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Quint loves TROY! Read the quicky here!!!
Ahoy, squirts. Quint here... I saw TROY a couple days ago and I want to tell you folks about it. I have to be brief because I have a SHREK 2 screening in 7 hours and a bajillion stories to post, so since I am a mortal fool that needs sleep I'll have to be quick in my praising of the film.
Yep, all the mixed and negative reviews that I posted from all those college screenings had me worried, but after seeing the movie I have to wonder what crack those kids are smoking... or rather, what movie were they expecting? Because the movie I saw on Monday night kicked my ass... HARD.
Brad Pitt, who shouldered most of the criticism in the earlier reviews, dominates the film, playing the glory-seeking warrior Achilles. Fair warning, he's not playing Tyler Durden. I think that may have been a factor in some of the college kids's opinions of him in this movie because I frankly don't understand any of the criticisms leveled against the man's performance. He exudes charisma, his emotions aren't forced, but natural and easy. He's in control, he's badass and his accent never stuck out to me. That's quite a bit nitpicky in the first place, don't you think? Why was Pitt's non-accent a problem and Brian Cox's accent not? Shouldn't they all be speaking Greek anyway?
This film is huge, epic and perfectly cast. Perfectly. Orlando Bloom's Paris is a weak character, always dependant on his older brother, Hector (Eric Bana in yet another great performance), to be strong for him. He's also a bit blind to reality. He's young. Bloom plays him exactly as he should be played, which, unfortunately, makes him a character that's hard to like, but that shouldn't take away from what he did to make the character work. Although, I will say... expect a hint of Legolas toward the end of the movie... It took me out of the film a bit to see him wielding a bow and arrow, but damn if I didn't enjoy it.
Sean Bean is great as Odysseus. Pitt owns as Achilles, Brian Cox lives up to character actor god status in this film. He's brutal... a real guy you love to hate. Peter O'Toole... It's so great to see him on screen in a big way again...
Matter of fact, there is one scene in this film that grabbed me like nothing else I've seen in theaters this year. You'll know it when you see it... It's when Peter O'Toole meets with Brad Pitt and it's an amazing scene. I would go into it, but it gives away quite a bit and I'd rather you see the scene yourself, feel the emotion... experience the complete hollowing out of a character. It's a scene that will go down as one of the great scenes in cinema history... at least in my book.
So, the movie rules. Trust me. The effects are great, the acting is great, the male strutting is great, the cast is great, the score is great (for the most part... Harry and the gang went out to eat after the movie and we all talked about how ridiculous the "post Trojan Horse" music was... this kind of yodeling almost Arabic sounding woman screeching a solo... not to mention a terrible, terrible end credits song).
The only negative thing I can think to say about the actual film is there are some reaction shots that don't quite work peppered here and there, but if that's the only negative thing I can say about the movie then... well, shit. I guess it's a failure then, right?
At the end of the day, this movie kicked my ass. There's some space between this film and Homer's work, but my girlfriend is as rabid about that kind of stuff as you can get and she loved the movie just as much as I did. They play with it in a very interesting way, especially with Achilles. The way they show how the myth of Achilles passes on past the events of this movie is actually really subtle and well handled.
Anyway, I better go off and do some posts and get to sleep so I can be somewhat awake during SHREK 2 tomorrow. I highly recommend this film. It's as big and entertaining as you'd hope it'd be, but with a lot more character, soul and subtly than you might expect.
-Quint
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May 13, 2004 4:55:01 AM CDT
If my girlfriend tells me one more time how cute Pitt looks in t
by happy harry
Hey! Nothing wrong with get Brad Pitt-directed sexual satisfaction! I do the same thing with her, only I'm imagining Marge Simpson. Go Braves!
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But..hey..its better the air force one!
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Had a feeling all the negative buzz on this was bullshit. You cant put a great cast like that together and not come away with a decent movie.Also Pitt is a great actor. Thats my two cents!!!!!!!!!Slainte
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May 13, 2004 5:10:43 AM CDT
Hey! It should be scored with Heavy Metal and great screaming vo
by darthzed
So less than 36 hours for me to see it.And i am only in chapter 10 of "The song of Troy"And I have 23 chapters to conclude .But for me the songs "Achilles, Agony and Ecstasy" of MANOWAR and "And there was silence" of BLIND GUARDIAN will be the forever the soundtrack of TROY.
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And another pointless point; THIS MOVIE BLEEDS GAYNESS! GAY GAY GAY!! You'll be as gay as a pink marshmellow bunny by the end of this flick, I warn you. Helen better get that ass tapped, waxed and driven into the drywall just to balance out the gayness.
