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Sean Astin Screens TWO TOWERS and LONG & SHORT OF IT For Charity, And Our Readers Were There!!
Hey, everyone. "Moriarty" here with some Rumblings From The Lab.
Hi Harry and TORn!
Longtime reader, first time blah-blah. I was at a charity showing of The Two Towers this evening, which featured a special appearance by Sean Astin, who also showed his short film, "The Long and the Short of it." The showing was a charity for Reading is Fundamental, and the entire ticket price went to it. Sean Astin was originally going to be in town helping with Project Elanor, which was going to convert an old parking lot into a reading garden for children. Since he was going to be in town, this charity screening was also arranged. BTW, I'm not involved with Project Elanor at all, but I figured it needed an explanation.
Before I get into the evening's events, though, I have to get this off my chest. Regal Cinemas was originally going to have this charity event in a theater that seated only 300 people. A massive email-writing campaign then occurred where we all wrote to Regal to say that we were sure we could get 700 people to fill the larger, much better theater across the street. Apparently, Regal received over 900 emails. They naturally switched it to the big theater. But then it seemed like little more than half of the people actually showed up! I could tell the theater manager was disappointed, even though he said they had raised $3,000 for the charity, we all knew that it was supposed to be a packed house, and that it should have raised $5,600 ($8 per ticket X 700 seats, and Regal didn't take any cut of it, either). Anyway, that aspect was awfully disappointing.
Anyway, on to the stuff. Sorry if this is a bit abbreviated, but it's 1 AM, and my brain usually shuts down around 10 PM.
There was a short intro by the theater manager, and then Sean arrived, walking down from the back of the theater. He's definitely lost all the Sam-fat, and is looking a bit on the buff side.
One of the first things he did was lead the entire theater in a Happy Birthday song to a young girl in the audience (I think she was involved with Project Elanor as well, but I'm not sure).
He made a few opening remarks, but seemed eager to show the short film first. I won't go over the short film, as most people have probably seen it on the internet already, but there was one interesting note he made. He said that he had been somewhat taken with the wombats in Australia, and was wondering how he could combine wombats with the face of one of the gaffers on LOTR (sorry, don't remember the name). Well, of course, there aren't any wombats in his film, but the large poster that the three people are putting up in the film is a fake advertisement for an automobile dubbed "The Wombat."
A tidbit about the short film: "The Long and the Short of it" will make it onto one of the Two Towers DVD's coming out (I think on the theatrical version), along with an 8-10 minute "Making Of" special!
What was his favorite film to work on? Either THE GOONIES (filmed here in Oregon, out at Astoria and Cannon Beach), or RUDY.
What characteristics of his co-stars most surprised him? He had a couple, but the only one I remember was that "Christopher Lee is really funny."
What is his favorite moment in the films? I don't remember the exact answer, but he did append "I can't wait to fight a spider!" to it.
What is his favorite film in the LOTR trilogy? Of course he said he hasn't seen ROTK yet, but he expects that one to be his favorite of the three. And we will definitely see the Grey Havens. Frankly, I'm surprised people keep asking about it, because its easy enough to find the footage where Peter Jackson explains that it is his favorite part!
He was asked by one young girl if she could get a hug. This was kinda funny to watch, because of course he wants to give us whatever we want, but then he'd have to hug everyone in the theater. So instead he offered to hug three "ambassadors" from the audience (one from each section of the theater, one of whom was the birthday girl). He ended up hugging a fourth person in the front row.
He was asked about his involvement in Project Elanor, to which he gave a rather lengthy explanation that roughly sums up to "I would like to do whatever I can, no matter how small or seemingly insignificant to make this world a better place for us and our children."
He was extremely gracious, almost to a fault, in that he was really trying to answer everyone's questions, but of course, people's hands just kept popping up, and he couldn't answer them all. He wasn't going to stay for the Two Towers, as he was going to take his wife and daughter out to dinner. He stayed for a long time, though, answering questions (sometimes the same questions). At one point his cel phone went off, and he explained that it was his wife, and he was going to have to wrap things up soon, and then he kept answering peoples questions! Finally, his wife and daughter actually showed up at the theater to drag him away! It was pretty cute, because his daughter ran right up to him in front of everybody, and did the "impatient child waiting for her parent" kind of dance, sometimes running in circles around Sean. At this point he had been talking for almost an hour, and he finally closed the questions, gave the three "ambassadors" hugs, and left the theater to a standing ovation.
So then the Two Towers started up. Now you have to understand that this crowd seemed to be made up of approximated 75% women/young girls, and about 25% men/young boys. The result was that pretty much anytime any of the central male characters showed up on screen, they were greeted by short Beatle-esque screams and cheers. The largest cheer was expected to be for Sam, of course, when he showed up for the first time, but I actually think Merry and Pippin got the biggest cheers of the evening. They actually cheered pretty much everything when it showed up. There was even a cheer for the first shot of the Eye of Sauron. There was also a cheer for the statue of Helm Hammerhand at Helm's Deep!
The only time I'd ever seen this level of audience enthusiasm and involvement was actually at a sneak preview screening of THE ROCKETEER, of all things. That audience was made up largely of older men who had obviously loved the comic and series when they were kids, and loved seeing it get the big special effects treatment. But I digress...
The cheering was kind of fun initially, but it wore thin pretty quick, especially when they KEPT cheering for characters, even when they had already been introduced. One guy finally yelled "SHUT-UP!!!" which worked for about 5 minutes.
The other thing that started happening was that people started to yell back at the screen, of which I remember two instances:
ARAGORN to EOWYN: "What do you fear, my lady?"
AUDIENCE: "CLOWNS!!!"
