without the fish bowl head
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Skipping past SM3 for a sec, maybe Raimi is setting up something special for SM4.
In the comics, when Hobgoblin debuted there was a big mystery surrounding his identity with several established characters as suspects.
Maybe Raimi is setting something like that up for #4. Could be that Harry, Jameson Jr, Dr Conners, and others have been put in place to make a neat little whodunit (or in this case 'whoisit') down the road that would be keeping in tradition with an extremely popular piece of spider history. Just a thought.
Cybyer -
May 21, 2005 10:09:53 AM CDT
Either they're having a little fun with the 90s fanboys, or Raim
by thewoodman
The Venom stuff lying around could be an attempt to mis-direct the attentions of under-30 Marvel Zombies, baffling & confusing them and teaching a valuable lesson in not taking Internet rumors too seriously. Let's hope spectrebeeyatch is right and the "black cloth laying about the wardrobe area" has more to do with the Black Cat. Or, maybe Sam Raimi suffered a head injury, or was slipped a hit of bad brown acid... in which case the "Spider-Man" series goes down the toilet like the X-Franchise seems to be doing. Which will leave Marvel Films with... what? Daredevil? The Hulk? The Punisher... Elektra... the Floptastic Failure? Folks, when you see Avi Arad on the corner, selling pencils out of a tin cup, do the guy a favor and buy a couple, will ya? He useta be a contender.
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May 21, 2005 10:57:45 AM CDT
A little back history on Venom on film, and why it makes sense t
by genro
Venom has always been treated as a separate character property by Marvel when it comes to film rights. Years ago, they sold the rights to New Line, which then reverted back at some point before the first Spidey film, (Marvel did not renew the option, if I'm not mistaken)...Grace, who's leaving the tube in the immediate future, is considered a strong commodity after his last two flicks, and as seen as having a built-in audience, (i.e - young fanbase)...So, to introduce Brock in S3, while using Sandman and Hobgoblin as the heavies, allows Sony to prepare a second storyarc based around Spidey and Venom, where Venom would eventually become an anti-hero due to Carnage, and allow Sony the possibility of spinning Topher/Venom into his own film...I think this is the goal because Sony is very dependent on Spidey profits and this would be a way to try and double the income...other than that, Church and Grace do look like Brock and the Carnage dude, which is a large enough arc to cover two films...see it as Osborne crossing his father's Goblin serum with Spidey DNA, which is laying *all-over-the-fucking-place* since his webs are organic. Combine the two, and kerpow - Venom and Carnage. I guess you could throw the space rock into the mix as the catalyst...the casting of Tohper though is not for some minor character like Ned Leeds...even though he does fit the Hydro-Man mold from the 90's cartoon, I don't see Raimi getting all giddy over that concept.
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Huh wha? Need I remind you that the Lizard is only the villain when he's the Lizard? It's not like they need Connors to be athletic. Moreover, it's not like Church is all that athletic in the first place. Either way they'd have to use another guy in prosthesis or computer generate the Lizard. And Alfred Molina and Willem Dafore aren't exactly the definitions of strapping young men.
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You guys really are douchebags. Why don't you at least wait 'til it comes out and pretend to have seen it before you start explaining how it helped ruin Marvel?
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Maybe its time you people grow the f*#K up. You should have been over spiderman when you were 13. Dont you have something better to do then to support trash movies. I mean come on... is this the "classics" you really want to tell your grandkids about when your 60? Its crap, and until you stop paying for garbage like Spiderman and Lucas's new crapfests, all your doing is encouraging the industry into dumber and dumber writing and directing. Shame on all of you.
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No, It wasn't a typo. Prior to the start of the Clone Saga, spiderman just got "darker" every month, with Peter becoming violent and absolutely nothing new happening. Sales were plummeting all over the place, and it was very much in danger of going bankrupt, before the clone thing started. And then it did. And for the next year or so, sales were climbing. It was a mystery, the biggest in years, and at 4 main titles a month, it had people buying left and right just to see what happened next. And then you all know the rest of the story, writers conflicted and the top suits over at Marvel pulled the rug out from underneath them halfway through, so any hope for a good end to this massive plot line was lost. So like I said, in the end this was a disaster, but in the beginning it was what kept Spiderman going.
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if venom is in the movie, then great! cause i want to see spidey in his black costume...
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As usual with people who have agendas similar to yours, you confuse "effects-laden" and "based on a comic book" with "dumb." I'm not ashamed to like 'Spider-Man' or 'Spider-Man 2,' especially 'Spider-Man 2,' because I think they're terrific ways to introduce people, especially "grandkids" (who I guess are more important than just regular kids), to the concept of responsibility and selflessness.
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I guess it would be nice to place a larger emphasis on different kinds of movies if you wanted to introduce kids to movies, but I don't know.
