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John Ottman comments on SUPERMAN and John Williams!
Hey folks, Harry here with a question that's been on a lot of minds. Now, we've known that Williams' score would be somehow involved in the new film by Bryan Singer - we heard that from Bryan himself, but having John Ottman acknowledge it is an even cooler thing. Can't wait to see this!
Dear Harry--
I got to hear John Ottman speak tonight after a screening of "The Usual
Suspects" at my school. First off, I have to say that he's a real down to
earth, cool guy. He fielded a few questions about his role on the
upcoming Superman film as both editor and composer. Of greatest interest
to all the film geeks present was whether he plans to use any of John
Williams' classic score. He said that while he fully intends to write his
own score for the film, he knows he'd be crucified if he didn't pay
homage. So I think it's safe to say we'll at least get a hint of those
great themes.
Here's to a speedy recovery, Harry!
Spanky
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And first!
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I am so glad they will be using the theme in some way..It's as much of the Superman lore as the costume now.
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Ottman: Where do these rumors come from?! Well, the intent right now is to use at least a version of the main theme or make a very respectable nod to it. But it
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This movie should be COMPOSED by Williams. I can still remember what the Ken Thorne guy did to his score in Superman II...an uninspired rehash.
Williams was BRILLIANT with the third Harry Potter...and I'm sure he'd be equally brilliant with the new Superman! -
Mar 04, 2005 7:54:38 AM CST
We don't want a "nod" to Williams' score!--we want Williams' sco
by frankdrebin
We're supposed to celebrate a 15-second quote from the main theme, or a couple bars of Can You Read My Mind? Not hiring Williams means 1 of 2 things: WB was too cheap to do it right (there's not one memorable theme in his IMDB credits: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0653211/), or WB wants a modern sound (techno, hip-hop, alt-pop) instead of a classic orchestral sound.
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A nod is fine but hopefully it will be original; lets not have a 2hr movie which is basically sucking Donner's Superman dick
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Mar 04, 2005 9:05:54 AM CST
Ottman wasn't hired as a money issue, he's always worked with Si
by minderbinder
I assume he's also editing the movie, as usual. A nod might be nice, but we have NO idea what the tone of the movie will be. Look at Batman: Danny Elfman's music was one of the best superhero scores ever. But looking at the footage for the new one, it wouldn't fit at all. Enough with the Williams worship. There are other composers out there who are as good or better. And themes like Can You Read My Mind are plagiarized anyway (Straus's Death and Transfiguration, he changed one or two notes).
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ahhhh...just kidding...John Williams rules..talk about a track record of memorable, legendary, kick-ass film scores. There are too many to name. I don't care so much if they incorporate his Superman score into the new film, but I guess it would be kind of fun. The original Superman films weren't especially great, but I suppose I did really enjoy them as a kid and they were good for their time, even if they don't totally hold up, today.
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Mar 04, 2005 9:59:48 AM CST
A Superman movie will not be a Superman movie without...
by lost skeleton
John Williams' score. That man composed some of the best scores ever in film.
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Mar 04, 2005 10:14:48 AM CST
"homage"? Fuck that shit, I dont want hints of the score I want
by spacesheik
what is this shit?
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Ottman truly sucks. This is depressing news indeed. Even the review of his music on THIS SITE for Xmen said it was "white noise". Uninspired and tired is what his music is. Dull, ant-climatic droning is going to ruin fantastic four and Superman as well. Stupid ass Singer must not have given Williams the job because he's hetero. Perhaps Williams should steer clear of this rancid, fetid, turd.
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Mar 04, 2005 10:40:55 AM CST
rectalscan, Ottman didn't do the music for Xmen. That would be
by minderbinder
And here's the quote from harry's xmen review that you didn't quite remember: "The only gripes that anyone can legitimately make, in my opinion, is that Michael Kamen
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Mar 04, 2005 10:51:39 AM CST
Ottman is one of the most talented young composers working today
by osmosis jones
The Usual Suspects, Incognito, The Cable Guy, Apt Pupil, Goodbye Lover, X2... Yeah, he tends to utilize more atmopheric material as opposed to "hummable" themes, but X2 proved that he can write kick-ass superhero music with the best of them. Of *course* his score won't be a patch on Williams' magnum opus, but would you rather have James Horner? Travor Rabin? Graeme Revell? Ottman's absence from the first X-Men movie was sorely evident, both in scoring and editing, and I hope he never misses working on another one of Bryan Singer's movies again.