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I saw a screening earlier this evening and my two biggest complaints are the score and Brad Pitt's acting. The score didn't fit the scenes in a lot of places and it just BLARES at you (and as Quint mentioned the end song sucks). Pitt's acting - normally I like Pitt, I didn't have a problem with his accent, but his mannerisms bothered me. Just subtle things that seemed modern to me and reminded me that I was watching Brad Pitt, rather than Achilles. The rest of the cast is great. The big fight scenes didn't really do much for me, but the small one-on-one fight scenes are fantastic, great FX for the sword shimmer sound. 3 out of 5.
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I'll find out this week.
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May 13, 2004 6:57:21 AM CDT
One of the problems I have with modern American society is...
by fluffyunbound
...that description of the meeting between Priam and Achilles, in a movie called 'The Iliad', could be considered a spoiler. Unless they have totally changed this scene beyond recognition, or created an entirely different meeting - but that would just be ANOTHER one of the major problems I have with modern American society. I am just a real bitch about things nowadays I guess.
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As far as performance, it's nice to name Pitt and O'Toole, but why is Eric Bana left out? He truly is the best thing of this movie?
And in my oponion, even though he plays a "wimpy" younger brother, Bloom just is not right in this movie, he's too smooth, even for the role he's playing -
ok...so you did mention Bana... but you didn't stretch nearly enough hwo he is the best actor in this movie...
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May 13, 2004 7:11:56 AM CDT
Go read War Music for a really cinematic interpretation of the I
by dannyocean01
Christopher Logue owns in a BIG way.
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Eric is my hero. Not only is he a great comedian but as is made obvious from his performance in both Troy and Chopper a brilliant actor also.
POITER!!!
-Futureman -
I was surprised to read such bad reviews especially about brad pitt in this film.
His character is great and i had no difficulty to believe he was that perfect warrior no one can stop(the same cannot be said for Tom Cruise parts in his action movies but i disgress).
The character of achilles is a great protagonist for such a big summer movie,nor hero or villain .
The rest of the cast gives great performances Eric Bana stands out as the warrior bound by honor,brendan gleeson is a great brutish Menelas (i wouldn't want to fight him either).
The film has flaws ,i find curious that everybody in Troy welcomes Helen so warmingly knowing that she will bring war to them.Petersen cannot handle big battle of thousands but manage to give us great one on one battles (Hector Vs Ajax and Hector vs Achilles being my two faves).
In all not a revolutionnary masterpiece but a great hollywood blockbuster who delivers . -
the real truth comes out. Going to Midnight tonight and I am absolutely extatic. I'll wager hands down that it will be up for Best Pitcure next year.
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And he don
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I like Brad Pitt (as an actor), but his performance in this movie is horrible.
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Just a few courageous lines on this talk back and you will have made your mark in history.Immortality is yours...take it! Post now!
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May 13, 2004 5:45:59 PM CDT
What the hell does a Greek accent sound like, anyway? The villa
by stormin
I mean, if that's what Greek people actually sound like then sure, use all the British accents you fucking want.
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May 13, 2004 5:56:04 PM CDT
The only way the Marvel Superheroes can stop Harry's evil is wit
by grabthars_hammer
Anyone else remember these ads in comic books in the 70's?
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this whole movie should be scored with iron maiden's "run to the hills"...maybe they could have brought in a composer to do a swelling symphonic version too
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Who wouldn't want to tap that ass? I'm not mad at Paris, look at her...CHEERS Amigos!
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For the love of God avoid this film! It was the worst thing I'd seen since Episode II, and for the same reason (minus the video game graphics)! Please, avoid encouraging Hollywood in making more films like Troy!
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May 13, 2004 7:10:53 PM CDT
i just listened to gabriel yared's rejected score and it kicked
by mcluvin
seriously...it's a great score
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A great-looking guy, charmer on the talk shows. Seems to have a pleasant wife. But doesn't it seem like ten years into his star career, he really hasn't clicked? Good enough actor, with some fine films, to be sure (Fight Club), but not a whole lot of blockbusters. At least not without plenty of help (see: Ocean's 11/12.) I suppose not being Tom Cruise isn't THAT bad a deal, but it just seems to me that Pitt's never really hit the heights. And if this movie does it for him, who's to say it isn't Bana, or Bloom, or Peter O'Friggin' Toole, or the hot chicks, or the battle scenes, or maybe just a great big ol' epic that makes it a hit? Anyway. I'm just saying.
