Moriarty Goes To The Saturn Awards!!
Hi, everyone. "Moriarty" here with some Rumblings From The Lab...
As long as I’ve lived in Los Angeles, I’ve been aware of, and interested in, the Saturn Awards. How could I not be? They’re the only serious award presentation for genre film and TV aside from the Hugos, and they cover a lot more ground each year, able to recognize work in dozens of categories. Any serious discussion of the Saturns has to begin with an acknowledgement of the work that was done by the late Dr. Donald Reed, the man who spearheaded the transformation of The Count Dracula Society into the Academy of Science Fiction, Fantasy & Horror Films. When they gave their first awards 32 years ago, SLAUGHTERHOUSE FIVE and BLACULA were the big winners, and genre films were still very much marginalized. “Kid’s stuff,” if you will.
Now, there’s no question about it. Genre films are the mainstream, and genre filmmakers are among the most successful and respected in the industry. This year’s Oscar sweep by RETURN OF THE KING finally ended the notion that no SF or fantasy film could ever combine commercial success with awards acceptance, but for the industry professionals and hardcore fans who have always been part of the Saturns, that idea is nothing new. They’ve been fighting to prove that these genres deserve respect since day one.
As much as I’ve been aware of this organization and these awards, I’ve always been interested in going, but one thing or another always kept me from it. Even this year, I thought I was going to have to miss them again due to scheduling, but at the last minute, I finished my latest project and turned it in to Fox, leaving me free. Unfortunately, I’d already passed on the ticket I’d been offered, which made it worse when I started getting calls from friends asking if they’d see me there. By the time I realized I really did want to attend, I had no choice but to call on the single most powerful friend I have. She’s not famous, you wouldn’t know her name, but believe me when I say that if you want to move Heaven and Earth in Los Angeles, call a publicist.
When I arrived at the Universal Sheraton at 6:50 on Wednesday night, I was excited, but had no idea what to expect. My buddy Jack, also instrumental in helping me get my ticket, has described the Saturns to me for the past few years as the ultimate potent combination of cheese and class, but told me I wouldn’t understand until I experienced them for myself.
Now I see what he means.
When we took the escalator down to the ballroom level, we were immediately hit by a wall of sound. To get to the area where the pre-awards reception was being held, we had to walk past one hellacious press line. I’ve only ever worked a few of those, and I respect anyone who gets anything useful out of them. I never did. Personally, I hated the experience, being penned off like that and having to yell questions at people, all in the name of getting that 30-second sound bite that was basically the same one everybody else got.
Things were particularly crazy as we arrived because James Cameron was walking the press line at the same time. I’m sure more than one poor TV outlet is still trying to figure out what to do with their footage thanks to my giant melon head floating by the front of the camera right in the middle of one of his answers. A little further down the press line, I ran into Eli Roth and Edgar Wright. If you’ve read this website at all in the past two years, then you know them as the directors of CABIN FEVER and SHAUN OF THE DEAD, respectively. This was the first chance I got to see Edgar since the Austin screening of SHAUN, and it was nice to be able to catch up a little and hear how well things are going with Focus Films, who have evidently had some very successful test screenings of the film stateside now, which means we should see a fairly major push for it when it is released here. Eli’s one of those guys who was born not only to make films, but also to promote them. I’ve never seen anyone more comfortable in front of the press, more relaxed and natural. I’ve had people confront me about Eli and accuse him of ego excesses, but after the time I’ve spent with him, I don’t buy it. I think he believes that the hype and the travel and the interviews and, yes, the awards are all just part of the fun of the career he chose, and he knows the value of being a name brand.
Remember... he got his start working for David Lynch, and one of the reasons David Lynch is able to do what he wants, when he wants, how he wants is because he has carefully cultivated a rabid core of fans. He may not be able to command giant $100 million-plus budgets every time out, but does anyone really think that’s what Lynch wants? I’m not sure what Eli Roth is going to do with the rest of his career, and I’m not even sure Eli Roth is sure what he’s going to do. But I can tell you that when he introduced me to his parents, and when he talked about his excitement at being honored by the Saturns, there wasn’t a shred of ego in that excitement. There was only the enthusiasm of a lifelong geek finally living out the dreams that drive all of us who work in this business.