(I'm not sure if Miranda Otto has ever played a clown-phobic character before, or if this was just an oddball comment).
THEODEN: "Saruman's arm will have grown long indeed if he thinks he can reach us here."
AUDIENCE: "NEVER SAY THINGS LIKE THAT!"
Like I said, this all got old pretty quick, and about halfway through the movie, they stopped the movie and the lights came up. There was a pause before the theater manager came out and first thanked everyone for the attendance and the enthusiasm, but also to quiet down, as there were some people here who had not yet seen the movie, himself included. How you are a theater manager and somehow miss a movie like this, I'm not sure. Anyway, he told us this was not "The Rocky Horror Picture Show" and that we should just quietly enjoy the movie. The audience was pretty good after that, though it made Galadriel be the only character who didn't get a cheer. That may also have been because she turned into Jennifer Lopez for a minute in the last movie (you know, the part where Frodo offers her the ring). Oh well.
Anyway, the rest of the evening passed with little news, other than the occasional scream/cheer/yelp from various parts of the audience.
PS: I wanted to tell Sean to tell PJ that he should listen to Bob Newhart's KING KONG comedy routine. I'd laugh my ass off I saw this clueless security guard at the Empire State Building in the movie!
Just a couple extra tidbits I just remembered:
Sean thinks Andy Serkis really should have won an Oscar, not only for the performance, but for his complete lack of ego throughout the whole thing. "Here's a guy that worked harder than most of us, turning in a fantastic performance, and his face will never be seen onscreen." That's paraphrased, of course, but that was the gist of it.
The gaffer whose face had originally inspired the short film had died before Sean came back to do pickup shots for TTT. Because the lighting and cinematography were so entwined, Andrew Lesnie stepped up to the plate to play the painter, out of respect to the gaffer (Jeez, I feel so bad I can't remember his name! I'm sure Harry can fill it in, though).
GOONIES 2: Sean said Spielberg and Donner are still interested, and say it will happen, but nobody knows any more about it. In a nod to the Oregon audience, he said "Of course it'll be filmed in Astoria!"
PJ's special appearance in the short film of course drew loud screams and appluase.
A couple more places where there were loud screams of approval during TTT: Smeagol telling Gollum to go away, and almost every line in the rabbit-stew sequence.
Well, that's it. If you decide to use this at all, call me CattyWhompus.Here’s another reader’s take on things, with a very interesting proposition that Astin raised at the event:
Hello there Harry,
Long time listener, first time caller. I'm stationed in Portland, OR. Yesterday, Sean Astin was in town yesterday, for a charity called Bit of Earth. Aparantly they're turning a parking lot into a garden or something along those lines. So he was at a local theatre, the Loydd Cinemas doing the Q&A, showing The Long and The Short of it, and playing The Two Towers, much like the review of the thing he did in Austin, so I won't bore you with details you already know about him. He's very cool, very playful.
I was freaking out about seeing him, it's the first celebrity I've ever seen in the flesh, and I'm a huge Rings Geek. He said he's doing some Adam Sandler comedy with Drew Barrymore [EDITOR’S NOTE – That would be 50 FIRST KISSES. “M”]. I can't stand Adam Sandler, but hey, whatever keeps Astin in a job is fine by me. He briefly mentioned his disaster film, emphasized again and again how he loves directing, and gave away three digits of Orlando Blooms phone number. He also mentioned how Return of the King is going to be the best Lord of the Rings movie, but we all knew that anyway. He said that the Hobbit was by far his favorite Tolkein book. Then someone asked him about there ever being a movie based on The Hobbit, and he gave a most intriguing answer. He said that there's a bit of an issue over rights to the material, but that should be worked out eventually, and he went on to say, and I quote,
"AND IF PETER JACKSON DOESN'T WANT TO DIRECT IT, I WILL."
Thought you might find that of interest. Alright, if anything else arises in the land of port, I'll keep you posted.
-DuffyThanks, everybody. Nice work.
"Moriarty" out.
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Though I cannot help but fear people that spontaneously direct helicopter landings without request or provocation.
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Not sure what to think about the Hobbit. Just re-read it and its very different in tone to LOTR. Its a childrens book, and written as such, and one in which trolls have names like William and Thomas, and crows can speak English. There's quite a bit that doesn't/won't tally with LOTR, in film or book version. Its one to keep an eye on though.
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lord of rings sucks you nerds. star wars 4 eva
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I sure hope the Hobbit gets put up on the big screen! Sean could put in a guest appearance as the young Gaffer "I'll teach my boy how to grow 'taters proper!" McKellen must come back as Gandalf and James Earl Jones should get the nod to do the voice of Smaug. Anyway, Astin does sound like a class act. ** Hey, I thought you bashers said that "chicks just won't dig the Lord of the Rings!" Guess that makes you wrong.