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My memory might be a bit out on this, but I recall that Achilles was told he could either have a long, happy anonymous life if he stayed out of trouble or a short, glorious one with assured immortality if he got involved with 'fightin' and stuff'. So his mother - Thetis? - disguised him as a young maiden and placed him in a friend's palace/court thing. Anyhow, that is where he was found. By Odysseus I think, who displayed to all of the maidens a host of weaponry. Achilles was the only one who showed an interest in them. Viola! The implication being that he fitted in quite well with the women, and was, therefore, quite the pretty chap.
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I mean no offense, here, but, what good does it really do to tell Americans what's wrong with our society, if you don't think we're smart enough to figure things out on our own? I make no defense for our society, because, it's mostly fucked. But, isn't that as useful as going up to a guy with Down Syndrome and telling him he's mentally retarded?
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My observation was offered for its conversational value alone. It was not meant to be a constructive criticism, because the time for constructive criticism has passed. I have no solutions to offer.
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People will realize how dull and pretentious this bastardized movie is tomorrow. Cox, Bean, and O'Toole are the only saviours.
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Being an Aussie I only liked his performance in Chopper and the Hulk. So I'm interested in seeing him, or any Aussie, in a Hollywood production. Hopefully he can put the lame-ass Full Frontal comedy shite behind him, I know that's his roots, but damn, that show was NOT funny!
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...on the train on the way into work I was listening to some cute uni student attempting to describe why she didn't like "Troy" to one of her friends. I listened rather eagerly, as I'd been trying to figure out what it was about the film that made me not enjoy it in the same way as I enjoyed "Van Helsing" last week.
I think it comes down to the fact that there are too many "good" characters vying for your sympathy--and the actors pull this off to such an extent that you feel a bit upset when they all start dying. I thought that the acting was all good (yes, even Orlando--I think he played the character with all the "real-world naivete" I'd expect from Paris), as Quint has stated, but I really think that they should have tried to make the accents consistent--get them all to speak as neutrally as possible or with a British or American accent. There was more than one occasion where I heard Eric Bana slipping into "'stryne" mode and I found that jarring when compared with the more movie accents we're accustomed to hearing. But I definitely think the script was the biggest let-down... there were some very hokey lines which just never should have made it into the final draft. I did like the way they handled the whole "gods" things, and the death of Achilles, as opposed to something like "Clash Of The Titans" or [insert sword-and-sandal-epic-here]--seemed to make the movie more historical than fantastical. But in summary, I can only give this three stars, because I came out feeling saddened that all my favourite characters had been killed--and this I think was because of a lack of focus as to the story line. It worked in a film like "Saving Private Ryan" but it doesn't here. This tack may have worked even in a more focussed movie about the futility of war etc etc, but in a coookie-cutter Hollywood epic, this just confuses audiences. -
Okay Goddamnit!!!!! That was just the most heart attack inducing game of basketball I've ever experienced. That ending was just uncool. How in the FUCK does that happen? Three game winning shots in under 10 seconds????
I'm going to go break something. I don't think it will make me feel better though.
One more thing - how do the Spurs allow this to happen on their home floor? That's just fucking ridiculous to get down by 16 points on your home floor (in an absolutely pivotal game after losing two straight) before you turn up the heat. Just sad. In a way, I'm glad they lost, perhaps they'll be better for it next year when they ruin the entire league. -
I don't know if Led Zeppelin's "Achillies Last Stand" would work in here but I think this movie does need some major 80's metal. Like Iron Maiden and the like. I just hope the movie has a scene where Brian Cox bites a bar of soap and spits it out at Eric Bana.
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Thanks for the link, I haven't seen TROY yet, but this rejected music sounds FANTASTIC. Maybe for the DVD they can put both scores on different audio tracks or different versions of the movie ala the LEGEND DVD. Seems a waste to create the entire score and to just let it disappear into the ether.
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May 14, 2004 2:11:47 AM CDT
Uh, well, after looking at Rottentomatoes, I think it might be y
by pvaughn
I am not convinced by your review, Quint. Most of the "positive" reviews on Rottentomatoes seem only slightly positive. And, as it is now, Troy has only received around 56% positive reviews. These reviews reflect the opinions of both mainstream and little-known critics. Since I'm fairly indifferent about seeing Troy, I'm going to wait until Rotten Tomatoes posts at least 40 more reviews to make a judgement call. I might watch it if it reaches the 75% mark. Otherwise, I'm waiting for DVD. Sorry, Quint, money is too scarce these days to see Troy based on your recommendation alone. You shouldn't expect moviegoers to ditch reason and say "Since QUINT liked it, It's GOTTA BE GOOD!Especially since I, and I'm sure several others, don't always agree with you.
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caid mile failte.
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It's spelled, "Praetorian". Movies aren't everything.