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Mar 04, 2005 10:53:23 AM CST
How about the Mysterious Knights of the Oingo Boingo?
by kentucky colonel
I hear they are available, and just look what they did for "Wierd Science". But in all seriousness, how about Tangerine Dream? The score for "Miracle Mile" just totally fucking works, man. IT WORKS! (Never saw "Miracle Mile", eh fanboy? Look it up on IMDB then go check it out. You can thank me later.)
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Mar 04, 2005 11:00:49 AM CST
"Miracle Mile" is one letter removed from "Miracle Mule"
by kentucky colonel
It just occoured to me that one of my favorite late-80's Mare Winningham-starring Apocolyptic Romantic Comedy Tangerine Dream-scored movies is just one letter away from my favorite album that was released last year, that being "Miracle Mule" by the subdudes. The subdudes are from New Orleans by way of Ft. Collins, CO and have been my favorite band (and good friends) since 1992. If you like it N'awlins style, and even if you don't, this is a band you should really check out. It's so damned catchy, their music, it'll make you wanna dance, drink some beers, tell your Momma you love her, go to church, Stay up Late and Wake the Neighbors with your Booty-Shakin' posse, and after all that pray to the Lord for Redemption (cause the Lord is all about Redemption). I'm sure they wouldn't mind if you downloaded one or two of their songs...as long as you go buy a record or two after you sample their Bourbon Street Boullibase (you will). So go ahead, do it. Miracle Mule, by the subdudes. Then dig on Miracle Mile, with Mare Winningham...she never looked cuter!!!
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Mar 04, 2005 11:10:21 AM CST
I think this SUPERMAN film is looking more lightweight by the da
by spacesheik
I mean Hugh Laurie, Kate Bosworth...John Ottman...Kevin shot in Australia and not the NY streets...Cmon...
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John Williams was aware of the Superman Theme from the Fleischer cartoon series and its effect on the character's mythos among fans old enough to remember. He deliberately paraphrased it in his own score for Superman. What we today know as the great Williams theme is an echo of what came before.
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Mar 04, 2005 12:20:44 PM CST
Does the music belong to the movie or does the music belong to t
by village idiot
Does the James Bond theme belong to Sean Connery, or does it belong to the character? Does the William Tell Overture belong to the Lone Ranger Radio Show, or does it belong to the Lone Ranger. William's theme to Superman has been the most effective musical expression of the character to-date; what's come after have only been lukewarm imitations (e.g., the theme to THE ANIMATED SERIES, LOIS AND CLARK). Let's quit imitating, and just go with what's quintessential. I can understand the filmmaker's concern that Williams' theme might be too associative, but I think when the audience hears the music, they won't be thinking of Donner's film, they'll simply be thinking of Superman.
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I just hope that Bryan Singer is a fan of the climactic battle at the end of Matrix: Revolutions. Sure it was a crappy flm overall, but that fight at the end was the best superhero battle EVER in a film. I hope that Superman contains similar action.
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The best superhero fight has been and probably always be Superman versus General Zoa and his cronies. It starts with "SON OF JOR-EL, KNEEL BEFORE ME!" and ends with "You've won!" "I always win." Anyways, my two cents - Ottman should do a lot more than just homage Williams' score, he should bring Williams in and work with him on this first film to evolve the score from the old films toward wherever Ottman wants to bring it for sequels.
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...a mistake to bring over Williams' score whole hog to the new picture. An homage woven carefully into a new score would be more than enough of a nod and wouldn't run the risk of immediately comparing this new Superman to the old one. It's a different movie. It's a different look at Superman from different creatives who happen to not want to completely shit on all that's come before them. Good for them. But they certainly don't have to be completely beholden to the Donner/Reeves vision of (or musical associations with) the character. If they were, wouldn't this just be another lame remake?