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Apr 07, 2003 8:09:16 PM CDT
Hellooo...anybody home? (slams bags down on floor of deserted cl
by mortsleam
In the words of our own inimitable gardner Sam, "Well, I'm back." Actually, I was back Sunday at about 3:30 am, but the temperature change (90 in Miami, 30 in Detroit) knocked me for a loop. Then I spent most of today digging out from under a collapsed mountain of work which had accumulated while I was gone. Plus, I think I may have come down with S.A.R.S. Kaff-kaff. Quick On-Topic post: Glad to hear Astin is such a good-natured guy, and that he does his thing for the kids. And if he's been watching reeeeaaaalll careful like, and looking over PJ's shoulder and jotting down notes and such, he may just be able to fake his way through The Hobbit if need be. After, WETA would presumably be in place to handle the FX chores. The whole size notion would only come into play in about 5 scenes (excepting of course for Gandalf.) *** Now onto the truly important news: how was my cruise? Great. Relaxing. Restorative. Very damaging to the pocketbook and the liver, but well worth it. Particularly the kayak trip down the river Anduin. Although I have to say that snorkeling amidst the Dead Marshes took a bit of work. Despite outward appearances, not all Flabby Tusked Sea Mammals are very strong swimmers. (Note to the confused: for "Anduin" read "Key West Mangroves" and for "Dead Marshes" read "Goff's Quaye Coral Reef near Belize.") I also celebrated by birthday last Wednesday, but didn't have the forethought to bring mathoms enough for 2,000 of my fellow cruisers. So I just got drunk instead. Well, I perused ye ole TB...Sorry about the confusion. I obviously meant "Gate of Minas Tirith" not "Door of Ithilien." Hey, I was mere steps away from taking a ship to the freakin' Bahamas. Cut me some slack. I should mention that before we went, Strawberry Shortcake and I snuck in one last viewing of TTT. We had to drive a ways out of our way to see it too. But it was well worth it. The crowd was surprisingly large, and composed of many people spurred on by TTT's Oscar wins. There was an older couple sitting next to us. The wife had obviously read the books (or seen the first movie) as she was continuously explaining plot points to her husband. Yet everyone in the theater reacted perfectly to everything onscreen from the derivise snorts to nervous laughter to stunned silence during Gollum and Smeagol's dialog, to warm amusement with Legolas and Gimli's banter, to horrified gasps when Aragorn cliff dives and Haldir gets whacked and Frodo draws Sting on Sam. And I have to say that I really appreciated David Wenham's subtle performace as a soldier conflicted between his duty, his desire to please his father, and his unexpected empathy towards these poor defensless little people. I still like Book!Faramir much better, but I'm starting to think that Movie!Faramir may just turn out to be more interesting. Notice I deleted the Un! prefix. Finally, to the question of how the TTT SEV could be rated and yet not be ready for release: Gollum. PJ has stated that nearly all of the extra 30 minutes of footage required intesive special effects shots, many having to do with Gollum. Look at the refinements in the animation of Gollum, from the first tantalizing glimpse in the preview at the end of FOTR, to the first theatrical trailer, to TTT itself. As none of the scenes change any in content, only in sophistication of effects, PJ may have released it to the ratings board with only basic animation, not only for Gollum, but Treebeard and the Ents and Extra MASSIVE footage, etc...without effecting the final edited form. Or I could be delirious from S.A.R.S. Word to those attempting to snorkle the Dead Marshes: never accept a mouthpiece from a marsh spirit without rinsing it in Miruvel first! ggg'j (;{=
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when I predicted (well ok it was just an off-hand comment) that Sean Astin would direct "The
Hobbit"? Oh yeah, huh, I did, I did. I said it right here on these very tb's. And now do I doubly rue the day of the great banning cuz now I can't prove it.***Welcome back, traveler. Good point about Gollum, drat it anyway. There are still scattered
recent posts on the Minas Morgul tb if you wanna get caught up. PB made a yummy ROTK trailer out of his head.***MorG - nice to see you back at last, too.***
Yeah, Alice, I think our Mr. Astin may be wound a little tight but that could work ok on a short shoot if he has the right cast & crew and they keep him on weed-laced decaf. -
Of course, I'll go see it no matter what, but what makes anyone think Sean Astin can direct? Also, Star Wars sucks and The Goonies sucks worse.
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(Glances up) I can't hear anyone upstairs... I think we might be okay here. It *was* a TTT screening, after all, and it HAS fallen off the main page... Just be vewwy, vewwy *qui-et*... But yeah, anyhoo, I would love to see TTT in a totally geek-packed audience (though I must say, the local cinema shows it once a day at weekends, and it's always jam-packed and the audience are way more into it than in the original screenings - I suspect that these weekends definitely represent Repeat Business). I saw "Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade" at Glastonbury Festival once and that was fantastic. You know, SWOON UPDATE: Alice is Currently Swooning Over - her TTT calendar, which features Un!Faramir as Mr. April. And I have to say, he's becoming a real Smouldering Presence (TM) in my room. He's got quite a Faramir-y expression on, and he's... well, actually... he's a bit of a hunk, goddammit. Mr. January was Gandalf - respect is due, but still, you can tell you're in the depth of winter. Mr. February was the gestalt entity of MerrynPippin, I think, and Mr. March was the iconic unwashed presence of the Lost King of Gondor. But I must say, Mr. April is making quite an impression on me. However, Mr. May is Eomer, son of Eomund, so that works too.
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Here y'all is. Good, I didn't feel like slowly scrolling down through the dates trying to find anything posted after Friday. Time's short! (Miss much?) *** Sean Astin directing The Hobbit? Now that would be interesting indeed. When the party's all caught up in the trees, he can personally direct the Eagles in for a safer rescue. *** Now then, what I really wanted to do here was share my new toy: http://www.tashian.com/multibabel/ Basically, you enter a phrase, and the script sends the string out to BabelFish for machine translation from English to another language and back again -- not once, but FIVE TIMES. Or, ten translations in all! (More if you include the Chinese, Japanese, and Korean translations, but then you're REALLY asking for it...) For example, does anyone recognize this wonderful dramatic prebattle recitation? "Where they are the horse and the passenger? Where the horn, that breathing of the age? They have ecceduto like mountain rain, because the interior of the wind emits. The days register the West for the deep one, behind the assemblies, in the color." (And just imagine the look on Aragorn's face had Legolas greeed him at Helm's Deep with "One extends. Drawn towards outside, it sees the extremity." Hmm, actually, that's sorta Elvish in its inscrutability.) ...Basically, this thing may be the absolute incarnation of everything Tolkien feared and loathed about technology. ENJOY! :)
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Indeed. Had the characters spoken like that, then I think we can safely say that Sauron would have become the acknowledged hero of the piece for attempting to wipe them out. As Frodo deathlessly announces: "I makes the examinaci
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Apr 08, 2003 2:19:33 PM CDT
Sauron, the hero? Maybe, hard to tell. "He is seeking it...
by pallando blue
"...they double to the relative the whole thought of the advanced side." And why? "The extremity has the necessity with this ring the end to only cover the complete Earth in a second density..." Man, I knew Gandalf was a windbag from way back hanging out in Valinor, but he's really gotten a lot worse, hasn't he?