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This is just a theory, but maybe Braddy doesn't want to be Tom cruise because of the Scientologist conspiracy that he would eventually have to denounce. Because all scientologists are crazy motherfuckers.
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freddieshoop stated that they should all be swarthy and dark haired. I grew up with a lot of greeks and a few of them are blonde (naturally too). The Greeks of 4000 year ago were also considerably fairer than now since the darkening partly comes from subsequent conquests from eastern powers. I have no problem with Pitt as Achillies. Saw the film and Peter O'Toole may well have finally secured the Oscar, would they be so cruel as to nominate him an 8th time and then not give it to him?
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The Ionian and Dorian tribes that invaded Greece and set off their Dark Age came from the Danube valley and were closely related to the tribes that ended up becoming the Celts. These tribesmen conquered and enslaved the native Pelasgians and became the ruling warrior elite, the exploits of which are celebrated in the Iliad. The text talks about Agamemnon being a Mycenaean, but that is mainly due to the folk memory of Mycenae being a great kingdom - the arms, values, gods, and social structure of the characters in the Iliad make it clear that Homer was trying to poetically describe warrior-kings from Greece's Dark Age. That means that there is a good chance [it is not certain, but there is a good chance] the Achilles and Agamemnon looked a lot like Englishmen, albeit with a different fashion sense. It is also possible that they were dark, but it is not an absolute in the sense that you are claiming it is, and the current appearance of Greeks does not bring anything to bear.
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The question of who Homer was "really" describing is in dispute. Many scholars believe that some elements of the Iliad make it appear that Homer had at least some inkling of what life was like in Mycenaean times as well. So Achilles may have looked like a figure from a Thera frescoe, and Agamemnon may have looked like, well, the Mask of Agamemnon. And the story of the Trojan war itself may be based on events in the Aegean during the very upheavals that caused the Dark Age, which means that the participants would have been a mixture of both tribal groups. So it's hard to say definitively.
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I'm so tired of reading lameass comments and reviews from society's lowest common denominator known as teenage boys with no life. I'm looking forward to seeing TROY.
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TROY kicks ass. Maybe it's the insomnia talking (I'm on no sleep), but I saw a matinee of TROY, and it was just great. Yeah, Pitt's pseudo-Brit thespian accent isn't the greatest, but his acting is perfectly adequate for the role. Another point: I believe that what Peterson is trying to portray is a realistic version of the events that inspired Homer, not Homer's work itself. He is not portraying the myth, but the real events that the myth were based on. I think Ebert's review faults the movie for portraying the characters as psycholically nuanced, conflicted, ie REAL. He says that moives about myths are btter when the characters are iconic, not realistic. I think that misses a key aspect of the movie: it is not about a myth, but strives to realistically portray the story that the myths are based upon. I think it succeeds quite well. The combat is great in this movie. The characters seem psychologically real; they do not play as icons but as extraordinary people. Their motivations make sense, and this gives all of the conflict and the battles their emotional weight. Anyway, I'm tired as heck, so I'll quit now and reiterate: QUINT IS RIGHT! If you are a genre geek, I think you will miss out if you do not see this film on a big screen. It kicks serious ass.
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Good epic flick. Delivers in all the ways the LOTR trilogy could not. Peter Jackson take note: this is what good sword fights look like, this is how you bring the goods on the money shot moments.
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Quint,s review was right on target. Loved the whole thing, with the exception of the whining/screeching arabic background vocals. Brad totally owns this role now.
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May 14, 2004 6:33:12 PM CDT
NEW RULE: People who cite rottentomatoes to bolster their argume
by bill maher
You guys prove that it's not just four-legged animals who chew the cud. So fuck you.
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Not just here, everywhere. I mean, she IS Helen of Troy, and from what I remember of the story she was kind of important. What's the deal?
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May 14, 2004 9:02:05 PM CDT
That should teach motherfuckers to not celebrate until it's over
by super cucaracha
Did you see Bruce Bowen's face?
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I really enjoy my life when Tony Parker is myserable!!!
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May 14, 2004 9:15:24 PM CDT
Hey, Bill M., Maybe People Refer To Rottentomatoes because they
by pvaughn
Besides, since when has INSULTING people been a good way to BOLSTER a point of view? Don't look for me to retaliate by cussing back, Bill M. That's for people like you. Some people read a lot of press and critical reception on movies before they watch them because they are not sure the genre or theme of the film in question is something they are interested in. Like, perhaps, Kill Bill. Some people may choose to read a lot about it before going to see it. Good critical reception doesn't guarantee a film will be good for any particular viewer, that's, of course, all a matter of taste.