And again... if he really was a self-loving egotist, then why would he spend so much time being a cheerleader for other filmmakers? Edgar wasn’t even in town to go to the Saturns. He was there because Eli had spent much of the week trying to introduce Edgar to people, and because he wrangled up an extra ticket for Edgar so he could attend. And as I stood there talking to the two of them, Chris Strompolos walked up to say hello. He was one of the guys involved in the RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK remake, and his life was changed by the way Eli helped get that film out there. He was the first advocate for that film, the one who brought it to BNAT in the first place. I talked with them all for a few moments, then headed off to find my friend, who had already ducked into the room where the bar was.
Just inside the door, I ran into Victor Salva, who I’ve met several times in the last few years, and after a quick hello, I turned around and ended up face-to-face with Forry Ackerman, who is always a geek delight. Wandering around the room, I walked past PETER PAN’s Jeremy Sumpter, who was being congratulated by a number of people, and then spotted Mick Garris, one of the first people in the industry to really open any doors to me when I moved here in the summer of 1990. I’ve always had boundless respect for Mick’s work on the legendary Z Channel, his writing for the original CINEFANTASTIQUE, his work as story editor on AMAZING STORIES, and even his prose fiction like the wonderful short story “A Life In Cinema” and his upcoming novel DEVELOPMENT HELL. Thanks to him, I spent a whole summer roaming the Sony and Warner Bros. lots, not only watching him cut and shoot SLEEPWALKERS, but also getting to haunt the e-ticket sets for Spielberg’s HOOK, which was infinitely more fun than the actual film. Mick introduced me to the head of Sony Reperatory, the division that just released THE LOST SKELETON OF CADAVRA, which was as much fun as any self-respecting geek can have in a theater, and evidently one of the most cost-effective pick-ups for a studio I’ve ever heard of. Mick told me that he’s finished with his film adaptation of Stephen King’s RIDING THE BULLET, and he’s eager to start showing people the film. It’s one of King’s better recent works, a classically-styled ghost story, and I’m curious to see what Mick’s done with it. He also mentioned another project that might see him working with the other “Masters Of Horror,” but it’s still too early to go into detail about it.
By the time my host for the evening found her way over to me, the ballroom doors were open and it was time to head inside. I’ll go ahead and fess up now... I took an assload of pictures, but thanks to the digital zoom I used and the low lighting in the room, they all pretty much sucked. Bums me out, too. How many more times am I going to be able to get a shot of Hellboy chatting with the Hulk?
I found my table and took my seat, waiting for the rest of our friends to arrive. Jeff Walker was the only person at the table that I recognized. He’s one of this town’s leading publicists, and I frequently see him handling genre titles that need a special touch. It was nice to finally meet him face-to-face, and as we all worked on our dinners, I kept jumping up to go talk to friends I recognized.
For example, I saw Kevin Feige and both Arads (Avi and Ari) at the Marvel Films table, and I had to go say hello. Kevin amazed me because of how relaxed and mellow he always seems, even with something like eight billion movies either in production or gearing up. He told me ELEKTRA just got underway in Vancouver, and I’m excited to see just how it comes together. Zak Penn seemed really pleased by the script he wrote, Rob Bowman is a damn good director who is long overdue to make a great flick, and I still think Jennifer Garner was the best reason to go see DAREDEVIL. Adding Terrence Stamp to the film as Stick pretty much guarantees my interest. Kevin also told me how excited he was for fans to get a look at SPIDER-MAN 2 and, in particular, the film’s just-finished opening by Alex Ross, which he promises will “melt fanboy brains around the world.”
Not long after that, I spotted Frank Darabont talking with a couple of people. I haven’t had a chance to catch up with Frank since the whole INDY 4 thing, but we’ve traded e-mails. He’s about to wrap up MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE 3, which he says now is his last work-for-hire. After this, he plans to focus on his own films, his own stories, the things he wants to do. Good, I say. He’s got some incredible scripts ready to go, including an adaptation of Robert McCammon’s MINE that is vicious and brutal and wonderfully done, and his long-promised FARENHEIT 451, which he’s currently working to set up as his return to the director’s chair. And, yeah, THE MIST is going to happen, too, so all of you who love that story don’t have to worry. It’s coming. Anyway, I had to say hello, so I walked over to wait while he finished up his conversation. He spotted me and just lit up, greeting me with a warm hug and a clap on the back. “Hey, Drew, let me introduce you to Drew Struzan.” As I shook hands with the unassuming gentleman he introduced me to, I had no choice but to gush.