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[This is SO gonna get me deleted... please don't look, FG, please don't look please don;t look] Why was Merry so frustrated by the Entmoot? "That this taking indicates the moment good the end to say to nothing in old Entish and Ents not everything, it is that they evaluate it is, the end to be necessary a good moment, the end to say."
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Apr 08, 2003 2:56:04 PM CDT
So I picked up this trilogy on the cheap the other day, but I th
by pallando blue
Part 1: "The master of the ring the situation, that one is important: Ring of the group" Part 2: "The master of the ring the situation, that one is important: It becomes from cranium" and Part 3: "The master of the ring the situation, that one is important: Leaguing together of the wages" [er, am i double-posting this?]
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"Three ring for those elves underneath the sieve of the sky for the dwaries within lapidate excavates. Last you sing to the dream for the men the oration, the end to the dice. In the Earth of Mordor, where they are the colors. A ring, to govern it everything. A ring to find it. A ring, he everything and in the density the end for consegu
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Methinks several people or computers have spent WAY too much time with Tim Benzedrine ("First, second, neutral, park,/ Hie thee hence, you leafy narc!")
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I wanna take a look-see. Oh yes, that's nice. Very very nice.
Swoon.....clunk. Ah well.***I suppose it's fair for me to talk about my latest toy, too. Guess what came in the mail yesterday? My New Zealand elvish cloak - well no I didn't buy a cloak - that was really too much, but I got the throw blanket. I wear it as a shawl like little Bilbo. It is WAY cool, my dears. Feels fantastic, soft and rich and the weave is to die for, gorgeous and distinctive and quite recognizable. People are commenting on how pretty it is even before I tell them what it is and where I got it. And it arrived just in time to keep me all warm and snuggly during our April snowstorm. And if that's not a geeky enough admission, here's another. I have not yet gotten my fan mag for February/March and I'm none too pleased. Do any of you get it? Are yours late? Tolkien crack whore that I am I am looking for some miserable company.***Nice to have a tb to call home, yes? -
Hey, wait a minute Pearlindew, I thought you were s
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Apr 09, 2003 5:09:38 PM CDT
I think we've discussed this whole Hobbit director thing before
by mortsleam
Buuut...since there's no longer any evidence of any of those posts, I feel it's probably safe to repeat myself. It went a li'l sumpin' like this: I always thought that Terry Gilliam would have been a great choice to direct the Rings movies. He has a sure grasp of FX, and a penchant for medieval fetishism. However, I'm afraid that he might be overly tempted to go the "Time Bandits" route with the Hobbit and hire an all Little People cast. And stick Robin Williams in there somewhere as well. And more likely than not run afoul with the studio and get the whole project killed. Sooo...My pick for an alternate Hobbit helmer (and really that might be a good thing to maintain the distinct tonal and stylistic differences between the books) would be Jean Pierre Jeunet, the visionary French director responsible for City of the Lost Children and Amelie. And, uhm, Alien Resurrection, but don't hold that against him. At least it demonstrated his sure hand with special effects. But City of the Lost Children is the clincher for me. It is really a very adult, very surreal fairytale wrapped in sci-fi trappings. It in fact reminds me very much of a Gilliam flick. And Amelie showed he's capable of simple dreamy charm as well. The only issues would be the English-dialog heavy script, and the necessity to shoot in NEW ZEALAND with WETA art direction, costume design and effects work. Hmm...what about that guy who played Isildur? He's a Kiwi director, ain't he? *** In the words of the Babelfish: He they are Walrus, joob of g' of goo of goo.
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I've been checking the wrong threads.... Elanor, the throw sounds lovely, and just what I'd want if I could justify ordering anything before I have a job again... and besides, it's always 72 degrees here, though maybe I could just hang it on the wall and admire the weave. But pleased you're enjoying it. And my fan magazine DID come today, thought I haven't had a chance to check it out, except to admire the adorable picture of Pippin hugging Treebeard on the cover. (Good thing THAT'S paid up for three years.) I spent my morning taking advantage of my health plan while I have it, and found out I need months of painful therapy for my frozen shoulder, though, really, the cortisone shot helped quite a lot, and it's not as though I really need to do arm circles, though I guess it's a preventative so it doesn't get worse. Still feel liking going gung-ho with the creative writing, so am very resistant to gainful employment, though I did put my resume in for a marketing copywriter today. Will pray they want me... two months from now. ***Sorry, Alice, your April calendar picture cannot possibly trump my ROTK April. And there IS a good one of Faramir coming up later, albeit in the background of a brooding Denethor. ***What, they think they are giving us a gift with 30 minutes of TTT? We KNEW that was coming.... 45 minutes would be better! And in the meantime, could we POSSIBLY have some stills?
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From the mouth of Peter Jackson himself, per interview in fan magazine. There will be 43 minutes added to the TTT SEV, compared with 32 in FOTR - a great deal of it to do with Merry and Pippin, though we can hope for more hobbitry all around. There is much in the issue on Elvish weapons, including the note that Gil-Galad's spear was the most beautiful thing they ever came up with, and we never get to see it properly. There is a very nice profile shot of an Elvish warrior descending the stairs at Helm's Deep - just grabs me, somehow. And a nice, long article on Billy Boyd. Anyone who hasn't subscribed, what are you thinking?