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Gotta say, I still think Topher's in line for Quentin Beck! He good looking enough to be a movie star but geeky enough to capture Beck's whiny, vanity in a funny way. Spiderman never demonizes it's villains so hopefully Church and Grace will continue that tradition. Prediction, if Church is indeed playing Sandman then you can bet we'll see something to do with nanotechnology in the origin. For more on that, read Michael Crichton's shitty novel 'Prey'. I hope they do use Sandman. It's the culmination of a trilogy after all, and Sandman's Spidey's ultimate foe. Parker's powers are totally useless against the Sandman. Petey will have to use his brains to deal with this one. That should make for the kind of suspenseful, intelligent action Raimi's movies have become known for. Whatever happens, I think we can expect J.K. Simmons to steal the film once again. I never thought I'd get over his role as a prison rapist on HBO's Oz, but he seems to surprise me with every performance.
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two villians one for spidey one for parker! venom is to throw yuou off! has Mj ever had a relationship with someone besides who we have already seen her with?
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That is a pretty lame addition to a news story. If venom was going to be in spidy 3 then maybe he would be CGI? Just an idea! Come on, "oh there was some porn in the office so I think Spiderman 3 will be a bit bluer than the last ones" CRAP
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Call me a slut for the past comic book storylines but I would prefer the alien suit storyline. Vince Vaughn would be great as Venom. Movie should still kick ass regardless of what they do though and I was satisfied with the last 2 so you can bet I'll be strapping in for Episode III of Spidey.
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just thinking, maybe this whole venom thing is hjust to throw people off the sent, what a bout vulture as a bad guy, it would give loads of opertunity for fancy aerial combat and shit, besides that new guy is far to skinny to be venom
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May 23, 2005 2:45:54 PM CDT
Yes what a good idea...to look for talent from 'That 70s Show"..
by bong
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seriously though i imagine him more as an electro than a venom, in the 70s show eric was always quite smarmy, it would be a good fit then to make electro bad for the hell of it, i.e not a 'conflicted personality' like goblin or doc ock. him and church could be the first proper working class villains in the spidey films. as for lizard, connors character is too similar to ock in the 2nd one, the benevolant mentor figure who suffers the tragic accident (too similar to dafoes osborne come to think of it), you could use lizard as the begining cameo villain everyone seems to be talking about, its not the most complicated of origins, and finally we could see a spidey villain survive and have a happy ending as he's reunited with his family before the real action starts. truth be told, apart from some cornball lines ("don't wowwy your secwets safe wit us" etc)raimi's not gone much wrong with this series at all and any modifications to the source material have been for the better.. phew.. my 1st ever talkback on any website ever, we have the technology!
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Elisha cuthbert for the Black Cat, the one role i don't care if public opinion is divided, that girl is hot!!! and lets be honest whoever plays it they won't be nominated for best supporting actress, may as well stick in some eye candy for us horny fanboys!
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It has been quite a while since I have read any of the comics, and I am not sure of character appearence in them (if that matters in the movie sense at all...), but I think that Thomas Hayden Church would be a great fit for Eddie Brock (Venom) and Topher Grace would probably be a decent Carnage (can't remember real name). This is just my opinion, but I think that seeing the three of them flying all over the place in insane battles would be great!
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He will be Venom in the 4th movie. Eddie Brock in the 3rd. The 3rd movie will use Sandman and a Goblin and resolve the Harry Osborne storyline, while establishing an Eddie Brock storyline for the 4th movie. This makes the most sense.
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Arrrgh!
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In the 3rd movie....Venom! And in the 4th movie....Carnage! Isn't that kickass!?
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Go and ahead and try to tell me that nobody said or thought that when Tobey Maguire was announced as Spidey for the first film. Oh ye of little faith, have a little trust in Sam Raimi, why doncha? I like Topher Grace in just about everything, so I'm sure that whoever he is, whether it's Venom or Sandman or Random "Look! Up in the Sky! It's Spider-Man!" Guy, he's going to kick 39 kinds of ass.
Personally, though, my favourite villain choices for him would be Venom (badass), Electro (team player, plus funny), or Scorpion (Spidey's bad self). -
Maybe Spider-Man III will be a fan favorites edition. Tobey Maguire and Sam Raimi have both waxed poetic about how the one villain they have most wanted to bring to the screen was the Sandman and now it sounds like they are doing it and as a treat to all the rabid fans of Venom it sounds like they are bringing him to the screen as well. I can't help but worry about a certain amount of favoritism though, where Raimi might give the lion's share of effects to Sandman and barely give Venom very many shots. I still stand behind Vince Vaughn as bad ass motherfucker Venom and I would like to see Matthew McConaughey as Carnage, he played crazy in the 4th Texas Chainsaw Massacre after all.
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Hmmm, interesting. Vince Vaughn can evidently do the menancing demeanor quite well. He might be a good Venom.
Still - fan favourites - I wouldn't go to far with that theory, otherwise we might be looking forward to Eugene the Frogman for Spidey 4. *snicker*
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