”Oh, man, I grew up on your artwork. I’m sorry that Revolution ended up not using your HELLBOY poster. It was a thing of beauty.”
”You have to see the poster he just did for me for THE SHAWSHANK REDEMPTION,” Frank said. He’s prepping the 10th anniversary DVD release of the film right now, having finally recorded a commentary track for it. Before I could say anything else to Struzan, Frank gestured at the other person he’d been speaking to and said, “And I assume you’ve met James Cameron?”
Yep. That James Cameron.
I don’t find myself speechless very often, but that did it. I heard Frank introducing me to him and saying nice things about me, but I just couldn’t figure out what neurons to rub together to be able to say anything to him myself. It’s impossible to overstate the influence he’s had on my work as a writer, and unlike most angry fanboys, I don’t begrudge him the time he’s taken for himself since the release of TITANIC. In fact, I respect his decision to pursue his personal passions for a while. So often, this business can feel like a treadmill turned on high while you either keep running or you get brushed off, leading directors to make films they’re not crazy about just so they can keep working. Cameron used the evening to speak a bit about his next film, assuring the audience that it will be a mega-budget SF film, also talking about how it’s going to be shot in 3D, using the same process he’s been testing the last few years on projects like GHOSTS OF THE ABYSS.
And, yeah, I blew it. I should have asked him to comment on the many reports I’ve had that his new film will be based on the popular manga series BATTLE ANGEL ALITA, but I didn’t. Like I said, I basically swallowed my tongue when he was standing there, and he walked away before I recovered my composure. Instead, I asked another attendee at the awards about it, since they were in a good position to know what’s up, and they agreed to speak to me as long as I didn’t identify them. “It’s definitely ALITA,” they said, “and he’s already deep into pre-production on it. The tech tests so far are amazing, and you would not believe the scale of his art department. They’ve been working for almost six months at this point, and their work is just beautiful. As far as Alita’s concerned, she’s going to be the culmination of all of Cameron’s ambitions on projects like AVATAR. Trust me... if Gollum pushed the envelope, Alita is going to shred it.” Hyperbole aside, I’m dying for Cameron to make his official announcement, and 2006 (his proposed release date) can’t get here fast enough.
Finally, as dessert was served, we were told to take our seats, and the ceremony got underway with a very funny film called “Who Are The Saturn Awards?” Veteran character actor James Karen appeared as an agent-to-the-monsters trading phone calls with clients like Mothra, while Eli Roth appeared as himself, directing a zombie movie with the help of an actual zombie as his technical advisor. It was cheesy, silly, and set the tone perfectly for the rest of the evening. Mark Altman gave a quick introductory address, and then they brought out the evening’s master of ceremonies, comedian Jeffrey Ross. If you’ve ever seen any of those celebrity roasts on Comedy Central, then you’re already familiar with the acerbic wit of Ross, the self-described result of “Rick Moranis and Walter Matthau [having] a baby.” He’s one of those guys who frequently gets called in for punch-ups when the Farrelly Bros. do their round-table rewrites on their films, and I hope they at least consider him for the Larry Fine role when they make their upcoming THREE STOOGES movie.
He was in fine form, offending half the audience with his opening monologue even as he made the rest of us hoot in laughter. “How about a hand for whoever those people were,” he began. “And thank you, Mark, for making the rest of us feel overdressed. An awards show for science fiction and horror... you people are freaks and geeks. The best looking guy here tonight is Gollum. I know... I know... the real reason you throw yourselves an awards show every year is so you don’t have to go to a STAR TREK convention to meet chicks. This is my second year hosting, and I hope I’m a good sequel like THE LORD OF THE RINGS, and not a bad sequel like THE MATRIX RELOADED. Who wrote that script? Keanu Reeves? They should have called it MATRIX REWRITTEN.” At the sound of some “oooooh”s, Ross introduced his mantra for the evening. “I love you guys, no matter what happens.” He fearlessly played with the crowd as he continued. “Oh, look, Chewbacca’s here tonight. No, wait, that’s Sam Elliott’s moustache.” Shots at the expense of STAR WARS were met by vocal approval by the crowd, while LORD OF THE RINGS also took its fair share of jabs. “RETURN OF THE KING was great, but that movie had more happy endings than a Vietnamese massage parlor.”