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Please confirm or deny, mag-holders! ...Sorry to shout, but it's hard to whisper when I can't pick my jaw off the floor! Don't have the Fan Club mag yet (I'll get to THAT #&$@! love/hate relationship in a minute), but here's what TOC had to say on the matter: "According to an interview in the Official Lord of the Rings Fanclub Magazine, Peter Jackson has confirmed that The Two Towers Special Edition will come in at a whopping 222 minutes in length, a total of 43 minutes added to the film (that's 24% more movie!). Nearly all of this new footage will consist of character scenes, including a good deal of Treebeard expansion and Huorns at Helms Deep." *** Insert Keanu-esque "...Whoa." (Speaking of which, sorry morG, sounds like Matrix sequel ain't gettin the trailer. And I cringingly agree with TOC that the most likely candidate in the coming months would be "Dumb and Dumberer" >gulp<) Now then, raises the question. Exactly how much of a schism between the T2T SEV and the theatrical release will Huorns create? Like I said before, I was expecting them to be revealed in the ROTK "opener" like the Gandy-Balrog plummet was in T2T. BUT, that seems to no longer be the case. What this definitely reinforces for is, that they're giving us TWO distinctly different movies. And, they really shouldn't be mixed and matched. Kinda what was on my mind back when I asked if anyone watches the theatrical FOTR anymore. Because, IMO (be it ever so H *cough*), the FOTR SEV is NOT part 1 of the T2T theatrical movie. Okay, getting on a whole different (special extended!) conversation I actually won't have time to follow up on, but the upshot is, next time you watch T2T, whether in the theater or the August DVD, precede it with watching purely the (*cough* 13-Oscar nominated, 4-Oscar winning, BAFTA, AFI, etc. etc. winning, viewed by YOU uncounted dozens of time before November 2002 *cough* *cough*) theatrical FOTR DVD, forgetting all the "new bits" from the SEV (that, going by comments in past TEs, is just as far from "perfect" as the original--just has "more") and just re-experience what we all gibbered on about for those first 11 months... Watch the theatrical FOTR and the (*cough* *cough* 6 Oscar nominated, 2 Oscar winning blah blah blah...) theatrical T2T and I wonder if some (not claiming all) of the complaints about T2T might ebb for you. Because going from the FOTR SEV to the theatrical DVD is switching between two different movies halfway through (or a third of the way, techinically...), and that might be why the pace and tone of T2T seemed like such a change-up to some. Watch your one-disc FOTR! I Swear On My Pointed Head that I don't expect to put the FOTR SEV in my divida player again until THIS NOVEMBER, when I can watch the next part of IT. Like I told a friend who was waffling about picking up the SEV last year (having already gotten the first release), the SEV is SO worth having, because AND but in so many ways it's a completely different movie. And there'll be days in the future when I'll want to watch the 9-10 hour LOTR and days when I'll want to really hunker down for the 11-12 hour LOTR. But they ARE two different LOTRS, and I don't really have a favorite (yet *cough*) *** Um, okay, rant over dammit. Yeesh, wasn't expecting that! Anyway... Huorns at Helms Deep? Really? :~)
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...I really should do something about that *cough* ;~)
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Sorry, Pallando, but short of trying to read the whole magazine (and my attention span wavers), I couldn't find the reference - other than the paragraph I already mentioned about the 43 minutes, and the confirmation of extra Merry and Pippin. Maybe Elanor can help when hers comes. And you/we have already read that the additions will include the Ent Draught and also a bit where Merry and Pippin are trying to be polite and stay awake as Treebeard recites bad poetry. ***Found a link yesterday (and probably can't trace it) suggesting that some of the choppy editing in the Frodo and Sam scenes was due to increasing pressure from the studio to remove some of the physical contact, actually cutting it back from the level of the first film, which was more in keeping with Tolkien - but not, apparently, with studio paranoia about What People Might Think. Now, I hope myself that some of the missing bits (shining Frodo, for example, which we know was shot) are just waiting for the SEV, but I certainly did notice - without any prompting - that in the quiet scene in the cave, Sam seems to be reaching for Frodo's shoulder in a consoling kind of way, and then Faramir bursts in, and they are not even sitting in the same relation to each other, but are reversed and nothing like touching. Something's missing there, for whatever reason. It could just be bad continuity, but I, too, miss the contact. 'Course, if it's a trade off so we can have it back in ROTK, then by all means, save it up for when it's needed most.
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What's he got? Haikus? Limericks? ;~D (And in Old Entish? Good grief!)
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*hoom hoom toom haroom * special extended version* now THAT'S a big branch*
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Would the "bad Ent poetry" have anything to do with the tale of the Entwives? Because that's the scene I miss most from TTT. Speaking of *extended versions* I hope they somehow reference the Ent Draughts in ROTK in order to explain Merry & Pippin's growth spurt! Otherwise they'll end up with an awkward product placement type scene like the Sam & Frodo Lembas scene. GIMLI: "Ach! You two are now as tall as a dwarf!" MERRY & PIPPIN look at each other, then simultaneously turn to the camera: "Ent draughts! Great taste! More filling!"
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P: "Gdeet teeste!" M: "Moor fillin', Pip." P: "Aye! 'At tehw!"
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Does anyone think those giant plastic leaves would keep anything fresh? Especially when they don't bother to tuck in the corners. No wonder Frodo looks like he's chewing hardtack.