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Now that he's won the Woody for Best Musical Score in an adult film (Family Guy anyone?)...but anyway, I agree that the battles should be akin to the Super Brawl from Matrix: Revolutions (which remains the only Matrix film I saw in the theater and I think it's kickass and just slightly less so than the first Matrix), because, c'mon, that WAS Superman-just in shades and a black robe. The problem with Red Sun is that it doesn't reinvigorate the franchise, but merely continues it which frankly, insults the memory of Christopher Reeves and will do so to a much more drastic extent if the movie blows. Along with the fact that Brandon Routh so far looks like a cheaper version of Josh Hartnett, whom would've really destroyed the Superman franchise. Also, Bryan Singer SHOULD HAVE STAYED ON X-MEN! He set up what would obviously birth a sequel then he ditches it for a movie that will bring in more money. What. An. Asshole. God, this week's been rough.
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Red Sun is like the codename for Superman Returns. Just makin sure...
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www.supermancinema.co.uk
I will be disappointed if too much of Williams score ends up in the film. I'm not sure about Ottman; I'd rather go with Don Davies. -
Nuff said.
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...'cause that is probably the stupidest thing I have ever seen in a movie, and really killed my suspension of disbelief in what otherwise was a damn fine film... I mean, I can go along with the assumption that this extraterrestrial being exists, that he has super powers, even that nobody can tell that Clark Kent is Supes in disguise, but even accepting all of that silliness, even as a child I couldn't bring to accept the absurdity of the time-reversal thing... I mean, the rocks fell UP for Christ's sake; did he also reverse the pull of gravity??!!?? Sorry, I guess I've been holding that in for years... I feel better now. Pan out.
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Mar 04, 2005 7:44:35 PM CST
Ottman's "atmospheric" music might be right for some projects, b
by frankdrebin
There's a reason Williams is the most Oscar-nominated person alive or dead. For Star Wars (all Talkbacks must debate Star Wars) Lucas knew there would be fanboy-hell-to-pay if he changed composers.
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nothing about ottman's work has terribly impressed me. Great editor, not so much with the music. Bring back Williams, I say. If it ain't broke, dont fix it!
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Mar 05, 2005 2:26:52 AM CST
The God who walks amongst Men (as Donner called him) was not Sup
by monkey_king
Let's see that super boy scout take on this rod wielding simian and I'll send his ass packing to wherever he was until he recently returned from God knows where. Heh heh.
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Yeah, that was the most lame part about the first Superman. Plus Lex Luthor with hair and his bumbling fool henchman...it was too campy and retarded. I was 11 when this came out and even then, I was kinda disappointed.
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Mar 05, 2005 4:45:04 PM CST
Dear Lord - you mean, John Williams is NOT doing the score?! Wha
by ted striker
Seriously. Have John Williams do it.
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Mar 06, 2005 9:40:16 AM CST
No film composer has ever re-worked Williams music successfully.
by theginger twit
blaa
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JOHN WILLIAM RULES THE WORLD. You numbnut lamebrains who keep talking about Williams 'ripping' old material obviously know nothing of music. Superman theme from Holst? Hilarious. Composing is not creating a string of identifiable melodies, though Williams does that better than any living film composer. Composing is about the art of understanding the orchestra, understanding the balance of emotion and tension on the screen and translating that into an arrangement made up of so many violins and so many flutes and so many french horns. THAT'S MUSIC.
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If they really loved the original music so much, why not just hire Williams?
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Mar 07, 2005 7:02:27 PM CST
"No film composer has ever re-worked Williams music successfully
by minderbinder
JP3 was pretty decent (Don Davis), and I actually liked HP2 better than the first (although Williams did some of the work on it). And Williams absolutely borrows from old music, there's no debating it. If you way otherwise, you've obviously never listened to much classical music. Go put on Death and Transfiguration, you'll hear the "can you read my mind" theme clear as day.
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