As he warmed up, he seemed willing to tackle any subject, no matter how sacred. “Talk about successful sci-fi movies, how about that one Mel Gibson directed about that long-haired hippie with the superpowers? I loved it, and I’m Jewish. People say the Jews killed Jesus? Hell, yeah, we killed him, and if he comes back, we’ll kill him again. That’s what we do. We’re Christ killers. Now can I get an ‘Amen’?” I always love it when a comic crosses a line and then has to win the audience back, like when he said, “Even Ben Affleck tried his hand at sci-fi this year when he played a blind superhero. Kinda reminds me of that guy who’s married to Star Jones.” There were so many gasps that he looked around. “What, is she here? No? Then fuck her.” That got everyone laughing again, and he rolled on, talking directly to some of the people in the crowd. Thunderbolt Ross himself was sitting front and center. “Having fun, Sam?” Elliott nodded. “Yeah, this is just like the Oscars without all those annoying famous people.”
Finally, he wrapped things up, saying, “Like the Bush Administration, I have no exit strategy, so let’s bring out our first presenter.” The first award was actually a holdover from last year’s ceremony, when James Cameron was unable to attend to pick up his Donald A. Reed Award. Fittingly enough, Tom Arnold was the presenter, and he took the stage with all the manic nervous energy he’s known for.
”Can you imagine how many famous people had to say no before they called me?” he began. He spoke in circles a bit, telling a few rambling anecdotes and doing a pretty funny impression of Shwarzenegger that never really went anywhere, but one thing was obvious: he loves James Cameron, and he couldn’t have been any happier about presenting him with the award. “He’s not just the King of the World, but also the Master of the Universe... my friend, James Cameron.”
Cameron took the stage shaking his head. “As anyone with children can tell you, I’m not the king of anything. I’m not even the king of my own couch,” he began, going on to speak quite eloquently about not only his love of the genre, but also about how he hopes it will continue to evolve.
”I truly believe we are about to see a change as profound as the switch from black-and-white to color,” he said at one point, and he may well be right. The announcement was made just the other day that THE POLAR EXPRESS will play many venues in 3D IMAX, and I’ve heard that Peter Jackson was so blown away by a recent test he saw of footage he shot on the set of THE TWO TOWERS using that 3D system that he has decided to shoot all of KING KONG that way. If guys like Cameron, Zemeckis, and Jackson are all going to give the process a shot on such high-profile projects, then we could see the ripple effects industry-wide. Cameron wrapped up his short speech by saying, “I look back at how science fiction and fantasy was treated when I was a kid, and even when I was starting out, and it was ghettoized. Now, they are among the most successful and commercially acclaimed films ever. We may all be freaks and geeks, but these days, that’s a pretty great thing to be.” Indeed.
I just looked back and realized how long this article is, and I’ve barely even scratched the surface. The evening was a blur of great and not-so-great moments, but I’ll try to cover at least a few of the highlights of this “Celebration of the Fantastic.”
There was the tribute video put together by Eli Roth’s brother to celebrate Eli winning the Filmmaker’s Showcase Award, made up in large part of clips from the videos Eli made as a kid. As Donal Logue observed later, “If I were Eli’s parents and saw that one video of him in the hot pink midriff shirt, I would have wondered why he was making violent gay porn at 13.” Eli’s speech was funny and self-deprecating, and he spoke of a lifelong fandom that began when he would projectile vomit every time his parents took him to see something like ALIEN or THE EXORCIST. From such an auspicious start, of course he became addicted to FANGORIA, and of course he ended up making horror films of his own, hoping to cause the same reaction in some poor unsuspecting kid now.
Sean Astin accepted his award for Best Supporting Actor, the only member of the LORD OF THE RINGS team who was able to show up. He also accepted Elijah Wood’s Best Actor award since Elijah is in England finishing up work on his soccer hooligan drama THE YANK. Both speeches he gave were articulate and heartfelt, and his love for Elijah came through loud and clear. “He gets this... all of this. He was the first one to open my eyes to this entire world of imagination. I have forgotten at certain points in my life just how powerful the imagination can be, but LORD OF THE RINGS reminded me of it, and Elijah more than anyone.” During Sean’s second speech, my buddy Jack turned to me and whispered, “Ladies and Gentlemen, Governor Sean Astin.” He’s certainly got the poise and emotional accessibility of the best politicians, and he knows how to work a room, no doubt about it.