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I think you're absolutely on the money about the difference between the theatrical versions and the SEVs. I always found the pacing of the theatrical version and some of the editing choices a bit strange, and also in the theatrical version the character work in the FOTR SEV that went on with Gimli, Legolas, Merry and Pippin (and also Bilbo) simply isn't there. I mean, I loved the theatrical version when it was all I had, and even a dimebag of PJ's LOTR is better than nothing, but still, I think the theatrical TTT suffers in comparison to FOTR's SEV, not the FOTR theatrical version. I don't know if I'd describe them as completely different arcs though. Also, I don't know if people angsting about the physical closeness of Frodo/Sam would be sufficient to cut it out of the TTT movie - I mean, it didn't hurt the first movie any. And the final act of Frodo vs. the Nazgul ("Don't you know your Sam?") and the discussion about stories (during which a gay friend remarked "Oh, why don't they just *snog*, already?") is hardly the stuff of your standard "Die Hard" type alpha male action hero thingummy-jig. Basically, if you're the kind of person that sees the religious devotion and love between Frodo and Sam as simply sexual then LOTR as a whole probably isn't going to be for you. However, rather in the face of Hollywood logic, a surprising number of people seem to be finding that it *is* for them. The rumour sounds like a kind of fan "holy grail" to me, rather like all of the "R-rated" graphic violence supposedly filmed during the first one. "There was more and better, but it was cut by the forces of evil." There are lots of weird positioning issues and reversals in TTT, probably an inevitable consequence of such a huge sprawling shoot and so much footage. But I could stand to be corrected, particularly if I got a shining Frodo in return. I await the SEV with bated breath.
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An excellent painting of this can be found on pp. 168-169 of 'The Art of T2T.' ***So ya roll through town and don't even say HELLO!?! Bah! I'm sure walrus makes good gator bait. ***Yesterday's weekly Wednesday countdown occured at The Art of T2T tb, where I posed the following anal/compulsive question: In November, 2004, as we struggle to free the LotR:RotK SEV DVD from it's dreaded plastic wrap, how are you going to arrange your LotR DVDs? Will it be A) FotR, T2T & RotK theatricals / FotR, T2T & RotK SEV's; B) FotR theatrical & SEV, T2T theatrical & SEV, RotK theatrical & SEV; C) any old hodgepodge way. ***Is the Duffy from the second report 'our' Dufy?
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Apr 10, 2003 8:52:39 PM CDT
Yay! Huorns! Curse the spy who got the Matrix Reloaded thingy wr
by morgoth
OK, OK
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As was Prophesized in the Lay of Harryluvatar, Club Angband would be rebuilt after The (shudder) Banning. Yes, the Foundation of Adamant is based on the officially documented posting handle of morGoth. Lo! it is rebuilt with a wonderful New Addition just for all the Tailender Ladies. Yes, The Swoon Den is soon to be launched on an unsuspecting AICN! Imagine wemming mellyn, Hobbit, Eldar, Dwarvish and even Filthy Tark waiters wearing NOTHING but puffy sleeved white shirts buttoned at one, and only one, discreet location serving your every whim and need while you luxuriate in scented baths! Don
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I meant "..found IN one of those volumes." Phew! Gatta lay off that GBABB! ** Hey! This makes a Trilogy of Post! Whoo hoo!
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Apr 10, 2003 10:09:32 PM CDT
Why is it so much more difficult making horrible quasi-homophone
by pallando blue
So, HalasNThunderpants, I will make do with what I can. Just wanted to jump in to say, I oughta clarify my Version Statement by adding that the subject line to my review I gave my waffling friend was, I swear, "It Woulda Tanked At The Box Office." Meanin', I really think they have it on the money so far as to what works well on the Big Screen vs. the Small. If the SEV was released in December 2001, I honestly think it would have been, to the vast majority, the overinflated overhyped too-long exposition-laden niche-market way-too-self-important "just another big budget gamble for my wallet" flick that everyone in November 2001 was deathly afraid it mighta been. (I do NOT ascribe any of those adjectives to the SEV DVD! Just reporting my retroactive predictions is all!) Would have made some profit, but, I really do think, the SEV is NOT conducive to initial theatrical release. Remember, ALL of us (and most people on this planet) watched the SEV being already deeply familiar with the movie. It had already won its manic fan base [Hi! (waving maniacally) Howarya!] and was swelling the well-read Tolkien numbers with those who'd have never have read the book otherwise. And we were, almost entirely, watching the SEV on the small screen, at someone's home, with a small group, if not solo. Folx can talk and comment or zip to the bathroom or NOT have someone zipping to the bathroom over their lap or pause it OR PAUSE IT crikey or consciously or not compare it to what they saw in the theater last year or put their feet up or finally not have to worry about farting in front of her or REALLY try not to fart in front of her cause it's her favorite movie and the SEV DVD got you into her place FINALLY for chrissa... um. A comPLETEly different state of mind than that first time the house lights dimmed, then you dissolved with a few hundred others for three hours, then the house lights came up and left you blinking, and a little shaky. That First Time. That, in some ways, every time you bought another ticket you managed to reexperience--every time. *** I want to really emphasize that I am NOT slaggin on the SEV at all, I think it is incredible so far, I LOVE the FOTR SEV and I am ETERNALLY grateful that they are even bothering to put so much thought and love and sweat into such an unprecedented and uncalled for endeavor as the SEVs are. All I'm tryng to emphasisize is, that while the theatrical FOTR might not shake up to the FOTR SEV at home on DVD, we shouldn't forget that our affection for the SEV is heavily based on our love of and familiarity with the theatrical version we immersed ourselves into for 11 months, and we really don't have a fair comparison between the two As Films without the experience of seeing the SEV on the big screen as our first experience. And hence (I was due for a hence at this point), okay maybe hence sucks (a couple beers is NO excuse to say "hence")... Fucking happy hour. Right. Okay--regroup! Something about using the home experience of the SEV, as an enhanced experienced of the beloved original FOTR, as a false set-up as to what was to be expected from the Theater Experience of watching The Two Towers for The First Time (title caps goin' all over buh buh buuuuh!). ...Which, going against every single Tolkien-PJ-crack-whore gene in my genome, would