Finally, I never said that I would necessarily agree with ANY of the critics in Rottentomatoes, I was only using the ratings and percentages as a means for increasing a very LOW interest level in Troy. I really don't think a Hollywoodized epic version of an epic poem is my style. I studied world literature in college and have my own perception of these ancient texts. If critical reception was indeed far stronger than it has been, my interest level would probably have risen. But, it has not and I will not. And no amount of middle school bully language is going to prompt me to "think for myself" on the matter when the movie doesn't interest me in the least. -
.04 and S W I S H...HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA and of course motherfuckers protest...SORE LOSERS! When Duncan hit that incredible shot, us Angelinos were like "FUCK, I can't beleive he made it" but we were never screaming foul. Fisher makes his shot and what do you know?! Some Spurs protest.
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Not a "Van Helsing" suck job, but a pedestrian and boring middle-ofthe-road job. I'd much prefer a total suck film than one that is so plainly average -- at least I could heckle "Van Helsing," all I can do while watching "Troy" is snooze. The people who let Wolfgang and Benioff near these characters deserve to die a boring death.
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Just saw Troy this afternoon. Great role for Eric Bana, his best since Blackhawk Down. Brad Pitt wasn't terrible in the role like I thought he'd be. I dug the film, however my only gripe is this: the viewer was given no indication that the siege lasted 10 years - or did the filmmakers decide to ignore this? If you just watched the movie, you'd think that the entire siege lasted a month.
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and I was happy with how unfolded. If you are going into it, hoping for a literal translation of the Poem, than you're in the wrong movie. But who cares. The movie was really good, not great mind you, but really good. I would give it a B+, there are a few things that keep it from achieving an A status (i.e. God-awful score). Let me quickly touch on that. The score would have been fine for other movies, but it just did not fit in Troy. It seemed like he combined to many different types of themes and threw them all together. Don't get me wrong I love James Horner and I think he is one of the best composer's ever, but I know great scores and this one is not even close. One thing about the movie that surprised me was the fact that it wasn't as serious as I thought it would be. Every charchter pulled his or her weight in the movie and for that Peterson should be applauded.
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She's supposed to be "The Face That Launched A Thousand Ships"?
She looks like Julia Stiles, who got punched in the face with Leelee Sobieski. Totally banal. Totally forgettable. -
I was reading a review today from the AP and it told the ending of the Pitt/Bana fight. Why???? No spoiler warning or anything... just the results of a critical moment of the film.
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The ancient Greeks were Mediterranean, not barbarian-looking. They had mostly brown hair and eyes. They did not look like the cast of this movie. The Greeks made fun of blond barbarians thinking that they were strong but dim-witted; they'd have a riot with this movie with all these Germans and Englishmen pretending to be Greeks.
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Achilles, looks Greek not barbarian:
http://people.hofstra.edu/faculty/martha_hollander/GalleryPictures/FullSizedImages/Roman/PompeiiAchillesScyros.jpg
http://www.calliope.free-online.co.uk/achilles/achil13.jpg
http://www.theoi.com/image/K15.3Kheiron.gif
http://www.bryanpratt.com/achilles.jpg
Menelaos and Helen reunited (450BC), look Greek not barbarian:
http://www.calliope.free-online.co.uk/troy/troy25.jpg
Helen and Aphrodite, they don't look too barbarian to me:
http://www.beloit.edu/~classics/Trojan%20War%20Site/Helen%20and%20Paris/Helen_and_Aphrodite_Nemesis(Red_Figure_c.400).jpg -
These are real Greek women, not skinny blondes with barbarian-type appearance.
http://editorial.gettyimages.com/source/CFW/imageResults.aspx?s=ImagesSearchState|0|15|0|1|||0|0|0|0|2|olympia+priestess&p=2
This is enough for now... -
Just came back from seeing Troy. It was horrible. The destroyed the entire mythology just to keep the women wetting their pants keeping Orlando Bloom alive and showing Brad almost naked all the time. One or two good fights but I liked them better in Gladiator. This movie should have looked at LOTR on how to make good movies based off written material. This movie is garbage and I hope next week Shrek 2 will destroy this movie at the box office. If you haven't already save your money and don't see Troy and just watch Gladiator or something and don't waste the brain cells on this movie made for females. If anyone who even slightly knows mythology sees this film, your brain will hurt when you leave the theatre I promise
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Saw Troy opening night and absolutely loved ever minute of it. In fact, I was so busy enjoying one of the greatest tales ever brought to the big screens that I didnt even hear the score that all you whiners are complaining about, nothing that stuck out as aweful anyways. Brad Pitt owned the role of Achilles, actually I thought all the actors did an amazing job. Diane Kruger is a golden goddess and definitely worth launch a thousand ships over. I do wish that Ajax would have had a bigger role in the film, if they had made him out to be the true baddass that he was it would have meant even more when Hector defeated him. On the whole an amazing flick, definitely one for my all time favorite list, much better than Van Helsing, which I enjoyed for all its special effects. For the record, Special effects are awesome, and people who complain about them being "unrealistic" shouldnt be allowed to watch movies.