Joss Whedon also made several trips to the stage, picking up awards for ANGEL (Best Series) and FIREFLY (Best DVD Television Release). I didn’t realize Whedon was sitting one table away from me until he took the stage the first time. His speeches were a combination of warm and funny and hard-earned bitterness. He talked about how FIREFLY was killed by the Fox Network, and about how important the response to the DVDs has been. Personally, I didn’t even see the show until it hit DVD, and once I did, I bought at least eight or more of the box sets and gave them away during the holiday season. It was the strong sales of that box that helped convince Universal to greenlight SERENITY, which starts shooting next month. Being able to see further adventures from Captain Mal Reynolds and his crew thrills me to no end, and when I finally spoke to Whedon directly after the ceremony ended, he seemed almost as excited to be able to tell the story as I am to see it.
Peter Jackson showed up... sort of. He sent special pre-recorded messages for when he won Best Director, Best Screenplay, Best Fantasy Film, Best Beard, Best Barefoot Guy From New Zealand, Coolest Accent, and Best Transformation From Gorehound Into An A-List Mogul, as well as a congratulatory tape for when Eli Roth won his award. As Jeffrey Ross said after the 3,421st tape, “It would have been easier just to show up in person instead of spending a week to record all of these.” He wasn’t the only one who sent a tape, either. Luminaries like Ray Harryhausen, John Carpenter, Wes Craven, and even Godzilla all sent in special well-wishes on the 30th Anniversary show, since two years seem to have been rolled into one show twice during the ceremony’s 32 year history.
The night wrapped up with a couple of the genre’s highest-profile women accepting awards. Lauren-Shuler Donner took the stage with Ralph Winter when X-MEN 2 won Best Science Fiction Film, and she spoke about being a latecome to the genre, but how she hopes to do a lot more work of this type in the future. Gale Anne Hurd also accepted an award, the 2004 Donald A. Reed Award. Seems appropriate that she and Cameron picked up the same award, bookending the evening with their acceptance speeches. She spoke quite affectingly about how Dr. Reed was one of the first people to support the original TERMINATOR at a time when even its distributor seemed ashamed of it. Seems incredible now that the film is acknowledged as a classic, but the pre-release press materials didn’t even mention the SF elements of the story, describing it instead as “a down-and-dirty action movie.” Hell, it wasn’t even screened for critics.
There’s been some talk about televising the Saturns, and I hope they go for it. Yeah, there are a lot of awards shows on television already, but none like this. Sure, I can describe to you the way Sean Young melted down during her bizarre presentation of the Best Actress award, but unless you saw it for yourself, you can’t appreciate the magnitude just how vigorously nutty she is. Only Sean Young would pause while reading off the list of nominees to harangue the crowd about how SF and horror only celebrates the torture and mutilation and rape of women. Only Sean Young would refuse to hand over the award to Lawrence Bender (accepting on behalf of winner Uma Thurman) until he kissed her, something he seemed to be in no hurry to do. And only at the Saturn Awards would it all seem so incredibly spontaneous and appropriate.
It was a great evening and a great show, even if it was long as hell, and I hope it’s just the first one for me. For a full list of the awards given, visit the official site, where you can also read about the organization’s history. Thanks to Lisa and Jack for making sure I got to be there, and to all the amazing creators whose work keeps these genres so fresh and exciting to watch, even after a lifetime spent dreaming in the dark.
Readers Talkbackcomments powered by Disqus
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May 9, 2004, 9:07 a.m. CST
If they do manage to televise the award show, they should do their best to get William Shatner back. I saw that first broadcast back in 1978 and have never quite gotten over the sight of Shatner, in a tuxedo and a toupee that looked like Brillo, sitting on a stool, smoking a cigarette, and "singing" "Rocket Man." It was truly memorable, and how I wish I could forget....
May 9, 2004, 10:35 a.m. CST
...lucky you're of age, or he might've repeatedly bumped you back.
May 9, 2004, 12:03 p.m. CST
by Some Dude
I'm glad Ross gave it a mention. That guy is funny. I want more Star Jones jokes.