suggest that the SEVs should NOT have been released until after all three movies have left the theaters (Jeezum Krisface I AM drunk!), because ultimately and artisitcally the theatrical edits are being given quite the disservice by alternate cuts of their preceding chapters being delivered to the viewer in a context so far removed from the storytelling form's core intentions (a darkened theater and a group experience--NOT a book's fan base watching their favorite fantasy) ...not because of any superiority of the SEV as a FILM but ironically from the editors' skill and adroit- and adeptness as to what is effective and satisfying as a pure THEATER experience versus a HOME Theater Experience. On my home system, yep, the SEV is actually the more satisfying experience than the theatrical DVD watched at home, having been crafted for that context, and the theatrical version (like just about all DVDs of great movies) has much of its worth and value in its sensory recall of the theatrical experience. Without that (like, for me, with Citizen Kane, for example) (No! The Third Man! My Favorite B&W!) the experience is, to be sure, a diminished thing, and closer to the academic unfortunately. **** Holy shit, this is why I only go online at work anymore. Pull the fucking plug! Oh Christ! Now I'm getting another beer! Shit! **** SO, perhaps the nub of my gist is that the theatrical release of the LOTR movies are (1) now at best a bittersweet experience because of the now-endless comparison between two parallel-produced but essentially distinct productions and (2) possibly a diminished experience theatrically as a result of one and then two years of such comparison. And, so, I'll watch either the 9-10 version or the 11-12 hour version. But I consider them distinctly separate endeavors of distinctly separate creative intent by their makers. ******** Holy Fucking Jesus Jumped Up Christ On A Broken Rubber Crutch with the ability to generate THIS level of babbling bullshit why the fuck HAVEN'T I cheated some institution out of a Masters. All my friends have! They say it's the BEST. ...All righty, back after the weekend. I swear, only weekday work-shirkin' posts from now on, and, as the drunks all say, "THIS time, I MEAN it!"
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Yes, they had the whole tower scene, Frodo lying back in Sam's arms and all, though it somehow ruined it (I mean, if having Sam and Frodo look the way they did hadn't ruined it anyway) by having Frodo voice Tolkien's description of him, telling Sam he felt like "a child at rest when night-fears are driven away by some loved voice or hand," etc. I think he might even have added the bit about wanting to just lie there forever, but maybe not. It's a little weird turning those lines into self-analysis, but at least R-B gave them full play. And I think if I had one question to ask PJ's main team at this point, it would be how closely the Tower scene plays to the book... or at least, the immediate post-rescue, because if there's ever a time to tell the general audience to "just get over it," it's then. ***Has anyone else ever thought how much more nurturing men were allowed to be in, say, '60s television than they are now? Watch Captain Kirk reach to cradle a crewman's injured hand, for example; it just looks instinctive with him, part of the whole command thing and why his crew loves him so much... now, it's an "issue" of one kind or another, if any guy touches another when he doesn't have to, especially with any kind of gentleness. ***I think they HAVE done a wonderful job, so far, with Frodo and Sam, and if they're missing the odd touch in TTT, the looks exchanged are compensation. However, I would like to see the gesture in the cave completed - or interrupted obviously, without Sam having switched sides!
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They may have used that line, but *damn*, *damn*, *damn* that movie sucked. It did. It *sucked*. I... I... (Runs off and cries) (Returns later). But I'd love to see the PJ take on it. That would own. Aww. Poor Sam and Frodo. They go through so much, for so little personal return, ultimately. And then Rankin-Fucking-Bass violate them in a nassty budget cartoon.
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That's precisely why I never availed myself of the M.S. Imagination's on-board Internet Cafe during my sojourn to the warmer climes. 'Cause, ya see, I was pretty much wasted the entire cruise, except during the Dead Marsh Snorkeling and Anduin Kayaking. But to respond to what I think may have been the point of your post: I generally agree that the Theatrical Cut and the SEV are two distinctly separate experiences, and that the FOTR SEV may have had a part in initial negative reactions to TTT. I actually thought of that beforehand and was lucky enough to catch a showing of the Theatrical FOTR on cable (I luvs ya, Starz) before seeing TTT the first time. But I don't feel that PJ should've held off on the SEV's, because I did have some problems with FOTR, nearly all of which were alleviated by the SEV. And it helped me when watching TTT and feeling that something was missing to know that an SEV was eventually on its way. I guess I sorta look on the SEV's as a touchstone to help me re-affirm my faith in PJ in times of doubt. Kinda like an extra-long rosary or something. When I find myself saying, "Where are these Wargs coming from?" or "Why has Aragorn suddenly taken up extreme sports?" or "Who is this ass who calls himself Faramir?" I just stop and think "Wait for the SEV. Ohm." *** Oh, and yeah, sorry about not stopping in Mofo, but I was only in Miami for about an hour on my way down to the dock. Although on our way back last Saturday I did end up sitting around for about four hours in a Mall a few miles away from Miami International, watching, of all things, Cast-Offs from Amurikun Idyll trying to stretch out there fifteen minutes. If only I hadn't spent all my money on frou-frou tropical drinks, I could've gotten a cab down to the beach or something! As to your question of where the DVDs go in between the nifty polystone Argonath Bookends: I have an unfortunate obsessive compulsive disorder that forces me to organize my media collections very strictly. I'm talking 470 CDs in alphabetical order by Artist, sub-categorized chronologically, cross-referenced by record company and ID'd by Library of Congress catalog number! Thus, I have reserved space on my DVD bookshelf to be arranged like so: 1. Statue of Isildur. 2. LOTR soundtracks (the only instance of CDs not being placed in their proper place in my CD bookshelf.) 3. Crappy Hildebrant Brothers Postcard series recieved last Christmas. 4. LOTR theatrical versions. 5. Nat'l Geo. Voyage to Middle Earth special and whatever other extra discs find their way into the SEV giftsets. 6. LOTR SEVs. My thinking here is that they'll all have faux-book cover artwork and will tie nicely into...7. The Silmarillion, The Unfinished Tales, The Hobbit, The Lord of the Rings books. 8. Statue of Elendil. 9. Wood-carved Profound Buddha (for balance, natch.)