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Spend the money you would save by not seeing this movie, and instead buy a good translation of The Iliad and the Oddessey. Here's the clientele seeing this movie. This is a DIRECT QUOTE from the idiot behind me after the movie.
"Dude, you know there is gonna be a sequel. Achilles' girlfriend is pregnant, and Hector had a son who got away.' Yes. I swear to God, George the VIIth Chicken, and Stan Lee. America, I weep for you, with a population of uneducated fools for citizens. ARRRRGGHHH!!! -
...yeah the reason she's not getting any ink in "Troy" reviews is because she just isn't noteworthy. None of the female character/performances are very special. Hector should have taken one look at Kruger down in the warship galley-mabob and said, "That piece of ass, Paris? We're going to war for that piece of ass? You better toss me over some of her groin-work if I'm risking my neck for that shit."
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It is well known that the Greeks and Romans had blond German slaves, so they were probably even more Mediterranean-looking in the past. They did not have a northern barbarian type of appearance. Unfortunately the northern Italians mixed with Lombards and Celts and lost their Mediterranean-type appearance.
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People do seem to be split down the middle about this movie, they either love it or hate it.
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It's a spoiler if you're someone who hasn't read the Illiad. There are actually people that haven't or who did so 30 years ago in high school and have forgotten most of it. I have a copy sitting here now and it didn't spoil it for me... but it did for a lot of others.
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The deaths the film messed up: Paris (who didn't and was supposed to), Achilles - should have died in battle before the Trojan Horse, Ajax - actually outlived Achilles, but died right away in this one, Agammemnon - who died back in Greece - not in Troy, Menalais (sp?) - who never died and actually reconciled with Helen. Additionally, Achilles' concubine was taken by Agammemnon after he gave his back - and he never gave her up. Also, the kid was never Achilles' cousin - his friend and quite possibly his lover - but not his cousin. Basically they took massive liberties and changed almost every major plot point in the story. As a stand alone film, I dug the movie, but if you're going to base a story off the Iliad, minus the gods/goddesses, then get the rest of the shit right.
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May 15, 2004 11:49:51 AM CDT
NEW RULE: TROY shows once and for all how completely faggy and l
by bill maher
That's not surprising when you consider that the Iliad is one of the greatest stories ever while Bored of the Rings is just plagiarized from Wagner's "Ring" and King Arthur. =-=-=-=-=- Frododies is right about the ethnic makeup of the ancient world. I can't help but laugh when people say Jesus should look Iranian. Well thousands of years ago, the original Iranians, like their Aryan cousins who invaded India (and the Tocharians who moved into China) were white! That's why the Iranians and the Aryans invented caste systems to prevent their "whiteness" from being "diluted" by copluating with the Elamites or Dravidians. King Darius is described by contemporaries as having red hair and blue-grey eyes. Now let's say some filmmaker decides to do a movie about Darius' rise to the throne or based on Gore Vidal's book "Creation". They cast a redhead as Darius. Ignorant assholes will start squealing "But Iranians aren't white, this is racist!" People who think they know everything annoy the shit out of those of us who do.
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May 15, 2004 12:05:30 PM CDT
NEW RULE: For OrionsAngels information, you can't hear the music
by bill maher
And most movie music sucks. James Horner especially. He has four notes and that's it. I don't think John Williams or Jerry Goldsmith could write bad music if they tried. You'll notice in Star Wars, they turn the sound effects down for the really important musical cues. The only sountrack I've bought in the last ten years (aside from re-issues of old ones) is Portrait of a Lady by Woijchiech(sp?) Kilar. Although I can hum the Harry Potter theme in spite of the fact that I've never seen the movie. Loud movies + lame music = scores that leave no mark.