May 9, 2004, 12:06 p.m. CST
Great report. I love hearing accounts of industry events from the inside, and your well-written article didn't disappoint. Well, it didn't disappoint me. The tidbits of info about "Battle Angel Alita" from Cameron were excellent to hear, and I almost can't believe it's going to happen. Can't fucking wait.
May 9, 2004, 12:10 p.m. CST
by Some Dude
I met the King of the World at the Roseland during the after-party for the NYFF premiere of "Strange Days." He put up with my drunken rambling while my kid brother grabbed Kathryn Bigelow's ass. A real class act.
May 9, 2004, 1:32 p.m. CST
hey, worth a shot man. No disrespect intended towards your skills as a writer, but man, you gotta take your opportunites where you can get 'em. I mean, think about it, we could have had EXCLUSIVE ACIN INTERVIEWS with James Cameron -- forever!
May 9, 2004, 2:39 p.m. CST
no more projects!!!
May 9, 2004, 2:43 p.m. CST
If James Cameron has really been working on Battle Angel Alita for the last six months, why doesn't he just come out and make an offical announcement? Why all the secrecy? The only reason I can think of is that he's wooried that plot points will get leaked out before shooting even starts. Sounds like Alita is going to be a completely computer generated character - 'more human than human' perhaps - which should really be worth seeing. There's also a nice symmetry in this film being released in 2006 - 20 years after his (so far) greates film, Aliens. But given that Alita is likely to be his ONLY film this DECADE it really has to deliver the goods - like all three LOTR movies rolled into one - or I'm going to be seriously disappointed.
May 9, 2004, 4:07 p.m. CST
May 9, 2004, 4:14 p.m. CST
May 9, 2004, 6:46 p.m. CST
Calm down man...this ain
May 9, 2004, 8:26 p.m. CST
by Mr Brownstone
just curious, cause I think he's cool.
May 9, 2004, 8:51 p.m. CST
a great read, though you could have elaborated the latter part a bit more. yes it was long, but not long enough!
May 9, 2004, 8:59 p.m. CST
by drew mcweeny
... was there to give Gale Anne Hurd her special award. He was his typical charming ol' cowboy self when he gave the speech about her, and he played along with all of Jeff Ross's jokes pretty well.
May 9, 2004, 9:55 p.m. CST
What's the big idea about meeting James Cameron? He hasn't made a good film since THE ABYSS in '89...
May 9, 2004, 10:13 p.m. CST
THE ABYSS was a cool flick until Cameron pulled an ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND with that utterly retarded ending that ruined the whole film for me. Of all his films the only one I really, really like is ALIENS. Both of his TERMINATOR films had really cool stuff in them but were ruined by Ah-nuld and his one-liners. And while I know it would've been impossible to finance I'd have liked to get a TERMINATOR film set entirely in the post-apocalyptic future instead of the present day. But that may just be me. Cameron has done some great work as a screenwriter and producer though. STRANGE DAYS and Soderbergh's SOLARIS are among the very few good sci-fi films that have come out of Hollywood in the past 10 years. I have high hopes for ALITA and pray it will live up to the expectations raised by the source material and Cameron's long-awaited return to science fiction. PS: No PG-13 ALITA, please!!!
May 9, 2004, 11:07 p.m. CST
by Jon E Cin
May 10, 2004, 12:23 a.m. CST
by ol' painless
Ah well, at least you didn't get fanboy-kinky, and ask him to yell abuse at you for about 6 mths straight, also known as Working On a Movie With Cameron. Have to say he is my favourite director in the world, and if he has to ride his crew like rented mules to make great movies, then that is fine by me
May 10, 2004, 9:23 p.m. CST
....when's the sequel to Pirahna 2: The Spawning coming out, dawg?
May 11, 2004, 3:24 a.m. CST
Hell, yes. Eli is a big fat cocksucker. I saw that guy at the FANGO convention in January. Does this guy love himself or what? Ego Roth, I mean Eli Roth, is completely full of himself. A megalomaniacal snake oil salesman who has everyone fooled into thinking he
May 11, 2004, 1:16 p.m. CST
the funniest man alive, in my estimation...although, if he is g-d, doesn't that mean, per his routine, he has to kill himself? he'll probably have to confer with st. mel about that...
May 11, 2004, 2:19 p.m. CST
May 12, 2004, 11:20 a.m. CST
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