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morGy - the answer to your Sooty Inquiry (I nearly wrote Sotty Inquiry - that Freudian Slipism is a helluva thing, isn't it?) is that they both dreamed of tidal waves. It's in the letters, and stuck in my head because I also used to dream of tidal waves destroying the world, or at least my bit of it. Very terrifying dreams, the most vivid I can remember having, and oddly enough also the beginning of my childhood unicorn fetish. Make of that what you will.
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Hmmmm... Very interesting, because I have, in my life, had two very powerful dreams of them - not realistic tsunamis, which are said to be black from all the debris they carry with them and sucking up the ocean floor. No, these were towering and amazing clear green, and in the most vivid, I had time to stand looking up at this awesome wall of water that was about to crush me, and thinking: no escaping death here, choice between terror and awe, so go for the awe and beauty of it... and then, fade to white. That would be a good end, especially because I was pretty sure it wasn't the end... though final as far as this world. So what are we tapping into here?
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That's always so embarrassing.
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Very, very good o Wonderful One! Yes, that
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If I can't start typing and proff reading any better than that...I'm gunna initiate a self Banning (shudder)!
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Check out www.bfi.org.uk/showing/imax/afterdark.html ***LotR:FotR and LotR:T2T on the BIG screen (although not an Imax presentation) together! Wonderlnd indeed!!!!!!!!! :~)
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...those Brit's get all the luck, yes? It just ain't fair is it? Grumble, I'm just still bummed that there's no place left showing TTT in my area. Pallando (see, told ya that was the last!), is there a draft house someplace in Alexandria still showing it?
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...at a quite decent cinema in South Austin - Westgate - but I'm not sure for how much longer. So get your asbestos drawered behind down here for a moot! Go to go do a little reading and get back to you about the latest "Stump the Vala" *** Dont mynd Fister, he ben smoaking and for a girt big bloak he kynd of gets easy stoaned. Namarie, Trubba Not. SM{;-0
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just dropping by to say hello. morGy my brain isn't working properly at the moment so I have no idea about your quiz. IS one of the dreamers, Tuor perhaps? Otherwise I've got no idea, and I can't stand arm wrestling myself, well not in public anyway... Cheers.
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Well, if the shared dream is a tidal wave then I'm gonna venture
a guess that it's Faramir and Eowyn? Although I don't actually remember it rightly. "Darkness inescapable?" is what comes to mind.***T2T is playing at two theatres in Manhattan, Miami. The firetrap AMC on 42nd Street and an East Village spot. Another friend who has not (astonishingly enough) seen it yet asked if I wanted to go back again (poor innocent thing, he thought this might be my third time or something!!!!!). So I checked out the AMC to see which theatre it was in. I feel very unsafe there above the third floor since it's a modern
restored/renovated spot with all sorts of idiotic angles and blind alleys, just ripe for a panicked-crowd disaster, (you know the kind, built with marketing in mind - they force you past the stores and food courts) but luckily my favorite movie was playing no higher than that. For the first time I took a seat close to the screen. My virgin buddy expressed a desire to sit there and who was I to disagree? I recommend it highly. I also wish to recommend Pallando's prescription for geek happiness: I watched the theatrical version on Sat AM. I can recommend that, too. It was marvelous, I nearly felt that I was seeing it fresh all over again. Coulda been because of the close seat, the prep and also that it's been nearly a month since my last viewing (March 16th). On the other hand, I have pretty much loved it every time I've seen it, and think back now on stuff that bothered me the first two viewings with a sort of, "what
was I thinking?" The Ents keep getting better and better for me and I am just amazed at the care that was taken to make each of them so distinctive. The shot of them marching across the clearcut
toward Isengard is now vying in my mind with Nazgul vs Frodo, and the charge of Gandalf & Eomer for the "please put it on a poster" shot. Also noted something thanks to a comment DoT made; for the first time I noticed the great difference between the Frodo/Sam scene when Sam suggests he put on the Ring to escape and the later moment when Faramir "shows his quality". It is a completely different set up. The lighting is very different. The "escape" scene begins with them sitting apart, leaning against barrels and in the cut when Faramir comes in, not only are their positions reversed (as DoT noted)but they are now sitting together on the blankets that they presumably slept on. (They look the same as the ones Frodo is roused from by Faramir to come see Gollum fishing in the pool). Anyway, it made me think for the first time that the barrel scene could have taken place earlier in their captivity and not related to Gollum's interrogation at all, and that the blanket scene might include Sam's reaction to Frodo coming back from helping Faramir trap Gollum. Whatever, I will remain hopeful that the SEV will give us more Frodo/Sam in capitivity and also I dare to hope for more discussion with Frodo/Faramir as well.***And finally I want to joyfully report that my fan mag came in Saturday's mail so I am going to totally geek out for the rest of today and read it cover to cover.***Happy Spring to all.
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