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Troy was just awful, like there was 2 really good fight scenes in it and that is it. The rest of the movie was terrible. It's like the were making the movie and then half way trough they like forgot how to make a movie or something. This movie just prooves that this summer is just going to be sad
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Once in Star Trek II was ok, a second time in Aliens was pushing it, but drudging up the same theme a third time is plain unforgivable! As for the film not sticking to mythology...Then I'd say alot you of are going to have a major problem with King Arthur when it comes out. Historically inaccurate? You must not have cred much for Gladiator then. Bad F/X? You know there's always going to be some jerk who thinks EVERY movie has shitty f/x...LOTR, SW, Hulk erc. SOMEBODY on any TB wil say the CG sux, it's just inevitable. Thought Brad Pitt was terrible? You must not like him in any of his films. Boring? You must have a very short attention span. Troy was loaded with action. When it wasn't, it had wonderful charactor development. I actually cared about these people. Gladiator had way less action, and I didn't give damn about Russel Crow's family getting slaughtered. The music was good too, up until about half way through, when I began hearing the same themes repeated for the fifth time. This was awesome.
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May 15, 2004 4:56:05 PM CDT
Excuse me. What I meant was, duhduhduhduuuh-DUH!! duhduhduhduuuh
by wonkabar
This movie STILL rocked
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May 15, 2004 7:04:48 PM CDT
The Trojan war happened because of the ABDUCTION of Helen
by markoseugenikos
Paris was a scoundrel who ABDUCTED Helen. Odysseus and Menelaos went to Troy before the invasion and asked King Priam: "Give her back and we won't attack". The Trojans said "No". So, the Achaeans sacked Troy and Menelaos got his wife back and they lived happily ever after in Sparta (read the Odyssey) with their daughter Hermione.
Petersen and the other barbarians involved in this film have made this a story about the bad Greeks and the good Trojans. It makes sense that Petersen would support the barbarians, actually, since he's one himself. -
Protest - Cucaracha, yes the Spurs did protest, but they remain the classiest team in the league. Make no mistake, the Lakers are the biggest whiners in Basketball because of Phil Jackson and Derek Fisher. Other than Vlade, Fisher is the biggest flopper in the game today. And he is CONSTANTLY bitching about either being fouled or fouls that are called on him. When Phil's teams don't win, Jackson complains about the officiating. Now just now and then, every damn time he loses a game in the playoffs. It's sad. While we're on the subject of Jackson, he might be good at dealing with personalities, but I think his success has much more to do with the players he's lucky enough to have coached. The whole thing with Gary Payton was stupid. Good coaches coach to the strengths of their players. When idiot Jackson finally abandoned the triangle to take advantage of Payton's game and the pick and roll, the Lakers dominated. Phil Jackson: good with heads, bad with X's and O's.
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Thanks SO MUCH to those who posted the link to what we might have had. I absolutely can't believe that this fascinating, emotionally complex music - enthusiastically approved by the director - was rejected in favor of Horner. Oh, please, is there no way of re-inserting it, at least on the DVD? So many reviews have mentioned the Horner score as a weakness. As for the film, I've read the Iliad in two translations, and wish it could have stuck more closely to Homer, even without the gods, but even with all the changes and some silly bits, there was a lot to admire: the art design, the fight choreography, some fine performances, some genuinely moving scenes (mostly involving the Trojans). I don't know how much control the director had over the script, but it does seem odd to me that the man responsible for "Das Boot" shied away from (or was made to shy away from) the ultimate horror of what happens to the women and children of the losers. Yes, Hector alluded to their fate, but when it came to it, the film gave us the sanitized ending of a romance novel. Not to mention that awful song! (Again, listen to Yared's far superior End Credits music.)
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May 16, 2004 8:36:57 AM CDT
I thought Apes were going to show up when I heard the music for
by boris the blade
Other than that, I thought it was a good romp. Oh, that and Brad Pitt looks like he's doing an ad for Tan N' Go for most of the flick...
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Just a question, if Pitt's mannerisms bothered you as being too modern - then what were ancient mannerisms like? Who's to say that ancient mannerisms and personalities weren't just like they were today - well, except for the fact that kids back then would have gotten their asses whooped for wearing their pants around their ankles like all the dumbass hip-hop wannabes I see walking around drinking Frappucinos.
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Absolutely horrible dialogue. The first half is pretty bad, but the battle scenes make up for it. The acting is ok, but the script is messy and characters are forced to change their personalities on the fly to fit the plot.
Pitt is ok but Achilles is not well written. Eric Bana was great as Hector, he was believable and the only heroic character in the flick. Bloom needed to die very early on. He was annoying. Helen is pretty, but comnpletely disposable to the plot. She dissapears for long chunks of the movie.
"Troy" is too long but the battle between Achilles and Hector and the initial attack on the city are worth seeing.
Go to a matinee, don't pay full price unless you are a big fan of Aaron Spelling like dialogue. -
Eric Bana's Hector. Loved him.
Oh, and I guess the second only good thing about this movie was the Hector/Achillies fight. No Diane Krueger tits? sigh...this movie sucked. See it for Hector, hes a badass. -
Two words: very good!
Comment: Troy was just plain great, the fight scenes were well executed and artistic and there were many fine battles to boot but lets not forget - this film isn't supposed to be purely played for horny geek boys that want their men in skirts fight fix.
The rest of the movie was just as great. It's like they were making the movie and then half way through they like decided to make it even better as if they forgot how to make a modern movie or something. I can't wait for more fine summer movies to hit us. The anticipation is killing me. -
Peter Jackson DON'T take note. Aragorn's sword fights were realistic and well done. Legolas as the only otherwordly character, fires his arrow which they copied the sound effects for Achilles in Troy. Achilles moves like he's half in the Matrix. Good fantastic moves although short sword fighting is different from a 2 handed sword, and Hector vs. Achilles fight took too long;In any case Jackson made the right choices. Just another hack jealous of LOTR's success. LOTR wasn't about one man's swordsmanship skills anyways like Troy seems to be about miscat Pitts of the bottom of mediocre movie quality.
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Can you put more Hollywood cliches in one film? This is definitely a Greek tragedy!
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Can you put more cliches in one movie? This is definitely a Greek tragedy.
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You fucking idiot. This whole subculture that sees the world through LotR-colored glasses is really starting to piss me off. Incidentally, what makes Petersen "jealous?" His use of MASSIVE technology for armies thousands-strong? In a war movie, based on a 3000-year old story, realized from a script written by David Benoiff before the 'Lord of the Rings' movies were even released? Yeah. Airtight logic you've got there, pal. In fact, using your brilliant science, I level that Peter Jackson is a hack who's jealous of Matthew Barney (something I don't believe, but that makes just about as much sense as your asinine comment), but that probably means nothing to you anyway. PJ and his Kiwi Crew created cinema, right?
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May 16, 2004 10:30:31 PM CDT
Ribbons, of course Krylite called Petersen a hack. What would yo
by bill maher
What's happening here is that people are catching on that Bored of the Rings: The Fellowship of NAMBLA isn't all it's cracked up to be. So the fans of that twenty-seven hour epic without a single interesting character are feeling very insecure and have to lash out at superior movies. Compared to the Iliad, LOTR is pure wank. Compared to Troy, the movie version of LOTR is pure wank. Hell, compared to Indiana Jones, Star Wars, Conan, Last of the Mohicans and countless other movies, it's pure wank! What dungeonmasters like Krylite can't stand is that more and more people are starting to put the most overrated movies in history in perspective and starting to realize that not only does the emperor have no clothes, he also has a tiny dick. Like Titanic, LOTR was a fad. Titanic for adolescent girls (and a few sex-starved old yentas with a Mary Kay LeTourneau fixation on the blond guy), LOTR is a fad for big fat fags without even a clue when it comes to personal hygiene. At least My Heart Will Go On was a catchy tune.
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insofar. Wow. This has to be the biggest waste of money I've spent since I bought ribbed condoms. The score above all else was atrocious! The fanfare trumpets and shit just about made me want to scream in agony. This film was like someone dug up Cecile B. DeMille's bones, rehydrated them and stuck Paul Verhoven's brain in the skull. If it were not for the sexy bitches I might have been suspicious this was a well disguised gay porno. Pretty much everyone was wasted on this effort, including O'Toole. I think we may be looking at this film as the top candidate for the Battlefield Earth Award.
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it looked okay. in fact, in parts it looked awesome. but the script was very heavy handed, more melodramatic than the last 45 minutes of RoTK , and some of the lines were delivered like the lead balloons they were. achilles first fight is a ripper though. too bad they didn't take the same approach to the rest of the film.
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>
Dude, you're all over the place. How exactly does Troy make Lord of the Rings look bad? They're two completely different films. I happen to think LOTR is far better, but I do realize there are other opinions. Yours isn't the most intelligent, so I don't respect it that much-maybe I could try if what you had written made one bit of sense.
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Oh, I'm hate american society, oh their uneducated. WELL FUCK YOU! Lets see the rest of the world fucking survive without americas fucking help. Its always US that have to bail you fuckers out. Quit watching american movies and chatting on american websites assholes.
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I thought it was a great film. Admittedly the Iliad is one of those books hich I always meant to read but never got around to it, as a result I'm spared that little voice in my head going "it wasn't like this in the book!".
Pitt's performance was spot on, his distant performance was ideal for Achille's and you are never left with one moment of the film where his power is in question. Bana's performance was filled with understated emotion, one of the most human heroes I have ever seen on film. The scene with O'Toole and Pitt was amazing.
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